Hey guys new member to the forum but have been collecting guns and s&w revolvers for awhile. Recently picked up a 1917 for a good price with a nice refinish on it and tight lockup, it has matching barrel and frame but replacement cylinder with what looks like original finish but is hard to tell. Anyqho took the gun out yesterday and it shot great very accurate for the jump the 45acp has to do but when I was Messing with it today I realized every few turns, I couldn't tell if it was when I cocked it too slow or what, the cylinder would fall just a hair short of clicking into place at full cock, but when I would depress the trigger and let the hammer down it would click into place and engage tight lockup. Is this normall sometimes or a timing issue? Since when the trigger is pressed it does click Into place and lockup im inclined not to worry about it. It also might be me just babying the hammer as when I do a quick heavy cock of the hammer it seems to never happen. Any info would be great ty!
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Help with 1917 timing!
- Thread starter Mibit911
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Model19man
SWCA Member
I would say not normal and a good gunsmith should be contacted next.
It is supposed to 'lock' before the hammer drops,,both SA and DA.
That it does lock up (clicks into place) with just that little extra trigger pull with the hammer at full cock is the trigger rotating further and pushing the Hand farther up. The Hand is engaging each ratchet tooth along the right side of each and with that little bit of extra travel is pushing the cylinder around so the locking bolt can fall into the slot.
Operating the Hammer quickly in SA or the Trigger in DA covers up the timing issue by giving the cylinder a good healthy spin. The rotating force rolls the cylinder quickly and easily into position .
That it does lock up (clicks into place) with just that little extra trigger pull with the hammer at full cock is the trigger rotating further and pushing the Hand farther up. The Hand is engaging each ratchet tooth along the right side of each and with that little bit of extra travel is pushing the cylinder around so the locking bolt can fall into the slot.
Operating the Hammer quickly in SA or the Trigger in DA covers up the timing issue by giving the cylinder a good healthy spin. The rotating force rolls the cylinder quickly and easily into position .
It is not normal in my opinion. I have had more than a few 1917's and none have behaved that way.
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First make sure it is not gunked up inside with old, dry oil, and that the cylinder spins freely when open.
Oh yeah the cylinder spins fine, like I said I shot it yesterday and it goes into lockup fine and tight, but now I'm unsure when firing if it locked up from pulling the hammer back or from the trigger pull slightly advancing the cylinder llbefore hammer drops, in either way the gun had great accuracy, but when slowly coxking and decocking the trigger every 10 or so revolutions a cylinder falls short of lockup, and the trigger carries it the rest of the way into lockup which is then a very tight lockup. Now idk about double action trigger pull. I'll need some snap caps to test
You can dry fire a S&W centerfire revolver without worry. Test for late carry up, by slowly pulling trigger with finger of off hand dragging on cylinder so its mass does not help it finish the rotation. It should lock up before the hammer falls.
If it does not what you really need is a slightly wider hand, The hand is operated by the trigger and sticks through a small slot in the recoil shield and ratchets the teeth on the extractor to turn thru cylinder. A wider hand will engage each tooth just a bit longer and move the cylinder a bit more. It should be fitted by a gunsmith who is familiar with S&W revolvers.
As long as you cock the gun smartly in SA and use a pull through DA trigger movement the cylinders mass will complete the movement, but it really should be fixed
If it does not what you really need is a slightly wider hand, The hand is operated by the trigger and sticks through a small slot in the recoil shield and ratchets the teeth on the extractor to turn thru cylinder. A wider hand will engage each tooth just a bit longer and move the cylinder a bit more. It should be fitted by a gunsmith who is familiar with S&W revolvers.
As long as you cock the gun smartly in SA and use a pull through DA trigger movement the cylinders mass will complete the movement, but it really should be fixed
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HeloMt
SWCA Member
Also, when checking for late "carry up", insert empty cases into the cylinder. These will hold the extractor and cylinder in proper alignment, not relying on the two small pins and spline. If there is any wear or slop in the pins or spline, late carry up will occur. The cases eliminate that. I most strongly emphasize "empty cases".
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Prior to buying any used revolver, I always check the timing by very slowly pulling the hammer back until it locks, then checking to see if the cylinder has locked. Pulling the hammer back quickly will hide the lockup issue because of the centrifugal force of the cylinder turning.
OP, I would definetely have that fixed by a good revolver smith.
OP, I would definetely have that fixed by a good revolver smith.
Yeah if I had bought it in person I might have noticed sooner and when checking at the gun store it was functioning fine lockup was tight and timing seemed good. It only seemed every once in awhile it falls short of lockup before the trigger finishes the cycle
Should be 5 degrees before TDC.
Ya, HeloMt is correct. Sometimes the pins and holes that align the extractor have just enough slack in them that it will be late without cases in it. Stick a clip full of fired brass in it and check it.
And only when I do a slow pull on the hammer I can feel a dull 2nd click and know when it happened, but if I cock it hard which I try not to do on my older revolvers or really any gun except a pump shotgun it seems to always engage
cgt4570
SWCA Member
As others have said, if you've thoroughly cleaned the internals, then you have a timing issue. The correct fix is fitting a new hand. The simple fix is to peen the ratchet tooth or teeth (move a tiny bit of metal) so the ratchet engages the hand a bit more. Since it's intermittent, see if you can isolate it to a single chamber.
muzzlestuffer2012
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It's a timing issue need to fit a new hand
