45-70 or 30-30

[Absalom]

If you are going to practice with the rifle as much as you need to (as a beginning rifle shooter planning to hunt with it), and are on a budget, get the .30-30.

I killed my first buck with a Winchester 94, one shot, the only head I ever mounted, still my proudest achievement despite many years of hunting that followed.

The .45-70 is an awesome round, and extremely versatile for a somewhat skilled rifleman. I hunted quite frequently with a Sharps replica as well as as a Marlin 1895 in later years, and the standard 300-grain HP loads from major manufacturers are great deer loads; modest recoil, and you never have to track an animal far you’ve hit properly; either they stay, the bullet just pushes them over , or there is plenty of blood.

On the other hand, buy some appropriate loads from Buffalo Bore, and the .45-70 is ready for a trip to grizzly country. It’s been used to take all Big Five in Africa from what I’ve read. As I said, extremely versatile and a great second rifle once you can afford it.

 

[Paper Clip]

Wow! Thanks for all the responses. I do want to clarify that I am not a beginner as far as shooting rifles or recoil goes. I have shot them my entire life from a .22 to a .300 winmag and most things in between. I just have not owned one yet, either used my 12 gauge or borrowed a rifle to hunt with.

 

[richcory]

I feel obligated to add a photo of my 1886 now that I have seen others share theirs.

Cory

 

[Mistered]

Plenty of responses already but I'll give a thumbs up for the 30-30 for all the aforementioned reasons. AND not that I am partial to the 30-30 (I own three) but it is an excellent choice for a 'first' rifle especially if you already have some experience.
I am glad no one has mentioned you should get an 'AR' because (on the often repeated rational) 'It's the modern sporting rifle'

 

[Paper Clip]

Plenty of responses already but I'll give a thumbs up for the 30-30 for all the aforementioned reasons. AND not that I am partial to the 30-30 (I own three) but it is an excellent choice for a 'first' rifle especially if you already have some experience.
I am glad no one has mentioned you should get an 'AR' because (on the often repeated rational) 'It's the modern sporting rifle'

I like ARs, but .223 doesnt give me a lot of confidence if I want it to be my only rifle for a while, an AR-10 in .308 would be nice but they are really expensive.

 

[Kurusu]

Recommending a 45-70 as a first rifle is like recommending a .44 Magnum as a first revolver. It's a great way to develop a flinch every time a gun goes off. I'm sure there are some manly men that went right to a big bore gun the first time they ever fired a gun and shot the eye out of a charging grizzle bear from 1,200 yards, but most people will benefit greatly from ramping up their caliber/recoil.

Of the 2, no brainer - get a 30-30, but the .22lr recommendation above is the best advise on here.

It sounds like you want a lever action, but if you are open to a bolt action gun, there are some very affordable guns in the .243 - .270 Win range of calibers that would work very well for anything you want to shoot in your area.

I don't find the recoil from my .45-70 punishing. Maybe because my "extra light" 1886 is still over 7 pounds.

 

[Capt. F.]

I own two 45-70’s, a Ruger #1 single shot and a Winchester ‘86 lever action carbine.
I’ve shot a number of deer with both using the same load WHICH IS SAFE IN MY GUNS, a Hornady 350 grn HP with 57 grains of 3031. In my guns it’s an accurate load and one that no deer ever walked away from.
Longest shot about 125 yards, bullet lodged in the off shoulder and measured 15/16”.
Deer have probably fallen to more 30-30 rounds than other calibers but as others have noted hard to beat the 45-70 for the one gun shooter especially if one handloads.

 

[500SNW]

As an afterthought, the question of whether to get a .30-30 or a .45-70 is an odd one. The two cartridges and their terminal ballistics are as different as night and day. You really need both. BUT, that said, my issue with the .30-30 is that it was/and is a very poor cartridge to have incorporated into a lever action. It may have been around 125 years, but it has a couple major flaws. It is a long cartridge - less capacity in a lever gun. It is a small diameter and fairly fast bullet - not a good choice for a tubular magazine where only flat nose bullets can be used. It is more of a flat-shooting, longer range cartridge - again, a mystery why they'd put it into a lever action with a short barrel. IDK the history of it, but I'm not sure what they were thinking when they designed a .30 caliber bottleneck cartridge for a lever gun. A 1903 Springfield with stripper clips would be superior...and history shows that the Army did exactly that.

