Which revolver should I purchase for CCW? I’m stuck. Advice/Experience/Opinions?

First off, I'm probably at least a little biased since I rely on a 642 every day for my self defense gun.

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Agreed. I have a Model 32 in .38 S&W but it has a hammer and a hammerless gun in pocket carry mode is far easier. My 638 would work but I put wood banana-type stocks on it and it loses a lot in concealability - I keep it in my car. I have a 649, too, which I love, but it's so much heavier than the 642 I just don't carry it.

It sounds like you're willing to put in the range time to get reasonably proficient w/these little guns. That said I'd go for the 442/642 and spend the extra money on ammo & range time. I'll surrender my "man-card" by admitting that a J frame .357 is too difficult for me to get accurate follow up shots with.

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Ditto.

Defensive shooting is going to be real close and personal. You don't need a 50 yard target gun.

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Ditto.

You don't even need a 25 yard gun as a general rule. And these little guns are fully extended for accurate shooting at such distances (Jerry Miculek and the late Bob Munden aside).

Despite contrary comments from some of our fellow posters in prior threads, and I won't argue with my friends when they say that they can do this, etc., you will NOT enjoy shooting your little revolver with full house .357 Magnum rounds, you WILL have difficulty in follow up shots, and you will most assuredly have difficulty with accurate follow up shots.

One additional thought - I am writing this on the assumption that you plan to pocket carry your revolver. If you plan on belt carry, especially OWB, then the 640, as shown above, the 649 (I'd never mind carrying that OWB) and, more importantly, a snubby K-frame if you can obtain one - if you can conceal a J frame on your belt then you can conceal a 2" K-frame on your belt - all will work well on a belt and the weight is less important than in your pocket.

Sidebar - there's no way I'd carry a Glock, either, but, clearly, YMMV applies and the LEO community seems to like them, for whatever reasons....as do millions of private citizens. I think of them as a concession to the progress of cheap, plastic goods that predominates all over the world. Might be good stuff but, still, it's plastic. Ick.

ContinentalOp said:

First off, I'm probably at least a little biased since I rely on a 642 every day for my self defense gun.

Of the models you listed, I would choose the 642-1 (no internal lock).

It's more versatile than the SP101 in terms of carrying. The SP101 is basically a belt or possibly a shoulder holster gun whereas the 642 can be carried IWB/OWB in a belt holster, pocket holster, ankle holster, shoulder holster, belly band, fanny pack, etc.

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Is the SP101 a poor choice for a IWB gun?

While the 340 offers a better front sight and the option for .357 Magnum for me the extra cost isn't worth it. I wouldn't shoot .357 Magnum in it if I had one.

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Can you elaborate a little? What is the reason you would not shoot .357 Magnum? Comfort? Or, are you concerned about it damaging such a small, light weight gun?

You didn't say if this would be your first gun or just your first CCW gun. If it was going to be your first gun I'd probably suggest the Ruger SP101 as it would probably be easier to learn the fundamentals and develop proficiency on the Ruger than an airweight J-frame.

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This would be just my first CCW gun.

Knowing what I know now, especially that I do a lot of dry fire practice and belt carry, if I were to start from scratch I would probably choose the DAO Ruger SP101 if I couldn't find a 640 or 649 that met my needs. But I still think the 642-1 is the most versatile choice.

I would also suggest looking at a 640 with no lock. It'd be a little lighter and more compact than the Ruger, but still offer more weight than the lightweight J-frames you're considering.

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The key is if I can find one... How common is a good quality used (or NIB) 640? This is the second time it has come up in this thread, and I already felt that it would be ideal before I posted...

RSanch111 said:

Any Smith and Wesson J-Frame with no hammer or a shrouded hammer. Lightweight or all steel is up to you. I prefer the heavier ones.

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Thanks for the response! Do you have any recommendations on how to find an all steel version of any of the following models? Do they even make them anymore? As far as I know, they do not--at least, according to their website...

