30-06 168 target loads
 

In all my years of reloading, I have never tried the 168gr BTHP bullet, just for some fun target work and general low velocity plinking, out of my 1903 rifle.
Looking up the types of bullets they all have around a .462 BC and most look like twins, so it will be just a matter of finding some but have read where the Remington might be of a little lower quality.....but never know what is at hand.
In the past I have had pretty good luck with imr 4895,4064 and H380 powders with the lighter bullets of 150 grains but any advise is welcome as well as an OAL that has worked for you. My maximum hunting loads are at 3.34 but have gone as far as 3.36 with a few spritzers.
I usually use cci 200 primers but will use a better primer for target work if they seem to get better groups, just never got into really "Tweaking" all I can out a bullet, since 1 1/2" groups at 100 yards put meat on the table, usually, if I did my part. 2500 to 2700 fps or so would be great.
Thanks for any help.

I'm not really a "target" shooter due to a lack of long range facilities in the local area. I'm also shooting the 308 Winchester instead of the 30.06 in a Ruger Gunsite. Most of my shooting is done at a nearby 50 yard indoor range with occasional forays to a 100 yard outdoor range about 40 miles to the north. However, I have been VERY impressed with Lapua Scenar bullets, at 50 yards 3 or 4 shots cloverleafs at 50 yards that can be totally covered with a dime are expected when I do my job correctly. Another bullet that has worked very well for me is the Nosler Accubond, while not quite as accurate as the Lapua I have seen groups that can be covered by a nickel often enough to expect this kind of result.

IMO if you want to shoot purely for accuracy you'll have a difficult time of it finding a bullet more accurate than the Lapua Scenar. One plus for these bullets is that they aren't hugely expensive at about 50 cents per and they can be found with relative ease at Midway or Natchez. For a Hunting bullet I can recommend the Nosler Accubonds without hesitation, the first time I shot one of my own loads using this bullet I cut my group sizes in half and my Gunsite will shoot an inch or less at 100 yards with their 150 grain bullet.

4895 is incredibly....
 

4895 is incredibly flexible. You can reduce loads by 40% from maximum.

Straight out of the Lyman book, a max load of 48.5 gr gets 2762 fps and a starting load of 43 gr. gets 2224 fps with the 165 BT bullet.

If you want velocities below that, SR4759 is THE reduced rifle powder for velocities from about 1600 to 2200.

The 168gr HPBT match bullets such as Sierra's Matchking is a wonderfully accurate target bullet , but a poor hunting bullet. Despite being a hollow point , it rarely expands due to a thick hard jacket and high antimony lead core. It's ballistic twin , the 168gr SBT Gameking is an excellent hunting bullet and uses the same data. Keep in mind the original 30-06 M1 load had a 172gr spitzer boat tail bullet and the M72 national match load still used it after the 150gr M2 load was standardized.

I always think in terms of Garand loads , so 4895 , 4064 , and Varget are good powders as are their ball powder equivelents like BL-C2 and W-748.

And they work in my Ruger M-77 and No.1.

Pretty standard match load for the 172gr NM bullet has always been 46.0 IMR4895, CCI200, 3.330 OAL. I figure it would be a real good place to start, maybe increase by a max of 1/2gr of powder with a 168gr. bullet.

You can use both 4895 and 4064 with good success with a 168gr bullet in the 30-06 although I rather use 4350.

If it were me I would charge 45.0gr H4895 or 47.0gr IMR4895 or IMR4064. All those loads are very light and will make good target ammo for your 1903 rifle.

NOTE: Never trust load data you get form a forum on the Internet. Mistakes can and will happen so always verify the data for yourself.

I have had good results in my M1 Garand using Hornady 168gr bthp over 46.8grs of IMR4895 with OAL of 3.190
This combo has outpreformed the Hornady Match ammo at 100 and 200 yards in my Garand.

Indeed.....
 

Indeedy do. Fortunately these loads are easy to verify, unlike some I've had to find something published on especially with the 4759 and cast bullets.

I load a 165g bullet over 57g IMR 4350 in a bolt gun.

For a semi auto I use 4064.