 

[RobertJ.]

why not get yourself a .357 lever action rifle

This was an outstanding idea, and I don't know why I didn't think of it!

 

[Iggy]

50 years ago, gun cranks said the 30-30 had killed more wild game than any other rifle in America.

I think this one will still do it.

 

[Paper Clip]

This was an outstanding idea, and I don't know why I didn't think of it!

From what I have read, it is only usable up to about 50 yards. Is this true? will it take hog and deer at 100-150 yards?

 

[2ndAmendmentNut]

The 357mag in a carbine or rifle is a completely different critter than the 357mag in a pistol. It is certainly lethal at 100-150yards with an accurate load and a competent shooter.

If you can find one I do believe the Browning copies of the Winchester 92 are some of the best 357mag carbines ever produced.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[RobertJ.]

The 357mag in a carbine or rifle is a completely different critter than the 357mag in a pistol. It is certainly lethal at 100-150yards with an accurate load and a competent shooter.

He beat me to it, but in a rifle, the .357 Magnum comes pretty close to .30-30 ballistics.

The .44 Magnum would be a good choice, too, but the .357 is just extremely pleasant to shoot.

As I get older, I realize I've really become a wuss about recoil. I hot-rodded my Ruger .45-70 years ago, and remember thinking that about my dad, who I only talked into shooting it once. Now, I am him!

 

[Jessie]

You know, the AR was mentioned and it's not a totally of the wall choice when you think about it. They are getting very inexpensive lately.
Get a .243 upper and you have a great low recoil hunting round.
Later if you want more, add another upper in .450 Bushmaster.
I think they all even use the same magazines.
Heck, you can even get a .22 conversion kit for it.
All that and it's a fine defense gun.
So if you like ARs, there's some things going for them.

 

[Drm50]

I think it was Jack OConnor that wrote anyone who can't go in the woods with a 30/30 and come out with their game, has no
business in the woods. I don't know why so many bad mouth 30/30s. They do require a little more experience to shot long
range but at most eastern hunting ranges they shoot as good as
any .30cal.

 

[gregintenn]

Between the two choices you listed, I'd go with the 30-30. That being said, I'd look for a nice pre 64 model 94 Winchester or an older 336 Marlin without a safety. These can still be found for roughly the price of a new Marlin, yet are much higher quality rifles. For a few dollars more, you can pick up an old model 99 Savage.

 

[Frank46]

I had a cousin who is no longer with us. He had one rifle, a model 1893 marlin in 30-30. That rifle was used for everything. Deer, ground hogs and killing the 2 or 3 pigs he raised each year and slaughtered early winter for meat. He never had much money so the old marlin did it all. I'd go hunting with him as he knew many of the local landowners and more than once helped drag a deer out of the woods and tie it across the hood of my old dodge dart. He didn't even have a cleaning kit so one night in his trailer we disassembled it and gave the old girl a good cleaning. That old marlin was pretty dirty and definitely in need of a good cleaning. I have a small tool box with cleaning stuff, an assortment of screwdrivers and one of the Swiss cleaning kits that came with the STG 57 with brushes, bore inspection mirror and the cleaning rod was made in 5 sections with brass pieces on each section so the steel wouldn't wear on the rifling. Made up an adaptor so could use inch threaded cleaning bore brushes with the metric cleaning rod. Couple bottles with cleaning solvents. Frank

 

[Old Corp]

Have far too many deer rifles, but like many, started with a .30-30. Awful hard to beat for the Eastern US. Took my first several with it, and also enjoyed the handful I've taken with a Ruger No. 1 .45-70.
For economics, the .30-30 wins hands down.

 

[old&slow]

FYI, over my chrono my 158 gr. .357 load goes 1243 fps. out of a 4" revolver. Out of my 16" Rossi 92 the same load goes 1677 fps. A 400 + fps jump.

I've never hunted wild oinker's , I think a .357 might /could do the job.
But, would much rather have a .44 ,, or a 45-70 ,, or even a 30-30. Just my two cents..

 

[mrchuck]

I own and shoot my Winchester 94 in 30-30.
Nothing better, and I have an arsenal of bolt actions.
I do not shoot really long distance in the mountans anymore, but shooting the fields and assorted brush and timber in East Texas.
NOTHING is better nor easier to carry and take aim and shoot than my Model 94 Winchester, or my scoped out Marlin lever.
Both are in 30-30.
You would be an ignoramus if you passed by a lever action 30-30.
Nuff said,,,,,,,,,,,,,