640 (without internal lock)
642 (without internal lock)
442 (without internal lock)

My experience with the 640 Centennial. Mine has the internal lock. If I didn't keep reading on the 'net about the lock, I would forget my gun had one. I think it is a non-issue. YMMV

I have shot exactly 5 rds. of .38's thru the gun, the other 5-6,000 rds. have been full house .357 loads. Yeah, it took some getting used to, gotta grip 'em high, and my hand lets me know that I shot the Stub. It isn't painful, but is a handful to control. I enjoy shooting it. Usually do 50 rds. a session, occasionally 100!

My point is, don't let the lock be an issue. If you don't like it, don't use it. I equate the stories of the gun locking up with stories of somebodies brakes going out on their car. It happens, but not to very many people, and not very often.

My gun has been 100% reliable since the day I bought it.

The 640 is a good little gun and one of the better J frames. (at least to me.)

Here's a check list for revolvers, there are some videos on youtube as well if you are like me and understand better if you see it.
A Revolver-Buyer?s Checklist | The Sixgun Journal

An SP101 is normally a good IWB gun (I prefer revolvers for IWB do to them being more curvy.) for most people, but if you aren't used to IWB carry it can feel weird. Also your pants need to be bigger than what you normally wear.

As for a good place to look for a revolver set up that's not made is the classifieds on here. Just check out the revolver before you transfer it at your FFL or if you are meeting FTF check before you buy.

For me it's the 442. Usually owb but sometimes it rides in my pocket.

Freedom1st said:

Thanks for the input, Daniel W. I especially value your opinion since you say you've owned these guns I'm considering.

At first, I was leaning toward the 642, but the finish issue kind of turned me off. Is it so hard to put a good finish on these? I know the issue is primarily cosmetic, but still... Personally, the increased need to maintain the 442 doesn't bother me very much. I also like the black finish of the 442. It seems to me that it would conceal a little better because of that. I usually wear darker clothing, so anything grey/silver could show up a lot more if I were to reach for something on a high shelf, etc.

Taking into account the fact that I have no experience carrying yet, I am inclined toward IWB carry as opposed to belt or pocket carry... But, I could certainly change my perspective with a little experience under my belt. (Pun intended.)

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I agree S&W should be able to put a better finish on these guns. Some high quality anodizing would be just the ticket. I actually do prefer the black frame finish of the 442. It seems more durable and there's lots of products to touch it up if need be S&W did release a run of two tone 442's that had the black frame with a stainless cylinder and barrel with a chrome plated trigger and sideplate screws. I owned one of those as well, but it had the internal lock and I just never really felt I could trust it as a carry gun.
An all Black 642 would be nice or a two tone 642 with a black frame without the lock would also be at the top of my list. A 340 M&P with a blade sight at a reasonable price would also be very nice. Some say the 442 Pro moonclip is all blackened stainless steel, but I have contacted S&W customer service trying to verify and get a different answer every time. I've even corresponded with the head of performance center and even Paul Pluff(S&W marketing president) and never can get a definitive answer.

prplbkrr said:

My experience with the 640 Centennial. Mine has the internal lock. If I didn't keep reading on the 'net about the lock, I would forget my gun had one. I think it is a non-issue. YMMV

I have shot exactly 5 rds. of .38's thru the gun, the other 5-6,000 rds. have been full house .357 loads. Yeah, it took some getting used to, gotta grip 'em high, and my hand lets me know that I shot the Stub. It isn't painful, but is a handful to control. I enjoy shooting it. Usually do 50 rds. a session, occasionally 100!

My point is, don't let the lock be an issue. If you don't like it, don't use it. I equate the stories of the gun locking up with stories of somebodies brakes going out on their car. It happens, but not to very many people, and not very often.

My gun has been 100% reliable since the day I bought it.

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Thanks for the input! It sounds like you've had a great experience with that 640.

Be careful of sliding into analysis paralysis.

642 and .38+p. Reasonable weight. Effective cartridge.

