legal registered automatic weapons used in crimes?

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Racer X

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Any member of law enforcement ever look this up out of curiosity?

I think I heard it was 2, and one of those had been stolen, so it wasn't the owner commiting the crime.

Looking for statistics for debating pro 2A issues.
 
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That's part of the argument FOR firearm registration - that registered weapons historically aren't used in crimes unless they are stolen from the owner. The absence of NFA weapons at crimes is seen as evidence of such.

The truth is that NFA registered weapons are too expensive to belong to the kinds of folks who usually commit violent crimes.
 
The Nevada “Blue Card” system of registering handguns in Clark (Las Vegas) and Washoe (Reno) counties is the perfect example of how gun registration does not work. During the entire time this system was in place from the mid 60s to about 2016, I am told that precisely one crime was solved by referring to the database.
 
Actually NFA weapons didn't get terribly expensive until the rules were changed under the The Firearm Owners Protection Act of 1986

The Act also contained a provision that banned the sale to civilians of machine guns manufactured after the date of enactment, restricting sales of these weapons to the military and law enforcement. Thus, in the ensuing years, the limited supply of these arms available to civilians has caused an enormous increase in their price, with most costing in excess of $10,000.

Interestingly during the 50+ year period following the first GCA in 1934, which created NFA classifications, ZERO crimes were committed using legally register fully auto guns.

I think price has little to do with that. The gun man in Vegas could have afforded a full auto yet didn't get one. Plus, in reality there are very few times when full auto is actually more effective than semi. Even the military has backed off on it to some degree.

My worst nightmare isn't someone with a machine gun or even a semi auto "assault" rifle. The thought of a nut job with a magazine fed semi auto shotgun with a buffered stock comes in 1st
 
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A lone voice in the wilderness, continuing to beat that dead horse . . .

We do have a "gun" problem . . . as well as an alcohol problem, as well as drug problem, as well as an infidelity problem, as well as we have a murder problem, as well as an organized crime problem, as well as a political corruption problem, as well as we have a lack of self control problem, a lack of respect for proper authority, civility, common sense, accountability . . . . you can deny, scoff, ridicule, curse the Almighty and shake your fist at the sky . . .

Doesn't change the root cause or the solution; the world at large will not acknowledge we live in a fallen system which is dying more each hour to an inevitable conclusion. The Truth can be known and though it could turn things around and do away with these problems that pesky problem of free will and a fallen human nature stands in the way - and that is our choice.

Not to derail the discussion and my apologies to the O.P., but misuse/availability/existence of machine guns a.k.a. 'automatic weapons' is one of the least of our problems. But the hand-wringers and Chicken Littles must have their cause de jour to distract them from the hard reality. It is actually quite easy to be so heavenly minded that we are no earthly good.
 
My state of Maryland provides a great example of why licensing requirements don't work.

Back in 2013, the Maryland General Assembly passed a bill creating a "Handgun Qualification License" (HQL), which anyone now needs as a prerequisite for purchasing a handgun. The HQL is not a carry permit; it merely allows the holder to make a purchase.

In order to get an HQL, the applicant must undergo training, be fingerprinted (at his own expense, usually $50 or more), and pay a $50 fee to the state. The HQL is valid for 10 years. There are some exemptions from the training requirement, but not from needing an HQL.

The vast majority of violent crime in this state occurs in the City of Baltimore, and in Prince George's County, which borders Washington, D.C. The suspects are usually unqualified to own handguns, by virtue of their age or status as convicted criminals...they do not hold HQLs.

All Maryland did was inconvenience law abiding citizens, without affecting crime in the slightest.

Handgun Qualification License
 
NFrameFred said:
A lone voice in the wilderness, continuing to beat that dead horse . . .

We do have a "gun" problem . . . as well as an alcohol problem, as well as drug problem, as well as an infidelity problem, as well as we have a murder problem, as well as an organized crime problem, as well as a political corruption problem, as well as we have a lack of self control problem, a lack of respect for proper authority, civility, common sense, accountability . . . . you can deny, scoff, ridicule, curse the Almighty and shake your fist at the sky . . . .
Click to expand...

We have a strong cultural disrespect for the law and for authority here in the United States. Part of that is baked into our national DNA, but I think it's gotten much more pronounced in recent decades, and frankly, it's very destructive. How can we maintain an organized and ordered society if we refuse to accept that there are rules we must obey, or if we insist that those rules apply only to others?

"You can't make me do that!" is our national mantra. It infects and affects our entire land, every demographic, every age group, to one degree or another. It manifests itself every single day, in many different ways, from the urban youth who commits a carjacking to the suburbanite who routinely runs stop signs and red lights, to the science denier who ridicules and resists measures intended to curb the spread of a deadly disease. All across our nation, we reject the idea out-of-hand that anybody has the right to tell us what to do...and that does not bode well for our future.

It's interesting, from an academic standpoint, to watch a once-great nation disintegrate from within...but it isn't much fun to live through it... :(
 
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biku324 said:
Here's the data I think the OP wanted - four cases out of 638,000 NFA firearms, and those 4 may have been misreported. Just a moment...
Click to expand...

absolutely perfect. I knew that of the several I barely recalled, law enforcement weapons were involved. 3 were stolen out of police vehicles here during the CHOP riots in Seattle, but were retreived by a former Marine doing security for a news crew.
 
ImprovedModel56Fan said:
In other words, the law worked as intended.
Click to expand...

Yes, that's precisely right, as a matter fact.

Those of us who waited hours to testify against this legislation pointed out over and over again that it would have no effect on crime, but that wasn't the point: it was about making a statement about guns in the aftermath of the Sandy Hook massacre, which had occurred just a few months previously.

Maryland's elected officials constantly complain about "gun crime," even as they refuse to pass legislation increasing penalties for using guns illegally. It makes perfect sense if you blame guns for crime. It also makes perfect sense if you are a Baltimore City or Prince George's County legislator (most Maryland crime occurs in those jurisdictions) and are desperate not to put the sons and grandsons of your most vocal constituents in jail...
 
Suppressors were illegal in this state yet to my knowledge no one was ever convicted of using one. I was told the only time you would get into trouble with a suppressor was if you used it in a felony, same with a switchblade...it just adds fifteen years onto your sentence. There were guys that went out of their way using suppressors at gun ranges, etc. Cops would come over and say, "Thats pretty sweet, can I try it?" They are legal now, although no magazine over 10 rounds is...The whole tax stamp thing is just a big money grab...where does the money go? Where does the money go when hundreds of thousands of dollars are collected by any agency....it has to be in the millions, like after a big drug bust? Pallets of money...Oh yeah I forgot, they burn it.
 
I was told that there have been two crimes committed by registered and legally owned machineguns. One was a Class 3 dealer who got into a violent verbal argument with with his wife. Apparently she had a mouth that wouldn't stop. He brandished a HK33 Dealer Sample telling her to shut her mouth. Her last words were, "You can't make me shut up." In my collection I have test-fired cartridge cases from that HK33.


The second was a Federally licensed manufacturer of silencers. He had a 9mm MAC10 that he used to demonstrate his silencers. He woke up one morning with the paranoid delusion that "people" were trying to steal his guns. He drove to an isolated place in the mountains where he saw two people minding their own business. He sprayed them with his MAC10. killing one and wounding the other. This started my theory of spontaneous insanity.

A stolen machinegun may be registered, but it is not legally owned and in violation of the 1934 NFA.
 
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