.380 load (Calling Erich)

I've been digging around on the web looking for info on the Hornady Critical Defense and so far I can't find anything negative. They seem to always expand and they penetrate to 10 or 11 inches in gel. Granted, some rounds expand more then the CD and 11 inches isn't up to FBI standards but any carry piece is a compromise and we aren't using this on the street as a LE round. It's standard pressure so the little guns can handle it. I'm starting to think it may not be such a bad choice for everyday carry.
 
Ya think Power Pistol is impressive in the .380, you ought to see it in the .38super.

It is my go to powder for full power, and +P loads in all my bottom feeders!!!
 
Florida J, I have a test of Hornady Critical Defense .380 in the thread Perma-Gel Test Results (post #12 on page 2). It's decent ammo, but nothing earth-shattering either. I prefer Speer Gold Dot, but there's certainly nothing wrong with the stuff.
 
Thanks Flop-shank, that's some interesting testing. Did you ever run the Golden Sabre test?
 
Every once in a while you run across a thread and marvel at the things you can learn on a public forum. This is one of those threads. Thanks for all of the info Erich. Truly a unique knowledge base you've shared with us.

For the record I'd been carrying 95 gr. Hornady XTP JHP's in my 9x18 Mak with a velocity of around 1000 fps @ 15'. I may reconsider and go to a FMJ after reading this thread.
 
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Thanks, Andy - I know that the number of shootings I've studied with this caliber is really too small to draw any scientific conclusions, but I was certainly struck by how often the JHPs failed to adequately penetrate in .380.

I used to carry those very same Mak JHPs when they were first released in the early '90s, in my EG Mak. I've got a Soviet military Mak (more rare on these shores) now, but I miss that EG still. :o
 
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For those of us who don't "roll our own", Magtech sells a 95 gr. ball in 380, you can also order 95 gr. ball in 380 from Double Tap: DoubleTap Ammunition

Double Tap will even show you the chronos out of the very guns we've been discussing when you click on one of the individual pix to go to that round. (They have great service too; not a paid endorsement, I've just had good experience with them.)
 
Hi Brad,

I bought 100 rounds of the DT .380 ball when it first came out with great hopes, but just couldn't get it to be reliable in my P232. I gave the remainder to a friend with a P3AT, and he had similar problems.

It was a solid 100 fps faster than any other 95-gr ball I'd chrono'd.
 
Erich said:
Hi Brad,

I bought 100 rounds of the DT .380 ball when it first came out with great hopes, but just couldn't get it to be reliable in my P232. I gave the remainder to a friend with a P3AT, and he had similar problems.

It was a solid 100 fps faster than any other 95-gr ball I'd chrono'd.
Click to expand...

Hey Erich, what mean "reliable"? I haven't had any trouble with the P3AT, and have never heard of anyone else having issues. Perhaps you got a bum box? Too bad. I also run their 200 gr. Hornady XTPs through my G27 without a hitch.
 
That would be two bum boxes, then. No, there did not appear to be anything wrong with the ammo or the guns - it just appeared that the DT .380 ammo was performing outside the guns' envelope of function. (I honestly don't recall the nature of the malfs - I have pretty good notes on it at home.)

I was profoundly disappointed (and out a decent chunk of cash), as I happily used DT stuff in my .40 and my 10mm as well, and had eagerly purchased the .380 immediately upon release.

I'm not saying it's no good in all guns, just that this is a concern of which to be aware - believe me, I really wish that it had worked out differently in the guns I tried. :(
 
Well this is a very interesting subject for me since I just bought this :D

11r3imo.jpg


Shoots very well and just LOVES FMJ ammo,frankly I dislike threads with people who say what they think they know,guys like Erich make me comfortable since they've seen what actually happens.

Great thread.
 
A local dealer mentioned today that he is expecting 40 boxes of Win Ranger .380s (Talons). Any info on this round would be appreciated. I did a quick search and didn't come up with much info.
 
Brad, just checked my notes on the DT .380 malfs that I experienced back in July '07 - several hard primers that required multiple strikes to ignite and a couple of jams on feeding in both the P232 and P3AT. Might have been a bad batch, but the jams on feeding were power-related.
 
BigRich315: I am always up fpr a road trip to Florida, but I'll pass on the ammo!

Florida J-Frame: As much as I like the Ranger T's in 9, 40, & 45, I'll pass on them in .380. Winchester's own data shows them penetrating 7in. in bare gel, 8in. in 4ply denim, and 7.8in. in heavy cloth. Their data shows approximately .64-.68 expansion, which is pretty good, but that's not nearly enough penetration to suit me.
 
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.60"+ expansion really isn't what you want in a .380 and the above data shows exactly why. While I do like expansion, I don't if it limits adequate penetration. Speer and Hornady's engineers got it right as their JHPs only expand to ~.43" and are designed to stop expanding at that point. They put on the brakes, but only enough to stop the bullet from going into overpenetration. It really looks as if the cats at both companies tweeked expansion just right so that the bullet wouldn't penetrate less than 12" in gelatin. That's impressive in a cheezy, light bullet, low case capacity, low velocity caliber like .380.
 
No big deal since it was only employed as practice ammo but, in firing a box of 50 rounds of Sellier & Bellot .380, I had a couple that required a second strike in my P3AT when I practiced with it last week.
 
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