Swaged lead .44 projectiles?

jaymoore

jaymoore

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Finally running low on 240 LWSC swaged bullets, so I went to restock. Seems neither Speer nor Hornady are currently manufacturing said projectiles! I've put many thousands of the Speers downrange in IHMSA competition, particularly Field Pistol, and have been more than satisfied. Much better results than with cast bullets without the wear and tear on both shooter and revolver that come with jacketed bullet having ammo.

Anybody find good alternates for long range (i.e., up to 200m) ~1000 fps loads?
 
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Interesting that you don't like/use cast bullets.

Playing around with a 10" bbl'd contender @ 100yds. Puta burris ff3 on it and was sighting it in. Started On the top row left target.
wLHw6OR.jpg


Shot and adjusted on the top 3 targets and the bottom left target. Was close so I shot a3- shot group on the bottom right target.
7KMGHIm.jpg


Gave the sight a couple clicks down and started banging on steel. That's with a 250gr cast bullet (640 series bullet on right) and a 7.0gr load of bullseye/1000fps load.
U34PIKO.jpg
 
Jaymoore ,
Give the new cast & powder coated bullets a try . Because the powder coating works so well , as a soft jacket , the bullets can be cast of a softer alloy ... more like the soft swaged lead bullets Speer and Hornady used to make . The powder coating eliminates leading and thus the need for them to be "hard cast" .
I don't have a supplier as I cast my own , seems I've heard the names Bayou Bullets and Matt's Bullets ... I'm sure a search will turn up a supplier .
Be prepared for the price increases ... you might want to invest in a bullet mould for the future ... I don't see things getting cheaper anytime soon !
Gary
 
Help me out here. Why would cast of same weight & charge be harder on shooter and gun than swaged? I never buy swaged bullets except for HBWC
by Hornady.
If softness is the issue you can do pure lead. I don’t shoot cast at HV. Most loads are under 1000fps. I have no problem going 1300fps by adding additional Wheel Weights to mix. Normally 50:50 lead- wheel weight.this is good for duplicating most lead bullet factory loads. My tatget loads for WCs are 20:1 lead-tin. At 600-700fps there is no leading.
When first into 44mag in 60s we bought 240gr Kieth HP / gas check. That would handle 21.5gr of 2400, a decent magnum load. All my LV rifles also tuned for cast
The only leading I’ve had that is memorable was with Speer 45 cal swaged bullets. I got a Vaquero 45 on trade with components. I had shot Speer before in 38s with no problem. I forget 240 or 250 SWCs at 750fps, Unique
according to book. The results looked like Elmer Fudd cartoon. I had lead foil extending out the muzzle of 83/8” 25-5. This happened at 24rds, first accuracy was taking a dump before we noticed leading.
 
Any change in bullet hardness, alloy, shape can affect accuracy. Normal cast bullets, 10-15 BHN, work quite well at slightly at higher velocities than swaged and often loaded to higher pressures and velocities. Swaged bullets work great at lower velocities with lower pressures, less recoil and muzzle blast. I loaded many Speer 240 gr swaged SWC for light trigger time in my 44 Magnums (and allowed my 13 year old daughter to shoot "Daddy's big guns".)...
 
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Swaged bullets allowed me to forgo weight sorting with cast bullets. (Extremely tedious!) And the Speers were big enough to fill the throats of my older .44s. Leading ceased to be an issue when i started using a case full of IMR4198 or RL7. Super consistent velocities, to boot! "Inefficiency" and unburnt powder grains were a small price to pay, given the great results.

I've cast bullets for decades, for everything from .455 Webley to 7mm TCU. (My best IHMSA BB UAS score ever: 40/40 with 9/10 tiny shoot-off targets down using 7mm cast boolits out of a rebarreled XP-100 in 7 TCU. Boatloads of work on those bullets. Including sizing the bore riding portion as well as the driving bands.)
And have applied and purchased the Hitek coated bullets. Meh. Mostly gone back to regular lubed stuff.

Been experimenting with S&W .44 Mags since the mid '90s. Visually inspected and sorted Speer LSWC bullets have given the best results in competition.

Oh, well. I have a cast bullet load for .45 Colt that will do the job in a reddot equipped 625-7, at least out to 100 yards. It won't reliably take 200m Rams, though.

