340pd Ammo problems

[cannady]

I have a new 340pd and I’ve been testing a lot of types of .357 Ammo (not interested in .38 +p) to figure out what works best. I had some pretty massive bullet pulling with 140gr silvertips. I was hoping that they would work for carry but after shooting 4 rounds the fifth was so far out of its cartridge that it was outside the cylinder and hit the forcing cone as the cylinder rotated.

A bigger problem is keyholing. Anything over 140gr seems to keyhole at 7 yards. 125-135gr stuff (all factory loads) is fine but every 158gr load has shown some keyholing. Anybody else see that?

Jim

 

[M29since14]

I’ve never had that problem with the Winchester 145gr STHPs. My supply is older stuff. That might have something to do with it?

I guess if I was having problems with that round my next choice would be a 125. I cannot handle the recoil of heavier bullets in the 340. I tried Federal 158 Hydra-shoks and suspended operations. Too mean for me.

I might check into the Remington brass-jacketed 125, or maybe something with a solid copper Barnes bullet? I haven’t given it much thought in quite a while because I’ve been satisfied with the Winchester round.

 

[just plain joe]

Not a SME on firearms, nor did I stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night. If your are getting "keyholing" at seven yards, I would say that is cause for concern. I have never heard nor experienced that phenomenon at that short a distance. I would make a call to Smith & Wesson and hear what they have to say.

I have a 340PD and this has never occurred, although I have shot very few .357's, opting for the Speer .38 Special 135 GDHP +P and prior to that, Federal .38 Special 125 JPH +P.

Good luck!

JPJ

 

[Amp]

Maybe its just the target paper? I mean its an easy thing to check.

 

[cannady]

Maybe its just the target paper? I mean its an easy thing to check.

I thought about that but I checked it using thin sheets of aluminum. 158gr make wide bullet shaped holes and 125gr ammo makes perfect .38 inch holes.

Jim

 

[Old cop]

I only put +P in my 340PD and have never had a problem w/bullet pull, but I always use semi jacketed rounds and avoid the lead hollow point stuff. The magnum stuff is too much for me to get accurate follow up shots with.

 

[kaaskop49]

Interesting problem. W-W's 145 grain .357 Silvertip was the only load that did not "pull" in my Model 360Sc of 2001, but as an earlier posted reported, it may have been because these rounds were from earlier production. Perhaps try R-P's 125 grain .357 Golden Sabre; they are loaded lighter than the regular 125gr 'planetwreckers.' I've switched to the M&P 340 with it's steel cylinder until I can discover an answer to magnum "bullet pull" in Ti cylinders.

Not being a gunsmith, but have you checked the rifling and forcing cone of the bbl? Perhaps this could account for the keyholing? Leading, maybe? Until you solve this, carry a .38 +P load that will "behave" in the cylinder during firing. As the OP stated. I'm also not interested in using .38s in these flyweights, but it beats leaving the gun home. Good luck and good shooting.

Kaaskop49
Shield #5103

 

[Flipside]

I have a new 340pd and I’ve been testing a lot of types of .357 Ammo (not interested in .38 +p) to figure out what works best. I had some pretty massive bullet pulling with 140gr silvertips. I was hoping that they would work for carry but after shooting 4 rounds the fifth was so far out of its cartridge that it was outside the cylinder and hit the forcing cone as the cylinder rotated.

A bigger problem is keyholing. Anything over 140gr seems to keyhole at 7 yards. 125-135gr stuff (all factory loads) is fine but every 158gr load has shown some keyholing. Anybody else see that?

Jim

The Silvertips you speak of using... is both the bullet and case silver in color? Did they come in a box of 50? White box, styrofoam shell organizer?

I don’t recall the grain weight of the Silvertips I’ve had success with in a 340, but that’s the specifics on the packaging... matter of point, the Silvertips that I have been using are the ONLY round that I have found that did NOT jump the crimp.

Try a search on that term: “jump the crimp” and you’ll find some posts and info on the web about manufacturers that make tame(er) stuff for these little pocket rockets.

BTW, a full house 357 Mag load in these pistols don’t get you much of a performance gain... unless you’re measuring the pummeling your hand receives, the dB of blast report, or flash (perhaps powder dependent).

 

[M29since14]

BTW, a full house 357 Mag load in these pistols don’t get you much of a performance gain... unless you’re measuring the pummeling your hand receives, the dB of blast report, or flash (perhaps powder dependent).

