1905 age & value

[$2Ray]

Saw a 1905 4th change in .32-20, serial # 142XXX.
Condition was very nice, my guess in the 95% range. Looked to be all original w/ matching #'s, Made in USA on frame.
Not sure about #'s on the grips, but they looked original to the gun. Looking for age & approximate value. My buddies friend has it & he wants $450 for it. Too high, & if so, by how much? Thanks a lot.

 

[$2Ray]

Saw a 1905 4th change in .32-20, serial # 142XXX.
Condition was very nice, my guess in the 95% range. Looked to be all original w/ matching #'s, Made in USA on frame.
Not sure about #'s on the grips, but they looked original to the gun. Looking for age & approximate value. My buddies friend has it & he wants $450 for it. Too high, & if so, by how much? Thanks a lot.

 

[smith17]

ray:
That line of hand ejectors had their own serial numbers and only went up to a bit over 144,000 so yours was near the end which wrapped up in about 1940. Stocks should have been silver medallion service stocks but I am not sure if those guns were offered with magnas. Can't imagine why not but I have one of the last ones made and it has service stocks. SCSW gives value of Exc+ at $750 but I have seen them go for much less within the last year. $400 might be a pretty good deal. My opinion only.
Ed

 

[$2Ray]

Thank you Smith 17....appreciate it. Never looked at older S&W's before, so it was a joy to handle this one & see the quality. I think it may be calling my name. Thanks again.

 

[Alk8944]

The .32-20 Hand Ejector was listed until 1940, but all production seems to have been stopped sometime in the late 1920's, maybe as late as 1930 or so, based on reported shipping dates that have been posted on this forum from S&W letters. Don't recall, but may be wrong, any dates later than 1928.

 

[mikepriwer]

These guns were delivered at least up until 1938, but that would be the
last 3 -4000 of them. You didn't mention the butt configuration ; if its
round butt, grips could be either hard black rubber, or the small
silver-medallion checkered walnut stocks. Square butt would be the
small silver-medallion checkered walnut.

If the gun is really original-finish, and about 98% or better, $450 is
an OK price, but I don't think you could resell it for anything more than
that. $350 is probably a more reasonable market value ; ie, what it might
sell for in a well-attended auction.

As noted, there was about 144,000 of these 32/20's, in all models and
configurations. A good number of the more common variants survive to this
day - 6 or 6 1/2" barrel in blue M&P sights. There is enough of these to
go around for anyone who is interested, so the price is not very high.

Later, Mike Priwer

 

[$2Ray]

Thanks again guys.
Mike, I'm no expert by any means, but I think the guns finish is original. I didn't see any tell tale signs that it's been reblued, but I do recall the entire crown area wasn't blue at all. It didn't look like it was worn off, rather the crown was left in the white. Is that the way it should be? Screws looked untouched & the grips were checkered walnut. Not positive, but pretty sure it was square butt. Thanks for the info.

 

[mikepriwer]

Earlier in the production, the ends of the barrels were not blued. But,
later on they were. I forget when this change occured. This is not talked
about much, because it serves as another indicator of refinish.

Later, Mike Priwer

 

[$2Ray]

Originally posted by mikepriwer:
Earlier in the production, the ends of the barrels were not blued. But,
later on they were. I forget when this change occured. This is not talked
about much, because it serves as another indicator of refinish.

Later, Mike Priwer

So from what you're saying, the crown (just to clarify, I do mean the entire muzzle area, not just the crown itself) shouldn't be in the white if the finish is original. (being late production for that model) Seems strange they wouldn't blue the crown area if it was refinished, but anything is certainly possible. I'm gonna try & look at it again this week. If I do get it, I'll try & have my buddy post some pics for me. Thanks again.

 

[mikepriwer]

The earlier bluing process had the barrel
standing on its muzzle. As a result, the
bluing medium did not come in contact with
the crowned area, and so did not get blued.
This was changed in the later guns, when the
bluing process changed.

So - if an earlier gun has a blued muzzle,
then the gun has been refinished by someone
who was using a later bluing process.

Later, Mike Priwer

 

[$2Ray]

That's good to know, thanks. Well, then something isn't kosher with this gun, since it is late production & the crown isn't blue. If it were factory refinished at some point, would the grip frame be stamped anywhere to signify that? Also, would a factory letter state if a gun went back for a refinish at any time?

 

[mikepriwer]

My guess is that your 142xxx gun is right, with the blued muzzle. I
have a target around serial 111xxx, and its blued there, as well. Also,
some of the 1930-ish .38 targets are also have blued muzzles.

This does not mean that you gun has not been refinished. Check under
the grips, on the grip frame, for a <> , or diamond shape. Sometimes there
will be a large capital B. The small stamps around the grip pin are not
relevant. Also, check on the flat under the barrel. It may have a <>
mark.

The diamond stamp means the gun was returned to the service department,
for something. Also, sometimes there is a * on the butt, but that can
also mean a duplicate serial number.

No - a factory letter will not state anything about a gun being returned to the
factory. The letters are based solely on the shipping records for the gun as it
left the factory originally.

Later, Mike Priwer

 

[$2Ray]

You misunderstood Mike. The muzzle on the gun I looked at is not blued, it's totally in the white.
That's why I'm stumped, based on your info. The finish looked original, but again, I'm no expert.

 

[g17]

I have this same pistol, 1905 32-20 serial 1238xx, that was bought new by my grandfather and it has never been refinished but the muzzle IS blue, not in the white. Here's a link with photos: 32-20

 

[mikepriwer]

$2Ray

Its possible that the gun was refinished, and then the blue on the muzzle
was rubbed out with steel wool, in the mistaken idea that someone thought
it was supposed to be that way. I remember having Dave Chicoine refinish
an 1899 for me, and the barrel was completely blued. I commented to Dave
that origianlly the muzzle was not blued. He suggested that if I wanted
it to look original, to get some steel wool and rub it out !

The thing is that, about 1912 or so, the factory changed one aspect of their
bluing procedure. Up to that point, following the hot oven bluing, they were
rubbing the ends of the barrels to eliminate the blue on the muzzle. Apparently
they were not satisfied with the bluing results on the muzzle, and felt it was
better to take it off. After about 1912, they stopped doing that.

Later, Mike Priwer

 

[Bugs100]

The serial # on mine is 846xx and was made in Dec. 1919. I payed $475 which was to much but I couldn't pass it up it was in such good shape.

Their a lot of fun to shoot and very accurate.

I reload about 1000 rounds a year for mine.

 

[$2Ray]

Originally posted by g17:
I have this same pistol, 1905 32-20 serial 1238xx, that was bought new by my grandfather and it has never been refinished but the muzzle IS blue, not in the white. Here's a link with photos: 32-20

OK, thanks. That's good to know.

 

[$2Ray]

Originally posted by mikepriwer:
$2Ray

Its possible that the gun was refinished, and then the blue on the muzzle
was rubbed out with steel wool, in the mistaken idea that someone thought
it was supposed to be that way. I remember having Dave Chicoine refinish
an 1899 for me, and the barrel was completely blued. I commented to Dave
that origianlly the muzzle was not blued. He suggested that if I wanted
it to look original, to get some steel wool and rub it out !

The thing is that, about 1912 or so, the factory changed one aspect of their
bluing procedure. Up to that point, following the hot oven bluing, they were
rubbing the ends of the barrels to eliminate the blue on the muzzle. Apparently
they were not satisfied with the bluing results on the muzzle, and felt it was
better to take it off. After about 1912, they stopped doing that.

Later, Mike Priwer

Yeah, I guess anything is possible. I'll have to see what the owner has to say about it. Thanks again to everyone for the help.