Might be time to retire the other S&Ws and start using my Freedom Arms .41. Not near as much fun, though, regardless of how much theoretically better the nasty SA plowshare having grip FA revolver is....
 
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Bummer
Currently working through my last box
I guess my question is are they discontinued or not in production right now
These have been a favorite of mine for a long time

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FWI
I’ve had good luck with the RCBS 250K sized 430 at 975fps
at long range but only in the newer guns
Had mediocre performance in the older 629’s when loaded light
Accuracy improved somewhat when lunched with full load of 2400
 

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CWH44300 said:
Bummer
Currently working through my last box
I guess my question is are they discontinued or not in production right now
These have been a favorite of mine for a long time

attachment.php

FWI
I’ve had good luck with the RCBS 250K sized 430 at 975fps
at long range but only in the newer guns
Had mediocre performance in the older 629’s when loaded light
Accuracy improved somewhat when lunched with full load of 2400
Click to expand...
combed both sites ... they are gone.
While I outgrew them decades ago, I did use them and saw their worth. its a little sad to see them go.
 
Check Magnus Bullets. He was making swaged bullets for a while but had stopped selling direct during the shut down. I'm not sure where he's at right now. It's been a while since I bought any from him. I've used his 200 grain, 45 swc in my 45 auto target gun. They are lights out more accurate than anything else. I find that swaged seem to be a little more consistent for me. If you're building target loads that are loping along at 800fps, that work great.
 
jaymoore said:
Cast boolits are good except for those that aren't. I.e., an internal void or a mold that wasn't quite closed all the way can lead to a missed critter. IHMSA doesn't give any points for "close". Binary scoring....
Click to expand...

Check Midsouth. They sell Magnus bullets. They seem to have a lot of them on back order but it's a good place to start. I think the bullseye games, the ones that require real accuracy, are starting to wane. The younger shooters don't seem to have the attention span to put in the work that they require. Demand for all things bullseye related has gone down, so manufactures are stepping away from making equipment for it.
 
Cast bullets can be very accurate, but you might have to work at it a little bit. It's possible your throats are just a little tight. A soft swaged bullet will get sized down by tight throats just like a cast bullet, but their softness allows them to obturate to the barrel diameter more easily.

I've found I need to up the charge a bit with cast vs. swaged. But check your throats. Then find a cast bullet vendor that produces bullets on the softer side. This is doable.
 
I run .44s with throats that range from 0.4295" to 0.433". (The .44s with smaller throats don't get used much, mostly for hunting. PC's, maybe one DX.) The Speers worked fine in all of them- with some tweaks. And special dies, and added wax or BLL/modded Alox tumbling, etc. 15-20 years of experimenting and machining and hair pulling!

Tried cast bullets at the Big Bore match last Sayurday- Not encouraged! (To put it mildly...) Scores were down a good ten critters with a lot of "mystery misses", i.e., trigger letoff, sight picture and follow through were good, but the impact went somewhere unexpected....

I did a Standing entry with my backup swaged Hornady LSWCHPs and was only down a few due to slightly off zeroing that was corrected on the fly. 200m results not as good as expected with a few "MM"s. Could have been fatigue as it was my last entry. But with ten straight 100m Pigs down, not discouraged with the Hornady results as with the cast bullet Scoped Unlimited Standing nor with the freestyle, Creedmoor position Revolver entries. Too bad Hornady isn't making their swaged bullets, either.
 
jaymoore said:
Finally running low on 240 LWSC swaged bullets, so I went to restock. Seems neither Speer nor Hornady are currently manufacturing said projectiles!
Click to expand...

My LGS must be Hornady's best source. They always have all the swaged lead bullets, XTPs and they even stock Hornady brass too.
 
Missouri Bullet Company bullets are good, with grease lube or painted coatings.
They make them in a softer alloy, and a harder one.
 
jaymoore said:
I run .44s with throats that range from 0.4295" to 0.433". (The .44s with smaller throats don't get used much, mostly for hunting. PC's, maybe one DX.) The Speers worked fine in all of them- with some tweaks. And special dies, and added wax or BLL/modded Alox tumbling, etc. 15-20 years of experimenting and machining and hair pulling!
Click to expand...

While I agree bullet fit is important I seriously doubt 35/10,000 of an inch would effect accuracy but I could be wrong. You are lucky however your guns shoot well with the same bullets. That does make things easier...
 
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