,22 Long Rifle Ban in California?

[jag312]

Moderator edit:
Read post # 16, before you reply to this thread.


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I heard that there is a bill pending in Sacramento that will ban .22 Long Rifle ammunition unless the bullet is made from some substance other than lead. Is this true or an exaggeration?

 

[jag312]

Assembly Bill 3071.


Bill Text - AB-3071 Lead ammunition: shooting ranges.

 

[HKSmith]

It looks like this applies only to indoor shooting ranges and "sport shooting ranges ", whatever that means.

 

[challer61]

That means all ranges

 

[fordson]

It's a "ban" on all lead bullets, isn't it?
In CA think it helps the environment and further restricts firearm use.
It's a "twofer".

 

[Watchdog]

Ban .22 LR ammunition? .22 LR isn't even mentioned in the proposed bill 3071.

Besides, California already bans the use of all lead ammunition for hunting. Why would they continue to allow the use of lead ammo at shooting ranges, especially indoor ranges, where lead exposure and absorption is more or less guaranteed?

Does the use of non-lead ammo help protect the environment and limit wildlife's exposure to lead? Yes, of course it does. Does it limit firearms usage? I don't see how.

Matter of fact, I don't know why this would even be considered a Second Amendment issue.

 

[Buford57]

Ban .22 LR ammunition? .22 LR isn't even mentioned in the proposed bill 3071.

Besides, California already bans the use of all lead ammunition for hunting. Why would they continue to allow the use of lead ammo at shooting ranges, especially indoor ranges, where lead exposure and absorption is more or less guaranteed?

Does the use of non-lead ammo help protect the environment and limit wildlife's exposure to lead? Yes, of course it does. Does it limit firearms usage? I don't see how.

Matter of fact, I don't know why this would even be considered a Second Amendment issue.

I think the point is that while lead-free ammo has been developed for other calibers all current production .22 LR ammo of which I am aware has a lead bullet (plated or not). A ban on lead ammunition would have the result of eliminating the .22 LR.

 

[challer61]

Ban .22 LR ammunition? .22 LR isn't even mentioned in the proposed bill 3071.

Besides, California already bans the use of all lead ammunition for hunting. Why would they continue to allow the use of lead ammo at shooting ranges, especially indoor ranges, where lead exposure and absorption is more or less guaranteed?

Does the use of non-lead ammo help protect the environment and limit wildlife's exposure to lead? Yes, of course it does. Does it limit firearms usage? I don't see how.

Matter of fact, I don't know why this would even be considered a Second Amendment issue.

Try buying non lead ammunition for general range use. CCI all copper 22LR is 21 grain (fail) and $12 per 50 (fail). Of course it's an attempt to stop gun use. Treating ammunition like gun transfers is the same thing. They look for any reason. Take aways suppressors and then put in noise ordinances. At our ranges, we bring in a company to harvest the lead periodically and they pay us. Hunting with lead is no harm to the environment.

 

[LoboGunLeather]

It will be interesting to see how that works out. Maybe we can measure compliance rates in a year or two.

I'm pretty certain that a decent defense lawyer could tie up a case for a year or two with pre-trial testing of bullets by certified laboratories and forensic examiners, each of whom will be required to appear in court (evidentiary hearings and trial). Shouldn't cost the state more than $20K or so to get the pre-trial work done so they can fine me a couple hundred bucks for shooting up a few old boxes of .22 ammo. Meanwhile the lawyers can hold press conferences detailing all the drunk drivers and domestic violence cases dismissed so they could prosecute me for using lead bullets in a safe and sane manner.

Perhaps even better; forget all the pre-trial evidence objections and testing, go right to trial and cross-examine Officer Friendly or Deputy Doright on their metallurgical training and testing methods used to positively identify lead beyond a reasonable doubt.

 

[dockmurgw]

Ban .22 LR ammunition? .22 LR isn't even mentioned in the proposed bill 3071.

Besides, California already bans the use of all lead ammunition for hunting. Why would they continue to allow the use of lead ammo at shooting ranges, especially indoor ranges, where lead exposure and absorption is more or less guaranteed?

Does the use of non-lead ammo help protect the environment and limit wildlife's exposure to lead? Yes, of course it does. Does it limit firearms usage? I don't see how.

Matter of fact, I don't know why this would even be considered a Second Amendment issue.

I would agree with your analysis. Don't shoot at a range, or in the CA Condor Range (as this law references), and people can shoot all the lead 22 rounds that they want. This is an environmental issue. This is no more an attack on 2A rights than non toxic shot requirements for waterfowl. And if passed, this could spur advancements in non toxic bullet development, just like the lead ban for waterfowl did. This one would be better placed in the Lounge, because this bill is all about lead exposure, something every shooter is concerned about.

