Suggestions for red dot for Shield plus

I am thinking about getting a new Shield Plus that's red dot ready. Any suggestions of a good low price red dot?

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You have bought a fairly high end gun with an optic cut for a mid-higher-priced RDS.

You are asking for a “low cost” recommendation. We don’t know what you consider low cost, or what use you intend for the gun with the RDS. We don’t know how experienced you are with RDS. A new user does not benefit by going cheap as the learning curve is more difficult if not almost impossibly frustrating.

In general, low cost RDS are junk, and you will think you wasted money on a good gun if you get one. It’s like putting low cost tires on a performance car.

If you intend to carry the Shield for personal defense, skimping on the optic is unwise.

In terms of my experience on a red dot sights, I have a pair of RMRcc's on the dovetail Trijicon plates for my Hellcat and Shield Plus. Shooting them, I have to say, it works. On the other end of a micro red dot, have a CT1500 on an XD-S, which I hate, but I'm not sure why. FWIW, the Romeo1Pro on the M18 is the easiest thing I have to get lined up and landing good enough, which is what I want for the kids out there who enlisted and are carrying and shooting them these days where it matters instead of me at my local indoor range.

I’ve mounted over 60 optics since June and probably well over 100 prior to that... the only person to come in so far with an optic capable Shield Plus wanted a Holosun 507K mounted but the optic cut in the slide has the four raised bosses for the RMS Shield and the Holosun only has the cutouts for the front two so it wouldn’t fit.

I see C&H is listing a plate but as of when that person came in a couple weeks ago the plate wasn’t available yet.

With that background, I’d wait until the C&H plate is available and go with a Holosun 407K or 507K depending on preference. I wouldn’t”t want any of the other optics.

I’ve never had bosses on any of my five RDS installations. Just a smooth cut. If the cut is correct front-to-back, and the screws are correct, the RDS has no where to go and will be secure.

One only needs bosses, I believe, when there is an oversized generic cut that needs additional stabilization or as a base for fitting plates. I don’t like plates as they add a layer of complexity and raise the sight higher than it has to be—a compromise I don’t want.

mdrd375 said:

I am thinking about getting a new Shield Plus that's red dot ready. Any suggestions of a good low price red dot?

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I have shot iron sights for well over 50 years, and my first venture into red dot sights has come with my Glock 17 Gen 5 MOS, which uses plates. I honestly don't know if your Shield uses plates or not. My Sig P320 X-compact is cut for their Romeo1Pro or a Leupould Delta Point Pro, but I honestly don't see myself going that route.

I have had excellent experience with Vortex optics, so I installed a Vortex Viper RDS on the Glock. I can't fault either the pistol or the optic, but I am having a difficult time adapting to the red dot. I found that without suppressor height sights, I am constantly hunting for the red dot. Using the suppressor height sights has shown an improvement in my times in GSSF matches, but I am still significantly faster with iron sights on the same courses of fire. For me, I am finding that adapting to the red dot will entail a significant degree of relearning how to shoot.

For me, I'm finding that I have a very high degree of "traditional good shooting habits" that I must break.

I took the recommendations of several officers who have been running red dots for years and got a Holosun 507k2. I have absolutely no complaints. I just wish Safariland made an ALS for a 43x and a red dot.

CB3 said:

I’ve never had bosses on any of my five RDS installations. Just a smooth cut. If the cut is correct front-to-back, and the screws are correct, the RDS has no where to go and will be secure.

One only needs bosses, I believe, when there is an oversized generic cut that needs additional stabilization or as a base for fitting plates. I don’t like plates as they add a layer of complexity and raise the sight higher than it has to be—a compromise I don’t want.

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I agree that a direct milling that creates a well-fitting pocket supporting the optic body doesn’t need bosses. I also think that when one knows the specific optic they are going to use a direct mill is the superior option.

Unfortunately, though we argued for it, direct milling is not an option for us (my Department). That said, we’ve had a lot of experience with successes and failures and while a plate system is not “ideal”, it can certainly be made to function reliably when mounted correctly and adds the benefit of being able to switch optics, which I’ve done on numerous occasions as I’ve acquired more optic guns and optics.

Specifically to the question posed by the OP, there is another option I didn’t think of before my original post.

First, you could remove the rear two (or all four, but if they are there I’d keep ‘em) raised bosses in the Sheild’s optic pocket (or have a gunsmith do it).

Depending on the dimension of the raised bosses you may also have to trim the front two to work with a Holosun (such is the case with the Glock mini MOS guns). When I had possession of the gun, for about five minutes...I didn’t think to look to see if the slides threaded holes for the optic were through-cut or blind. This could create complexity of finding correct screws but once you figure out which ones you need McMaster-Carr usually has what’s needed to make it work - and that’s if the factory-supplied screws don’t work.

Of course, that’s the benefit of the C&H plate - You don’t have to worry about any of the above stuff because the plate will come with screws.