I agree. In fact I now think the 340PD never should have been made. I would much prefer a “940PD” (the same gun in 9x19). The empties could be more positively ejected with the short extractor rod on these guns, and the ballistic difference between the better 9mm rounds and those .357s that are actually practical to use in these lightweight guns would be/is inconsequential. And if you are not a handloader, less expensive 9mm practice ammo is readily available.

JMHO. Sorry for the drift. I’ll climb down from the soapbox now.

 

[riverrat38]

The Speer 135 gr GD Short Barrel is available in Magnum loading, as well as the plus P.
Buffalo Bore makes some really hot plus P, in both 125 gr JHP, and 158 gr FBI flavor. An advantage of the shorter cases is easier extraction, as well as quicker reloads with speed loaders.
As to the key holing, it sounds like the heavier bullets are not engaging the rifling. Maybe, they didn't get enough rifling when they made the barrel.
I agree with those who say to contact S&W service.

Best,
Rick

 

[H Richard]

Have you ever tried to re-crimp the rounds for a little tighter crimp? My preference would be the 140.

 

[Cal44]

A good load to try is the 135gr Gold Dot 357 Magnum short barrel.

It's not in the planet wrecker category. But it's stronger than the 135gr 38+p version of this load.

No trouble with crimp jump in my LCR 357, but that's a heavier gun.

 

[gnystrom]

I have not had this issue with .357's in my 340PD but thinking followup shots may be required, I only carry 135 Gr. Gold Dots.
Bullet jump with the .357's being my greatest concern which renders the gun totally useless when most needed.
When I want a reliable 357 experience, I go with a Kimber K6s or 640 Pro Series.

 

[vipermd]

I agree. In fact I now think the 340PD never should have been made. I would much prefer a “940PD” (the same gun in 9x19). The empties could be more positively ejected with the short extractor rod on these guns, and the ballistic difference between the better 9mm rounds and those .357s that are actually practical to use in these lightweight guns would be/is inconsequential. And if you are not a handloader, less expensive 9mm practice ammo is readily available.
JMHO. Sorry for the drift. I’ll climb down from the soapbox now.

Real ammo , out of real guns- all 3"bbl Corbon 125gr, 357, FPS 1313 = 478 ft/lb, Corbon 125 38 spec not + p FPS 900= 224 ft/lb, Corbon 9mm 125+p 1198 FPS = 398 ft/lb. All Corbon bullets, all real guns 3" barrel- I would believe that 478ft/lb is a significant improvement over 224 ft/lb ( 38 spec non + p), or 398 ft/lb ( 9mm+P )., Also 22 lr 40 gr 907 FPS, 3" bbl =73 ft/lb. So a 357 out of a 3" barrel125 gr = a 9mm + 22 lr. Measuring apples to apples, same weight bullet, same brand, 88 ft/lb seems like an improvement ( greater than a 22lr in energy) that I would want in a portable self defense firearm, since I cannot put a Shockwave in 12 ga in my pocket. A handgun is a compromise to a long gun, but I would want to maximize the output that it is capable of. Not just the first round or the last, all 5!! If you have medical/physical problems that prevent you from firing a 357, then use +p, or standard pressure, or even a 22 lr, but do not say that there is no significant improvement with the 357 over a 38 or +p. The numbers are from ballistics by the inch, the numbers are facts. Quality /function of the bullet can be determined, but shot placement is still the most important factor on the street, or in the woods. Be Safe,

 

[Flipside]

The Silvertips you speak of using... is both the bullet and case silver in color? Did they come in a box of 50? White box, styrofoam shell organizer?

I don’t recall the grain weight of the Silvertips I’ve had success with in a 340, but that’s the specifics on the packaging... matter of point, the Silvertips that I have been using are the ONLY round that I have found that did NOT jump the crimp.

Try a search on that term: “jump the crimp” and you’ll find some posts and info on the web about manufacturers that make tame(er) stuff for these little pocket rockets.

BTW, a full house 357 Mag load in these pistols don’t get you much of a performance gain... unless you’re measuring the pummeling your hand receives, the dB of blast report, or flash (perhaps powder dependent).

My recollection of the ammo box was wrong... it’s a *silver* box of 50. Marked WINCHESTER SUPER X. They’re 145 GR Silvertip HP, mfg no X357SHP.