 

[BB57]

I think the point is that while lead-free ammo has been developed for other calibers all current production .22 LR ammo of which I am aware has a lead bullet (plated or not). A ban on lead ammunition would have the result of eliminating the .22 LR.

Not all, but for all practical purposes.

It is true that CCI sells a 21 gr all copper bullet, but there are numerous problems with it:

1) The best price I have seen for it is $8.99 per box of 50.

2) It launches at 1850 fps and with a 100 yard zero it has a mid range trajectory of +2.5" at 50 yards (with +1" at 25 yards and +2.3" at 75 yards. Reverse engineer those numbers and you get a ballistic coefficient of .05. That compares to 40 gr lead bullet BCs that range from .105 to .147, so 1/3 to 1/2 as good.

3) Accuracy is horrible. Expect at least twice as large a group as you get with bulk 40 gr high velocity .22 ammo in you rifle or pistol. Plan on 3 to 4 times larger than you get with standard velocity or match grade ammo.

4) It's hyper velocity ammo, so if you've got something like a High Standard Victor that only eats standard velocity ammo, forget about shooting it in CA.

5) The copper bullet is hard. If you own a classic like a Winchester 1890, this is not ammo you want to shoot in it.

 

[Eric300]

So what's next, air rifles? As far as I know, with the very small exception of a few, the vast majority of pellets are manufactured from lead. The government entities in California SUCK. They are 100% Anti 2nd and 100% hell bound on eliminating any and all types of firearms throughout the entire state. Anyone who doesn't believe that is missing something. The state of California should not receive one penny from the Federal government for anything until they wake up and change their evil ways.

 

[Wrangler Rich]

I hope they never lose a wheel weight. Do they even know where lead comes from?

 

[CH4]

I hope they never lose a wheel weight. Do they even know where lead comes from?

Since lead and the mining of lead are so bad for the environment, perhaps California should ban all electric and hybrid cars, or at least recycle car batteries into ammo. Just thinking green

 

[challer61]

I would agree with your analysis. Don't shoot at a range, or in the CA Condor Range (as this law references), and people can shoot all the lead 22 rounds that they want. This is an environmental issue. This is no more an attack on 2A rights than non toxic shot requirements for waterfowl. And if passed, this could spur advancements in non toxic bullet development, just like the lead ban for waterfowl did. This one would be better placed in the Lounge, because this bill is all about lead exposure, something every shooter is concerned about.

Since nearly all of us shoot at ranges, you're saying we should all stop shooting? At ranges the lead can be controlled and harvested. Not at a range there is not control at all.

 

[s&wchad]

Ban .22 LR ammunition? .22 LR isn't even mentioned in the proposed bill 3071.

Besides, California already bans the use of all lead ammunition for hunting. Why would they continue to allow the use of lead ammo at shooting ranges, especially indoor ranges, where lead exposure and absorption is more or less guaranteed?

Does the use of non-lead ammo help protect the environment and limit wildlife's exposure to lead? Yes, of course it does. Does it limit firearms usage? I don't see how.

Matter of fact, I don't know why this would even be considered a Second Amendment issue.

I would agree with your analysis. Don't shoot at a range, or in the CA Condor Range (as this law references), and people can shoot all the lead 22 rounds that they want. This is an environmental issue. This is no more an attack on 2A rights than non toxic shot requirements for waterfowl. And if passed, this could spur advancements in non toxic bullet development, just like the lead ban for waterfowl did. This one would be better placed in the Lounge, because this bill is all about lead exposure, something every shooter is concerned about.

This is a 2A issue because the proposed legislation would quadruple the cost of .22 LR ammunition, arguably the most commonly used round fired at ranges. It also effects shooters who cast their own bullets for economy. If enacted, this legislation will cause people to practice and shoot less. That's a bad thing.

As I understand it, CA already bans the use of lead ammo for hunting. Some jurisdictions already ban the use of lead sinkers for fishing. Waterfowl hunting and shooting over wetlands is one thing, but this is getting well out of hand. The same do-gooders encourage electric cars that use lead and lithium. This Proposed legislation is nothing more than an attack on legitimate firearm owners and our way of life.

I'm an RO at my clubs indoor range. We take extraordinary measures to protect the shooters and the environment. We have an expensive air filtration system, are tested regularly and mine the lead for recycling. We also "mine" our outdoor ranges to remove lead from the ground.

If you live in CA, do everything you can to fight this. I pray this nonsense doesn't spread elsewhere. THIS ISN'T OPEN FOR DEBATE. If you have suggestions on ways to combat this nonsense, you're free to post.

 

[LDM]

Just another slash in the "Death by a thousand cuts" strategy now used since the disarmers know they can't get outright bans and confiscations. Make it too expensive and restrictive to shoot.

I'm waiting for some leftist genius to introduce a bill to deny driver's licenses to gun owners so they can't transport weapons. It's not that far-fetched an idea for these whack jobs.