1911 Full length guide rod?
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Joni_Lynn
US Veteran
I have a bunch of 1911's and I've tried several different kinds of flgr's and can't tell any difference in the way the guns run. Reliability is the same, accuracy is the same, take down however is more difficult.
mstuhr
Member
Howdy
Hi everyone,
I'm away and late to the game.
I tested these several years ago. I was running light loads in steel plate comp guns. I was at a point where I wondered if I was better off with out the weight of a FLGR or not because the loads were light enough that recoil was minimal. A lighter gun = faster split times
What I found is if you start loading lighter and lighter, the gun with out the FLGR will stop working before the one with it.
I expect this might carry over to a full power load in the event you took some action that might slow down the slide speed...like raking the gun on a barricade when shooting or something like that.
There didn't seem to be much difference under normal loads and conditions but the advantage shows up when you encounter low slide speed.
Technically, there is a difference. I doubt you would notice it much under every day circumstances.
Thanks
Mike
Hi everyone,
I'm away and late to the game.
I tested these several years ago. I was running light loads in steel plate comp guns. I was at a point where I wondered if I was better off with out the weight of a FLGR or not because the loads were light enough that recoil was minimal. A lighter gun = faster split times
What I found is if you start loading lighter and lighter, the gun with out the FLGR will stop working before the one with it.
I expect this might carry over to a full power load in the event you took some action that might slow down the slide speed...like raking the gun on a barricade when shooting or something like that.
There didn't seem to be much difference under normal loads and conditions but the advantage shows up when you encounter low slide speed.
Technically, there is a difference. I doubt you would notice it much under every day circumstances.
Thanks
Mike
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Alpha_Mutt
Member
I added a Wilson Combat full length to my SIG 1911. It worked fine without it and continues to work fine with it. It adds a little forward weight which I like for recoil. No special tools are needed.
I am bumping this thread to point out that Jerry Kuhnhausen recommended both the FLGR and ShokBuf for target shooting. He specifically stated that the FLGR insured that the spring compressed uniformly - Which would translate to smoother slide motion. The ShokBuf prevents battering - You can see by looking at one that has been in service for a few hundred rounds that it is definitely doing it's job, and certainly beats having to dress down disturbed metal.
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No, there is no real benefit, except to the manufacturer of the guide rod and the gun company. Gun companies like them because it makes the traditional "press check" nearly impossible, which keeps the fingers away from the muzzle, meaning fewer idiots blow the tips of their fingers off because they didn't keep their finger off the trigger. Guide rod companies like them because it gives them something to make and sell.
The claimed advantage is that it increases accuracy and prevents the recoil spring from "kinking." It has been proven to have absolutely NO effect on accuracy, and the spring issue is just not a problem. Some claim that the additional weight helps with recoil. Recoil is just not an issue if you know how to properly hold the pistol. The FLGR will not do anything good for you. The problem is that it will definitely do something bad for you.
The huge disadvantage from my perspective is that the two-piece guide rods will come unscrewed at the wrong time and both the one-piece and the two-piece guide rods mean that disassembly requires one or two tools, thereby making the piece unfit for any real self-defense or combat use.
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senecaap
Member
If God had meant for the 1911 to have a FLGR, it would have been in the plans he sent J.M. Browning.
All they really do is add weight (if you need it, that's a plus) and complicate disassembly (no plus at all).
All they really do is add weight (if you need it, that's a plus) and complicate disassembly (no plus at all).
bmcgilvray
Member
I tried one in a Gold Cup for about a year then discarded it as so much baggage.
My new S&W is the first 1911 I've ever had that came with a FLGR standard.
Ran OK with it. Complicates field stripping, however.
No way to do it blindfolded with just my hands as I was taught ages ago.
Replaced it with the JMB designed original. Runs fine.
Same with the gas pedal ambi safety that precludes safe holstering in condition one.
Threw that thing away immediately and swapped in a standard Colt unit that runs perfectly.
My guess is that S&W adds this stuff as many (most?) buyers have come to believe that it's an essential bit of bling.