Also, if you are ever in the position where you actually have to use your CCW, the police will most likely take it. You may or may not get it back. Evidence lockers are not padded gun cases, expect scratches. I wouldn't invest a lot of money into a CCW, just enough that I have a reliable firearm.

If you're set on a snubby, then I'd get a S&W 638. The hammer won't snag, but you'll still have the option to shoot in single action.



That being said, from your list I'd get the 642 or 442.

I have a question that no one else has asked yet. How much experience do you have firing handguns ? A J frame gun is small and lightweight, so it's easy to carry. BUT, they're also not really a good gun for a beginner in the handgun world to start with.They have a VERY short sight radius, and therefore can be a challenge to master.

That question aside, the next is " How do you plan on carrying said handgun" ? Pocket carry ? IWB/OWB ? That makes a BIG difference on what you will be comfortable with all day long. I suggest a good holster and a good belt for anyone that asks about carrying concealed. By good belt, I mean a gun belt. Not your average dress belt. It will make a world of difference in how the holster sits against you, and how comfortable it is, as well as how easy it is to get to the gun when you need it. If pocket carry is your plan, a good pocket holster is required to keep the gun where you want it , and a gunbelt is not necessary, but it does help keep your pants where they belong better than a dress belt with the extra weight .

Everyone seems to have different opinions about the locks, but in my experience, it is a non issue. I have and carry a 642-2 with the lock, and have never once had an issue with it.

If you think in the future that you may decide to sell this gun, you may want to look at something in 357. They cost a bit more initially,but seem to sell better and hold value better than a 38 equivalent.

Some people have an issue with 357 in such a small package as a J frame. Others don't seem to have that. I would suggest that , if you can, find someplace in your area that lets you take some small frame guns for a test drive. Shoot some 38, 38+P, and 357 out of them and see what feels good to you. Try some other guns as well. Anything that feels good in your hands will generally point well for you, but holding it and shooting it are totally different. Sorry for the long post guys. Trying to meander my way through all the questions and thoughts for someone new to the concealed carry mindset.

J-frames or any lightweight snub don't make very good range guns, but they are a great civilian self-defense weapon, even for beginners. Shooting and self-defense are two very different things. While directed toward women, most of the tactical and practical points in Mas' article apply to anyone WILSON DEFENSE JOURNAL: The real ladies gun by Massad Ayoob

The lightweight snub is a versatile concealed carry choice and is well suited to about any carry method. No reason to be limited to any type in particular and I imagine the OP will find himself mixing it up depending on wardrobe and climate.

Someone earlier mentioned the k frame snub. I have two, a Model 10-5 and a pre Model 10. They shoot very well for me out to 25 yards, unlike my Model 36 Chiefs Special which for me has to be a close quarters gun.
S&W made millions of Model 10s so they're easier to find out there and less expensive when you do find them. My pre Model 10 cost me less than two hundred dollars; it doesn't look like much, but as I mentioned, I shoot it very well.
George

Freedom1st said:

Is the SP101 a poor choice for a IWB gun?

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That was probably a misunderstanding on my part. When I said "belt gun" I meant either OWB or IWB in a belt-mounted holster. The only concern with the SP101 is it is a little bulkier than J-frames so, depending on your body type and holster choice, it may be slightly less comfortable to carry than a J-frame. However, I've carried steel K-frames IWB so it's not an issue for me. I wouldn't have any problem carrying a SP101 IWB so long as I had a good belt/holster combo.

Freedom1st said:

Can you elaborate a little? What is the reason you would not shoot .357 Magnum? Comfort? Or, are you concerned about it damaging such a small, light weight gun?

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Shooting .357 Magnum loads in a 340 won't damage it. It may accelerate wear more than shooting .38 Special +Ps and there is the possibility of bullet pull in some loads, but I don't see it causing any damage.

For me it's a combination of shooting comfort and controllability. I can't imagine wanting to practice much with full-power loads. I feel that .38 Special +P in my 642 is about the most I can comfortably deal with, and I usually limit myself to 20-25 rounds of +P at each range session. Some people enjoy shooting hard-kicking guns, but I'm not one of them.