Otherwise you could always buy a non-optic Shield Plus and have it milled for an optic. That will get you a more precise fit for more durable mounting. While in theory it gives you a lower mount you can only go so low if you still want backup irons (The Holosun has an integrated rear sight), the cost for the milling will increase the overall cost of the project, and the modification to the pistol will probably not be worth it from a value standpoint if you choose to sell it in the future.

As for learning to use the dot, Irrifleman makes a very important point. Running an optic is a different way of aiming the pistol, requires a more refined presentation, and requires some changes in how one “thinks” about shooting (dealing with the movement of the dot, knowing when to shoot a streaking line vs a stabilized dot, keeping a true target focus rather than looking at the dot, etc.).

I first used a slide-mounted optic in 2001 with the old Tasco Optima 2000 mounted on a Glock 23 (for a year or two) and then a Ruger Mk-II. I thought it was a neat gimmick back then but had no application outside “open” divisions in the shooting sports. I got rid of that after using it for a few years.

I wanted to look in to pistol optics and proposed evaluations as early as 2013 but never got support and other projects took precidencec. In 2017 I finally decided to bite the bullet and bought an RMR and a Glock 17MOS. I didn’t know what I didn’t know back then and just installed it with the included Allen wrench and sealing plate (to get the right MOS screws that don’t come with the RMR). It ran great and never came loose in over 10,000 documented rounds.

I watched a lot of Sage Dynamics videos which helped me get started in learning to use the dot effectively. Having access to a range and as much ammo as I want helped too. It still took almost a year before I felt I was comfortable using the dot and even longer to tie up loose ends in what I feel are the necessary skill sets to be able to run a dot better than irons for LE/self defense.

Of course, like anything, there are those with above-average natural talent who pick up skills quickly and without much guidance, and there are those who benefit greatly from the guidance of a good teacher, coach, or instructor.

I’ve now been to a bunch of training courses for pistol optics to include Modern Samurai Project, the Sig Academy, Hades Consulting, Mike Pannone, Brandon Wright, and several others and each of those courses have provided valuable tips to refine not only how I shoot a dot but how to help other people shorten their own personal learning curve.

They say that if you really want to learn how to do something you should teach others and boy has that proven correct for me. As one of the people who teach every one of the two-day pistol optic classes my department teaches as well as teaching contract pistol optic classes for two private training organizations I’ve learned a ton about shooting and mounting and motor learning and human performance.

All that to say that I HIGHLY recommend someone who’s motivated to embrace the dot sign up for training from a competent instructor. It will truly shorten the learning curve and the classes are fun as well.

As to a cost-effective (not "cheap") red dot, I have a Vortex Venom mounted on my FN FNX-45 Tactical. It cost about $200 four years ago, and it has withstood over 4,000 rounds of .45 acp shooting without an issue. It has a large window and the dot's intensity is adjustable, so my 78 year-old eyes have no difficulty in acquiring it. But, as SoCalDep says, it does take practice.

The original question has been nagging me since I read it. I went to the S&W website, to investigate the Shield Plus. I had the opportunity to shoot one at the demo bay during the Adaptive Defensive Shooting Summit in September, and it did leave a positive impression.

When I went to the S&W website, I was specifically looking for information relevant to the optics cut. Unfortunately, the site was silent about the cut, or which brand/model it was cut for. The only clue that is presented in the listing is the photo of the Shield Plus wearing a Crimson Trace optic (which is a subsidiary/division) of S&W. It would appear as though the manufacturer needs to provide a bit more information about the optic ready Shield Plus.

SoCalDep said:

I’ve mounted over 60 optics since June and probably well over 100 prior to that... the only person to come in so far with an optic capable Shield Plus wanted a Holosun 507K mounted but the optic cut in the slide has the four raised bosses for the RMS Shield and the Holosun only has the cutouts for the front two so it wouldn’t fit.

I see C&H is listing a plate but as of when that person came in a couple weeks ago the plate wasn’t available yet.

With that background, I’d wait until the C&H plate is available and go with a Holosun 407K or 507K depending on preference. I wouldn’t”t want any of the other optics.

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Why not grind down the bosses so the Holosun fits and even fits lower. I did it with my 43x MOS, and I am super happy.

Loyaljeeper said:

Why not grind down the bosses so the Holosun fits and even fits lower. I did it with my 43x MOS, and I am super happy.

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Very true. I mentioned that in my second post #8 as an option, but some people don’t want to grind/mill/file their slide and some (like LE people who have to comply with policy) aren’t allowed to do that.

Additionally, the amount the optic is lower is almost inconsequential save potentially regulating backup irons better - and if it does that (or allow the optic to sit just low enough for the factory sights to be visible without blocking the window) then that’s a plus as well vs having to use the integrated rear sight on the Holosun.

