460 PC Bone Collector Cylinder issue ?

[jfmnh]

RIDE-RED,

Your timing could not be better.

Smith received my gun on 3/6 and i got it back today.

It looks great, they "refinished" the cylinder, thats all.

There is no fouling so i have to assume that they did not shoot it. I guess i will find out if the cylinder is hitting the top strap this week when i shoot it ...

 

[HarrishMasher]

RIDE-RED,

Your timing could not be better.

Smith received my gun on 3/6 and i got it back today.

It looks great, they "refinished" the cylinder, thats all.

There is no fouling so i have to assume that they did not shoot it. I guess i will find out if the cylinder is hitting the top strap this week when i shoot it ...

Please shoot it as soon as possible and let us know. I am really curious.

I find it hard to believe they did not test fire it. That would make no sense.

Just curious, did you have the gun in-hand and inspect it before you purchased it? Just curious, if you saw those marks why did you go ahead with the purchase? Especially a $1,700 purchase.

 

[jfmnh]

Please shoot it as soon as possible and let us know. I am really curious.

I find it hard to believe they did not test fire it. That would make no sense.

Just curious, did you have the gun in-hand and inspect it before you purchased it? Just curious, if you saw those marks why did you go ahead with the purchase? Especially a $1,700 purchase.

Yea, i thought that smith test fires all the guns that come in for repair, they may have just fired it and cleaned it up.

Yes, i inspected the gun at the gun shop and saw the marks, which at the time just looked like fouling. It wasnt until i got it home and tried to clean off the "fouling" that i noticed that they were actually scratches.

If i saw they were scratches would i still have purchased it ? Probably, knowing how hard it is to find one of these and knowing that i could just send it back to smith to make it right.

If i thought at the time the cylinder was coming into contact with the top strap would i have still purchased it ? Not a chance ...

 

[mikey460sw]

That's great you had a good turn around time!!!! I need to call s&w about my 460xvr PC that been there since 3/3 I called 3/16 and they told me by the end of the week I should hear some thing nothing yet. I think I'm going to call on Monday to see what's up. Did they email you when it was being shipped back to you or did you just get a call for fedex to come pick it up?

 

[jfmnh]

That's great you had a good turn around time!!!! I need to call s&w about my 460xvr PC that been there since 3/3 I called 3/16 and they told me by the end of the week I should hear some thing nothing yet. I think I'm going to call on Monday to see what's up. Did they email you when it was being shipped back to you or did you just get a call for fedex to come pick it up?

Mikey,

I hope that you get your 460 back soon.

I sent my 460 back through the dealer where i purchased it, So i just got a call back from the dealer yesterday when it arrived.

However i did call smith at the beginning of the week to get status and they told me it would likely ship on Thursday.

 

[RIDE-RED 350r]

HAHA! Funny how "timing" works sometimes, eh?

I got an email from S&W when my 460 started the trip back home. I don't recall if there was tracking or not... I want to say there was.

But yes, they do let you know when it is on it's way back to you.

 

[mikey460sw]

Thanks for the info red ride and jfmnh I never had to send any thing back to s&w before I'm starting to worry a little about my 460.

 

[mstem]

I think that maybe before any more hand wringing and lamenting that maybe people should wait and see what S&W does. It hasn't even yet been confirmed that there is a problem by a independent gunsmith or S&W.

Give em a chance guys for cripes sake!

ANYTHING mass produced will have some with issues get to the customer....

Sorry if I am not taking my seat on the bash-wagon.

When you pay that kind of money for a gun from the Performance Center it should be problem free!!! Those guns aren't mass produced!

 

[davetnitro]

When you pay that kind of money for a gun from the Performance Center it should be problem free!!! Those guns aren't mass produced!

I have to agree, i bought an M&P R8, PC.. that started to fall apart while shooting,
first the crane screw came loose, i tightened and added a little loctite, a short time later,
while shooting, i found the ejector rod backing out, causing the cylinder to be forced toward the frame, caused a bunch of scratches in the black scandium, while checking that out, i also found the barrel retain nut was loose to almost falling off. Sent it back to S&W, they 'tightened' everything up, and did some refinish on the scratched frame.. i was a bit upset,
as that is a $1359 gun, that should not have parts coming loose. and 4 week turnaround time for repairs

 

[RIDE-RED 350r]

When you pay that kind of money for a gun from the Performance Center it should be problem free!!! Those guns aren't mass produced!

You are right.

I came across a bit strong in that post, I apologize for that. But I still feel the same way in that inspection even by a 3rd party gunsmith to diagnose/verify the problem was in order, and S&W deserved the chance to rectify it if there is/was a problem. It just seemed to me that people were piling on before a problem was confirmed and S&W given a chance to fix it.

At any rate, I hope everything turns out OK for the OP. Looking forward to hearing a report from him either way.

 

[RIDE-RED 350r]

Still no update???

Odd......

 

[jfmnh]

Still no update???