More important to me is controllability. You want to be able to get quick, accurate shots. In such a small, lightweight gun I don't see the power advantage of full-power .357 Magnum's outweighing the controllability of .38 Special +P.

Mid-range .357 Magnum loads would be more controllable and more comfortable to shoot, but I'm not convinced they offer much, if any, advantage over .38 Special +P loads in the same bullet weight.

Freedom1st said:

This would be just my first CCW gun.

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So you've got some experience shooting handguns. That helps. A lot of people will recommend a larger, heavier gun for a first-timer, but sometimes I think they neglect the economics of it. If I'm only getting a gun to carry, and I can only afford one gun right now, I want something that I will actually carry on a regular basis. If I buy the bigger, heavier gun I may have an easier time learning how to shoot it but it may be more likely to be left at home so it kind of defeats the purpose.

I agree that the bigger, heavier gun is easier to shoot and if that's an option it's probably a better choice, but it's probably more pragmatic to get something you are likely to actually carry now and maybe down the line invest in something more suitable for range practice to improve your proficiency. Beginners can definitely learn on an airweight J-frame, especially if self-defense is the purpose (you don't need to be able to make single, ragged-hole groups at 25 yards to defend yourself with a gun). It will require more effort. On the negative side, you also run the risk of ingraining bad habits like flinching or dropping shots, so that's something that should also be kept in mind. I do a lot of dry fire practice and I think that helps. I also do most of my shooting with lighter target loads and use +P sparingly at the range. Then again, a lightweight snub was not the first gun I've owned or been trained on. My first gun was a Beretta 92FS and my first revolver was a S&W Model 10.

Freedom1st said:

The key is if I can find one... How common is a good quality used (or NIB) 640? This is the second time it has come up in this thread, and I already felt that it would be ideal before I posted...

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For a long time now my "grail gun" has been a no-dash 640 (the standard .38 Special, no-lock version), with a DAO no-lock .38 Special 649 being a close second. I have seen the 640 come up from time to time, but usually it's either outside my budget at the time or it was on an auction site and I ended up getting outbid. I've seen a DAO 649 once, and it was outside my budget. But as I mentioned earlier, it might be better to get the 642-1, or 442-1 if that's your preference, now and just keep an eye out for the 640.

Unless, of course, you decide to go with the Ruger.

All the guns you listed are good choices for a CCW gun, so it's just which one you prefer. As I said before, I do think the 642/442 is probably the most versatile and cost-effective choice, but ultimately it's up to you.

spad124 said:

Be careful of sliding into analysis paralysis.

642 and .38+p. Reasonable weight. Effective cartridge.

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spad124, thanks for the reminder. I came to this forum because I was already in "analysis paralysis"! Your level-headed post is appreciated. I probably over-research my options, but, when on a budget, I'd rather be safe than sorry.

Also, if you are ever in the position where you actually have to use your CCW, the police will most likely take it. You may or may not get it back. Evidence lockers are not padded gun cases, expect scratches. I wouldn't invest a lot of money into a CCW, just enough that I have a reliable firearm.

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This is definitely something to consider... God forbid that I'd ever have to actually use my CCW. It would add insult to injury to lose a high-dollar piece, though! Thanks for the thought food.

I see a lot of mentions on this thread about the 640. I've owned a couple of those over the years as well and they are great guns. Only reason I don't have them anymore is they had the lock. Perhaps a bit heavy for pocket carry and the barrel a tad longer, but doable although I think it makes a better compact belt gun. They are nice in the fact you don't have to worry about the finish, they are more shootable and they are a viable platform to launch some serious magnums rounds from although still a tad light for me in terms of controllability and fast follow up shots. The extra weight and feel of solid steel does add a little confidence when drawing the gun in a real defense scenario and could make for a more effective close quarter impact weapon should a specific situation get that bad. And it's the only quality solid steel DAO snub that has an enclosed hammer which offers so many carry, shooting and ECQ advantages unlike the spurless hammer DAO model of the ruger SP101. It's really unfortunate S&W doesn't release the standard 640 without the lock. If they did, I would buy a couple. There is the Pro and the engraved model, but I have no desire to pay all that extra money for additions I don't want and view more as a hindrance than advantage. The lock is especially ridiculous on the centennial framed models since you can't visually see the status of the lock.