That said, it is an option and for those with even a pretty minimal amount of skill it’s easily doable and probably the cheapest solution.

Thanks for all the responses. I am 64 and need reading glasses but see well otherwise. Seeing the sights gets harder each year so I was thinking I might try a laser or red dot.

C&H Adapter Plate for 507k

SoCalDep said:

I’ve mounted over 60 optics since June and probably well over 100 prior to that... the only person to come in so far with an optic capable Shield Plus wanted a Holosun 507K mounted but the optic cut in the slide has the four raised bosses for the RMS Shield and the Holosun only has the cutouts for the front two so it wouldn’t fit.

I see C&H is listing a plate but as of when that person came in a couple weeks ago the plate wasn’t available yet.

With that background, I’d wait until the C&H plate is available and go with a Holosun 407K or 507K depending on preference. I wouldn’t”t want any of the other optics.

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I ordered a C&H adapter plate for the Plus. It is very thin and takes care of the problem presented by the two rear slide cut tabs. I've mounted the 507k and fired several hundred rounds through it so far. It works great, and the 507k sit low enough on the slide that it doesn't look top-heavy. The other combination I would consider is the Shield RMSc RDS due to it's low height. BTW, the stock iron sights co-witness just fine with this set up.

Suggestions for Shield plus red dots

Shield Plus with orange night sites is "Optics Ready". I have a five year old 9mm Shield and recently put red dot on it. I wanted to go on a somewhat budget yet not a piece of junk. I chose the Ceylee "Shake Awake". Cost was $87 on Amazon. It has the same footprint a Vortex Venom. Size wise it is almost identical. Has larger optic area, and only size differecnce is 0.1" longer. I had to get a mount (old shield). Mounted it and after sighting it at 15yds went to range. I was extremely impressed. One minor windage adjust and I was right on target, so much so I ordered one for my XDS9. It was just as good. I have a Vortex Venom, love it, but I bought both Ceylees at half the cost my VV. Celee.com or go to their store on Amazon.

I have a new Shield Plus Performance Center that came with the CT-1550 installed. Mounts directly to the slide with no adapter plate so it co-witnesses with the factory fiber optic sights. Had it at the range today for it's first shots. Required a few minor adjustments to get it sighted in at 10 yards. Automatic on/off when you install the supplied cover and auto brightness settings work fine. The dot is sharp and crisp. The only down side is you have to remove it to change the battery, but the battery life is supposed to be about 20,000 hours.

I also have a TX-22 with a Sig Romeo Zero. It's been a good red dot as well for about $160. About the only difference is the Sig has manual brightness adjustment and the tiny button is hard to push because of it's location.
The Sig Romeo Zero has the same footprint as the CT-1550 so it will mount directly to the slide as well.

Sorry about the photos, for some reason they always rotate when I upload them

mdrd375 said:

Thanks for all the responses. I am 64 and need reading glasses but see well otherwise. Seeing the sights gets harder each year so I was thinking I might try a laser or red dot.

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You should decide first if you see red better than green as green fiber front sights , green ring night sights to combo green tritium can be forun in many gun shops . I changed a front sight on a DW revolver to a thn green fiber optic rod years ago and noticed the difference then again with my wifes p365xl front green ring NS so when Holoson came out with the Green dot optic I went with the 507C " K "for you - GR X2 that has a 32moa circle & a 2moa dot . You can use one or the other or both . I use the circle only for under 25 yards . The 2moa dots nice out to 50 yards

What I have found when others try my green holosun optic they prefer it to the red . Holosun also has a Yellow version for the folks that are red / green color blind .

Holosun 407K offers a 6moa dot red or green

507K is the circle dot

I also like the auto brightness and shake awake sleep mode .

I replaced an older RM02 gen 2 trijicon with a holosun 507C-GR X2 on a match pistol when we stopped shooting matchs do to the lens color and lens coating when this pistol became a multi use carry/ hd /fun gun .

There is a learning curve moving from open sights to a dot optic and if your a sight focused shooter now that curve is steeper . Many defensive folks use a Flash Sight Picture shooting style and with time that flash can become more limited under 15 yards . You need a target/ threat focused shooting stle so start with your dot optic on a fun gun till you become a natural with it . I'm 66 wear trifocal eye glasses right handed and left eye and still shoot open sights well using this flash sight picture shooting style BUT the Dot Optic days are a coming so I mounted my green dot on a m&p 9mm compact 4" for the day I know longer want to shoot ether my 45acp lw commander or 4.25" m&p 40sw or I just need the dot optic !!

I just purchase a swampfox sentinel for my shield plus cost $230 dollars.

As others have mentioned, Holosun 407K or 507K depending on what you've got for a reticle.

The 507K is what I've got my eye on, and I would just have the slide milled directly for the optic.

The only thing holding me back is clearing up a financial obligation before any firearms/ knives/fishing expenditures.