Odd......

Not so odd given that i have worked 156 hours in the last two weeks ... My recreation time has had to take a back seat.

-John

 

[RIDE-RED 350r]

Not so odd given that i have worked 156 hours in the last two weeks ... My recreation time has had to take a back seat.

-John

Roger that. Work before play.

Just very interested in how this turns out for you, hopefully well.

 

[jfmnh]

I finally made it to the range today to shoot the 460. A heck of a lot of fun i must say. However, very disappointing with respect to the gun. After just a couple of rounds of Federal 275 grain loads, the "contact" marks returned. I am convinced that the cylinder is contacting the top strap. Apparently smith thinks that this is OK, but i dont see anyone else with this issue. So do i send it back again ?

 

[dano1200r]

I've been following your problem. Your cylinder frame is out of spec. Hence the top strap makes contact with the cylinder.
I dont think much can be done other than to mill out part of the frame, providing theres enough meat left on when done. Otherwise you need basically a whole new gun. This is probably why S&W doesn't want to make it right.
This problem will only get worse as you shoot it.
Document it all and try for a refund, then buy one you can inspect prior to purchase. Good luck.

 

[RIDE-RED 350r]

Well, due to the limitations of my outdated computer, I cannot see the pic in enough detail to offer an opinion.

Thanks for the update, and I hope that S&W makes this right for you.

Can you feel or hear the cylinder dragging at all as you rotate it?

Just thinking out loud, seems like it might feel a bit "sticky" during rotation if the frame and cylinder are touching enough to make marks on the cyl.

To be completely honest with you, it looks like normal residue that is deposited after firing. But as I said, I can't see the pic in enough detail with my equipment. No argumentative intent here.

 

[jfmnh]

I've been following your problem. Your cylinder frame is out of spec. Hence the top strap makes contact with the cylinder.
I dont think much can be done other than to mill out part of the frame, providing theres enough meat left on when done. Otherwise you need basically a whole new gun. This is probably why S&W doesn't want to make it right.
This problem will only get worse as you shoot it.
Document it all and try for a refund, then buy one you can inspect prior to purchase. Good luck.

You may be right, the gap between the top strap and the cylinder looks to be about 1/3 the space than on any of my rugers and my wifes 638-3.

 

[dano1200r]

Yes, you should see a constant gap along the back strap which allows room for normal barell rotation. As you have, compare yours to pics on the S&W website to compare.

 

[jfmnh]

Well, due to the limitations of my outdated computer, I cannot see the pic in enough detail to offer an opinion.

Thanks for the update, and I hope that S&W makes this right for you.

Can you feel or hear the cylinder dragging at all as you rotate it?

Just thinking out loud, seems like it might feel a bit "sticky" during rotation if the frame and cylinder are touching enough to make marks on the cyl.

To be completely honest with you, it looks like normal residue that is deposited after firing. But as I said, I can't see the pic in enough detail with my equipment. No argumentative intent here.

The rotation and trigger on this gun are smooth as silk, just what you would expect from the PC.

 

[RIDE-RED 350r]

The rotation and trigger on this gun are smooth as silk, just what you would expect from the PC.

OK, so from the top: What you believe is happening is that during firing of a round the cylinder hits the top strap during recoil? I would think that if this is happening that you might be able to jiggle the cylinder manually to close the gap between the cylinder and top strap. Might be worth checking the way you would check end shake. Take a measurement with no upward pressure on the cylinder, then apply upward pressure and see what it measures if you can get a gauge in there.

Have you run a feeler gauge between the two to get a measurement?? I wonder what the gap measures.

This is very puzzling to me. Maybe we can figure out something you can put your finger on and specifically report it to Smith. The cylinder should not hit the top strap during recoil.

 

[ruggyh]

looks like power burns- try wiping them of with a lead away cloth.
Typical for 460 and 500

 

[F75gunslinger]

RIDE-RED,

Your timing could not be better.

Smith received my gun on 3/6 and i got it back today.

It looks great, they "refinished" the cylinder, thats all.

There is no fouling so i have to assume that they did not shoot it. I guess i will find out if the cylinder is hitting the top strap this week when i shoot it ...

Most of us can only guess without having the gun in our hands. That being said..I still think that the marks in question are residual carbon from firing. Do you have a lead away cloth or some mother's that you can try to see if the marks go away?

 

[Marloe]

Look at the right side of the revolver. There is a screw that is a key screw that holds the internal cylinder pivot rod. It is advised to tighten that screw that gets loose from the pressure and impact of the round. This can be very dangerous. This screw can be coated with purple threadloc. then re-installed. It is imparative to check all screws on any 454 Casull and higher power revolvers. tighten the screw and if it was loose, it may have been your dangerous problem. With it loose, the cylinder can be fired misaligned.

 

[Marloe]

Its the screw just below the cylinder I have seen this twice with this frame. ALWAYS check screws on all big bore powerful hand guns.