Another vote for the 640. I bought this one used, since it's a .38 no signs of abuse. I can load any effective .38 commercial cartridge and the few extra ounces over the 642 seem worth the trouble. I'd carry it more but the 6906 has 21 years of good juju in it and I don't mess with it. Joe

F75gunslinger said:

I have a question that no one else has asked yet. How much experience do you have firing handguns ? A J frame gun is small and lightweight, so it's easy to carry. BUT, they're also not really a good gun for a beginner in the handgun world to start with.They have a VERY short sight radius, and therefore can be a challenge to master.

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I acquired my first handgun 3 years ago, so I have some limited experience. I do lots of reading, so that combined with my limited experience has made me fairly comfortable with handguns. I am aware of the challenge such a small gun presents; however, my reason for wanting to get a J frame is for self defense primarily. Theoretically, if I learn to shoot well on such a small handgun, the bigger handguns should come easier, right? I am willing to put in the necessary time it takes to shoot well with a J frame.

That question aside, the next is " How do you plan on carrying said handgun" ? Pocket carry ? IWB/OWB ? That makes a BIG difference on what you will be comfortable with all day long. I suggest a good holster and a good belt for anyone that asks about carrying concealed. By good belt, I mean a gun belt. Not your average dress belt. It will make a world of difference in how the holster sits against you, and how comfortable it is, as well as how easy it is to get to the gun when you need it. If pocket carry is your plan, a good pocket holster is required to keep the gun where you want it , and a gunbelt is not necessary, but it does help keep your pants where they belong better than a dress belt with the extra weight.

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Having never carried before, I don't know what I will prefer most, but I am initially interested in trying IWB carry. It seems like it will fit my situation the best by balancing accessibility with concealment.

Sorry for the long post guys. Trying to meander my way through all the questions and thoughts for someone new to the concealed carry mindset.

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Don't apologize. Your perspective is welcome. The more "meandering" the better! Cheers.

Daniel W. said:

J-frames or any lightweight snub don't make very good range guns, but they are a great civilian self-defense weapon, even for beginners. Shooting and self-defense are two very different things.

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These were my thoughts, as well.

While directed toward women, most of the tactical and practical points in Mas' article apply to anyone WILSON DEFENSE JOURNAL: The real ladies gun by Massad Ayoob

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Thanks for the article--a good read!

The lightweight snub is a versatile concealed carry choice and is well suited to about any carry method. No reason to be limited to any type in particular and I imagine the OP will find himself mixing it up depending on wardrobe and climate.

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I imagine you're correct.

Please let me add my recommendations for the 640 models. They are my hands down favorite EDC's. I primarily carry a 640-1 in a XC Slim IWB made by TTGunleather. I carry +P 38 Special ammo in it. It just carries well, handles well, and shoots very well. For me the additional weight of the SS frame and the slightly longer barrel provide very nice benefits.

I only recently came into possession of a no dash 640 with a CEN serial number. It's slightly shorter barrel allows it to be carried when I choose to carry in a pocket for some reason. Again, I don't mind the extra weight at all. I've been carrying and shooting J Frames since the late 60's and have opportunity to hold, shoot, and/or own quite a few in that time. My 640's came to me much later in life, but they will be the very last to go, if ever. I also own a Model 60 no dash and it's a fine gun, but for the, the Centennial style J Frames are without question the best models for concealed carry and have NO negatives for carry any time, any place. I shoot all my revolvers DAO all the time, so the exposed hammer is not a benefit for me. This is just another opinion for consideration. This is what works best for me after many years of experience and actual field testing both on and off the job.