Gunfight At Rock Spring, Wy. In 1978, Featuring Bill Jordan

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Wyatt Burp

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How's that for a catchy thread title? Our own Iggy and a couple other forum members here will have great personal inputs on this. Here is an episode of City Confidential touting "the fastest gun in the west". Bill Jordan is a witness in the murder trial of lawman Ed Cantrell of Rock Springs Wyoming. Very controversial yet entertaining. I think it's been established here previously that Cantrell used a S&W Model 10 in this "gunfight" that involved only one shot. This show was one of my faves, and this episode specifically. Enjoy.

Rock Springs - Deadly Shootout in the Wild West - YouTube
 
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Thanks for posting, Wyatt.

I've been looking for this for some time and have been thinking about buying it on Amazon. Hopefully, this will stay up.

Thanks again!
 
Interesting show. From what Iggy said earlier about Cantrell, I suspect it was murder.

I was wondering why Jordan would support a guy like that in court and then realized he was likely called in as an expert (and paid) witness. That is some kinda fast though to be able to draw and shoot before another guy can pull the trigger on a gun he is holding on you...
 
Onomea said:
That is some kinda fast though to be able to draw and shoot before another guy can pull the trigger on a gun he is holding on you...
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I have never done it, but I hear it is entirely possible even for people not in law enforcement.
 
It all has to do with reaction time. That reaction time is roughly 1/2 to 3/4 of a second give or take. The person that is holding the gun has to react to someone drawing to shoot.

The person drawing knows when he is about to draw but the other person does not know this and has to react to the other person drawing his weapon.

I've never done this type of thing but would classify it as a "what do you have to lose?" scenario. It would not be the first choice but when things have deteriorated to that point, then it becomes a viable option.

This option might have been the first time someone ever said "don't try this at home".
 
Years ago my old chief who was a retired chicago cop worked with me one night on how to take a gun away if a guy has a gun on you in arms reach. You slap your hands together over the gun kind of off set. You end up with the gun! Soon I was able to get his gun before he could pull the trigger, and he, me! Granted it would be a desperation move, but it could save your life.
After practicing that move I never would draw and hold someone within arms reach! They might know it too! Basicly if your fast and smooth its possible to make your move before they can think to pull the trigger. Also you do it off set and slap the barrel of the gun down and away from you. Its done in a manner that could break his trigger finger if he doesnt let go. Done right, he cant hang on the gun and you end up with the gun in a good clubing position with it if you wanted to make a secound backwards swing catching him along the head with the butt. I admit a lot of things could go wrong however I also am willing to bet with not a lot of practice most people can learn the manuver if I can.
 
All I can say is...There are people you you don't want to get into a gun fight with....Ed Cantrell and Bill Jordan certainally were two on the list. The so-called undercover cop killed was not very admirable for many reasons.........Rock Springs in those days was quite a place...I will leave it at that.....
 
Is there a way you can turn down the background music in the video? I don't know if it's my age or what but lately in a lot of videos I can not hear the commentary over the background music. It annoys the heck out of me and I end up not watching the video.
Len
 
Not guilty

I remember following that fiasco.
There are more than one man who was brought in, like Mr. Cantrell was, to do a job nobody else could do (then get accused of a major crime when things got a little wet and sticky).
If Cantrell had wanted to murder that fellow, he wouldn't have shot him in a police car with two witnesses. Nobody can make me think for a minute that a coked up drunk wouldn't try to pull a gun on someone he was hot at.

Course I wasn't there for that one, so it's just speculation.
 
Those folks are all gone. We'll never know the truth. I can say with certainty that Ed wasn't even close to being as fast as Bill.

I use to teach LEO's in an officer survival course the same techniques feralmerril describes, but I never did try Bill's trick of drawing against a cocked gun.

I was never close to being in Bill's league and neither was Ed. Nobody had a prayer against Bill.
 
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Iggy said:
Those folks are all gone. We'll never know the truth. I can say with certainty that Ed wasn't even close to being as fast as Bill.

I use to teach LEO's in an officer survival course the same techniques feralmerril describes, but I never did try Bill's trick of drawing against a cocked gun.

I was never close to being in Bill's league and neither was Ed. Nobody had a prayer against Bill.
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From what I have seen of the late Bob Munden I would not want to bet on who would win that shoot out or demonstration.

Also I knew a fellow yeas back a 3 or forth degree black belt and I would not want him close to me at all if I had him at gun point. He was not a gun person but seeing him disarm people with knives and stage type guns, he moved like lighting.
 
Thanks for the link Wyatt. I think Iggy was right in an earlier thread about this guy. I wouldn't trust this man for nothing and I would not turn my back on him. He has the beady, cold eyes of a stone cold killer. I think he got away with it.

I know Iggy is right about not knowing the whole story since everyone is gone. What a story though.
 
NYlakesider said:
From what I have seen of the late Bob Munden I would not want to bet on who would win that shoot out or demonstration.

Also I knew a fellow yeas back a 3 or forth degree black belt and I would not want him close to me at all if I had him at gun point. He was not a gun person but seeing him disarm people with knives and stage type guns, he moved like lighting.
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Put a quarter on the back of your gun hand above your holstered gun. Draw and fire the gun and then retreive the quarter out of the bottom of the holster.

Put a life saver on the back of your gunhand at shoulder height, out in front of you, draw your gun and shoot the falling life saver before it hits the ground.

Ol Bill was fair to middlin' quick and accurate too.;)
 
Iggy said:
Put a quarter on the back of your gun hand above your holstered gun. Draw and fire the gun and then retreive the quarter out of the bottom of the holster.

Put a life saver on the back of your gunhand at shoulder height, out in front of you, draw your gun and shoot the falling life saver before it hits the ground.

Ol Bill was fair to middlin' quick and accurate too.;)
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Without a doubt they both were super special in the speed department. I still think it would have been real interesting to have a contest between the two when they were both in their prime.

I was not intending to demean Mr. Jordan as he is a hero of mine (I'm 67 and I really enjoyed reading what the old timers had to say, much better than the posers of today). I treasure a autographed copy of his famous book and read just about everything there was to read about him. I would think if both people I listed got in a real gun fight they would not be any winner. They both were that good.
 
I was not intending to demean Mr. Jordan as he is a hero of mine (I'm 67 and I really enjoyed reading what the old timers had to say, much better than the posers of today). I treasure a autographed copy of his famous book and read just about everything there was to read about him. I would think if both people I listed got in a real gun fight they would not be any winner. They both were that good. __________________

I sure din't take your post as negative. Spending an afternoon shooting with Ol Bill was one of the highlights of this ol geezer's life.

Spending an afternoon shooting with Ed was not.
 
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Iggy said:
Spending an afternoon shooting with Ol Bill was one of the highlights of this ol geezer's life.

Spending an afternoon shooting with Ed was not.
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I got the same impression from you in the earlier thread about this subject. I will admit to laughing when I read this post. You get right to the point with very few words. Well said.
 
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