I was at an auction a few weeks ago and there were more than a few load manuals and books. I looked at a Hodgdon #19 and Hodgdon #20 manual and while both were nice the #19 had tons of load data in all rifle calibers for Cast bullets while the #20 was limited. I put a show on for the #20 and gave up but I went after the #19 hard and won it. I think it's extremely valuable but it only cost me $6.00!!! I know exactly what you're talking about. Cast bullet data for rifle calibers is almost none existent in any book or manual printed in the past 30 years except for the Lyman Cast Bullet Manual 4th Edition. (but even that can't match the older manuals)

Actually the 168gr bullets are old & outdated.

These things are the cat's meow in the 308/30-06

https://www.sierrabullets.com/store/...ALMA-MatchKing

It's hard to beat that bullet & varget pushing it for full house loads or h-414 for mild loads.

Not for card carrying Luddites. If I really wanted an extremely high ballistic coefficient bullet for long range I'd shoot a VLD Berger in a 6.5x284.

I load the Sierra 165 HPBT bullet (3 grains less weight) with 49.5 grains IMR 4064 with a 3.260" OAL. I don't know what it is about that load and it defies logic but it's been incredibly accurate in my Garand (haven't measured yet), BAR (0.580" @ 100 yards) and Rem 760 (0.625" @ 100 yards) as well as my friends .30-06's. Good luck!

Out of a 1903 I like 57.0 gr IMR 4350 & either the Sierra or Nosler 168 BTHP match bullet .

Holly cow, 13 replies in just one day, must have struck a nerve some where.................
Thanks for all the great info, funny how I also use 57grs of imr4350 with my 165gr hunting BTSP bullet but it is ripping at 2760 fps in 60 degree weather.
I did get a Hornady 165 SST poly-tip down to just 2550 fps with 55 grs of 4891 and a cci250 primer that puts 5 @ .89 at 100 yards but with the faster powder I will be saving 10 grs of powder every time I pull the trigger.
I will give the 4895 powder a try as well as 4064 since I have a brand new pound of it that is unopened, for my first try at slower target loads.

OAL of 3.19 to 3.33 is good to know.......... my hunting SP bullets like the factory 3.34 so at least I have a idea of what is going on. My 150gr Core-Lokt crimped is at 3.19.....interesting.

Looked for primers this morning on my usual sites..............nada, zip, empty. Not even bench rest primer that are usually there. Will have to widen my search a little more..............

Thanks again..........later.

PS;
here is a picture of what the rifle with a 165gr sp did back when I was young and had good eyes and nerves of steel. Lot of ammo down range since then..........

http://oi41.tinypic.com/2vtqqhh.jpg

In a 1903 you have more options. I shoot garand and have to stay close to spec to keep the gun operating.

I loaded mil surp pulled ball (got it cheap for practice), same as mil surp 30-06 ammo is loaded with. I wasn't impressed with the accuracy (but at 11c a head I'm not complaining, too much anyway).

I was planning to get sierra matchking for CMP garand but time got away from me and I'm not sure i'd have found it anyway.

Talked at length with one shooter and he's loading 125gr sierra mk over 48gr of 4895. Since he finished 23 out of 1100+ shooters I plan to give this a try for next year. 3.1" OAL.

BTW, greek surplus was coming out of my garand at 2800-2850fps. 48gr of 4895 in mil cases, my loads, was doing about 100fps less, 47 gr about 50 fps less - about 2650fps I didn't go below 47.

I didn't see much diff between crimped and not in accuracy, but uncrimped was unreliable in my garand and that of a buddy I loaded for. (bullets coming out upon loading). Of course this only manifested itself during the competition!

Interesting replies for an ammo that been around for 100+ years.

Will that 6.5 x 284 bullet fit in a 30cal/30-06? The op asked about a rifle/caliber combo so I offered a bullet with a .500+ col compared to the .460+ bullet he was looking at.

The 168gr bullets truely are outdated, the palma bullets in the link go faster (sell drop) & actually have less wind drift than the 168gr match bullets. Flattery trajectory & less wind drift ='s a better bullet.