Ran OK with it. Complicates field stripping, however.
No way to do it blindfolded with just my hands as I was taught ages ago.
Replaced it with the JMB designed original. Runs fine.
Same with the gas pedal ambi safety that precludes safe holstering in condition one.
Threw that thing away immediately and swapped in a standard Colt unit that runs perfectly.
My guess is that S&W adds this stuff as many (most?) buyers have come to believe that it's an essential bit of bling.
hogrider05
Member
You can't do this with a FLGR. In an emergency situation it will work!!!
geneboy
Member
YES, old timers don`t like any thing different, BUT the full length g.r. puts weight out front witch helps you gets back on point faster + on older guns with looser slide to frame fit they help smooth out recoil. half a million rnds through 1911s I ain`t guessing -I know. No offense to the they didn`t build them that way in the old days Guys. But things change. we grow and learn. we must open our minds to things that scare us ;D
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mstuhr
Member
Browning/Kunhausen
I'm impressed by how many folks there are here that know more than Kuhnhausen. Too bad you all haven't written a shop manual to correct all his mistakes.
Howdy,
With the utmost respect to the likes of Browning and Kunhausen, there have been many worthwhile modifications made to the 1911 over the years by the likes of Pachmyer, Clark, Baer etc.
Because one or the other doesn't favor an idea does not necessarily mean it lacks merit.
It is like saying if cars were meant to have power steering and air-conditioning Henry Ford would have he would have designed it in to them at conception.
I think it was Jim Clark who said "If you think it helps you then it probably does". I don't remember exactly what he was commenting on, some piece of bulls eye gear that had been declared minimal in benefit.
All do respect to J.M Browning, but just because he did not include it in his original design or maybe Kunhausen won't approve,or the fact I have not written a book does not mean it won't work or benefit me.
Thanks
Mike
Originally Posted by pokute
I'm impressed by how many folks there are here that know more than Kuhnhausen. Too bad you all haven't written a shop manual to correct all his mistakes.
Howdy,
With the utmost respect to the likes of Browning and Kunhausen, there have been many worthwhile modifications made to the 1911 over the years by the likes of Pachmyer, Clark, Baer etc.
Because one or the other doesn't favor an idea does not necessarily mean it lacks merit.
It is like saying if cars were meant to have power steering and air-conditioning Henry Ford would have he would have designed it in to them at conception.
I think it was Jim Clark who said "If you think it helps you then it probably does". I don't remember exactly what he was commenting on, some piece of bulls eye gear that had been declared minimal in benefit.
All do respect to J.M Browning, but just because he did not include it in his original design or maybe Kunhausen won't approve,or the fact I have not written a book does not mean it won't work or benefit me.
Thanks
Mike
Baloney. Read and learn youngster.
The MYTH Of The Full Length Guide Rod | American Handgunner | Find Articles
bmcgilvray
Member
I tried the full-length guide rod. Shot it for a year or so and learned that it was baggage. I wasn't scared of it. It was just my personal observation. I grew from the experience. I was open-minded about it until I tried it. Now I'm close-minded about full length guide rods.
ma deuce
Member
My new E-Series has the FLGH. No special tool required except a BIC pen to push down the plug, but even that's a fiddly PITA to me - the GI plug just requires my stubby old arthritic thumb. I'm going to try replacing the FLGH and see if it affects accuracy.
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I must respectfully disagree. The .45 ACP is not so recoil intensive that extra weight is needed for control.
Knowledge of how to properly hold the weapon with the push pull of isometric tension will tame the recoil just fine. Jack Weaver, Jeff Cooper, Elden Carl, John Plahn, Thell Reed and Ray Chapman all figured this out in the 50s, which is 60 years ago or therabouts.
Things do change. We now shoot with two hands on the pistol and we control recoil not with heavy guide rods, reduced loads or compensators. We control the recoil of a full power load - a fight stopping load - with knowledge. Knowledge that has been freely available to everyone since the early 50s - the 1950s, I mean.