On a side note:
The 155gr palma bullet does better in the garands also, easier on the opt rods when the rifle is used in it's original configuration. And using the m1 garands in their original configuration is also outdated.

Schuster DCM Adjustable Gas Plug Wrench M1 Garand Steel Parkerized

In a word, these things flat out work. With them a garand owner can adjust the plug to lay the brass at their feet if they want. It also gives the garand owners the ability to test/shoot powder/bullet combos that they never could before.

Briefly... the 168 gr. BTHP is an excellent bullet. I've used Nosler J-4's with good success. Try IMR-4064. Refer to Sierra, Speer, Hornady etc. for a starting load and then work up.

If you should consider developing a hunting load consider using 150 or 165 gr. Nosler Ballistic Tip bullets. I have fired these in a number of sporting weight bolt-action rifles chambered in .30-06 Springfield and .308 Winchester. Results have been remarkable. The Nosler BT with loads tailored to a particular rifle will in my experience consistently produce MOA or less five shot groups. I have had ten shot groups that stayed under MOA. It is very good and extremely consistent. HTH. Sincerely. brucev.

FWIW, I've spent some time developing Sierra 168gr BTHP loads for my 50 yr old Remington 700BDL in 30-06. 56.3gr of IMR4350 gave ~2750FPS and 3-shot group sizes of .422" and .648" at 100yds during OCW tests.

My tests appear to show 56.5gr and 56.7gr also produced small 3-shot groups (1.172" with one shot separated and .857") with nearly identical overall POIs. With the one "odd" shot and similar velocities (~2750) across all three loads I'm in the process of repeating the tests at those load levels.

All velocities were recorded at the muzzle by a MagnetoSpeed chrono, so they are a tad higher than using optical chronos.

I reload 168 grain boat tail bullets for 4 different .30-06s. A sporterized A3-03, a Win. M70, and two FN Commercial Mausers. I use CCI BR primers and neck size the brass. It's kind of hard to keep all the brass straight. :) I have tried numerous powders like 4064, Benchmark, Varget, RL-19 W748 and others. I have a cabinet full of partially used containers of rifle powder. The A3-03 and the Winchester prefer 4895 at 42.2 and 44.6 grains under the 168 grain pill. The two Belgian Mausers prefer 51.1 grains of 4350. The bolts guns are all light weight hunting rifles with low power scopes and factory triggers, not heavy barrelled target guns. They will all shoot right at 1 MOA with their respective loads. Recently I have been working on cat sneeze loads using 4 grains of Bullseye and a 168 grain cast boolit, its accurate enough to hit a tree rat at 50 yards with the punch and the kick of a .38 special.

The best load for my Rem 700 .30-06 I could ever come up with was the 165 Sierra BTSP over 48 grains of 4064. Couldn't tell you the COL, but it was as long as I could make it and fit the magazine and chamber without touching the rifling. When conditions were right and I was steady, sub-MOA 5-shot groups were not uncommon. The bullet's performance on game was faultless at all ranges.

I shoot 165 gr Nosler ballistic tips from my Sako 75 in 30-06. And for the '06 4350 is usually my powder of choice. For a fun load in the '06 try a Sierra 125 soft point starting with 40 grains of 4895 and don't exceed 43 grains. Very accurate. The info was given to me many years from the NRA and was quoted as being a good 300 meter load. Funny thing about the Sako, will shoot the M72 national match ammo right along with my handloads despite two different powders, brass, primers and about 100 fps velocity. Frank

final note on larger bullet weights.
Getting ready for hunting season and did some test with the
180 and 200gr BT bullets with imr 4350 and 4831. Just a little
bit of difference in the fps with the two powders. You can go
for the fps or low cup but found the data interesting. Not a
M-1 load but just for my 1903 bolt action....cci200 oal 3.34".

180gr 54.0gr 4350 .......... 2663 fps
180gr 54.0gr 4831 .......... 2410 fps 100yd 3 @ .89"

200gr 54.0gr 4350 .......... 2569 fps
200gr 54.0gr 4831 .......... 2404 fps +/- 34 ES
200gr 46.0gr 4064 .......... 2350 fps +/-34 ES ( at or near max. )

160's are out there some where...?

later.