66-1 6.125-in barrel

[clevolver]

I just picked up a 66-1 today, after having my eye out for one for most of the last year or so.

I got home and measured the barrel and it's a 6.125", which I've read is a rarer length (most 66-1's with "6 inch" barrels actually measure 5 7/8th's, so I've heard.) Does anyone know just how many in this length left the factory?

It's in beautiful shape, owner says he believes it's only seen 12 rounds through it, fired by him. Previous owner supposedly had it in the safe a long time, may never have fired it.

 

[trashy]

Clevolver, I also have a 66-1 with the 6.125" barrel, sounds like in close to same cosmetic condition as yours. I am curious to know number possibly shipped myself.

There's no doubt someone will come along with the answer.

 

[diamonback68]

I'm not sure why you think they are rare. Almost all 6" guns may vary by as much as 1/8", depending on frame cut out, gap and barrel set-back etc.

 

[clevolver]

I've read it in numerous listings for 66-1's that I've seen while I've been looking. None of them can cite a number of barrels that were produced in the 5.875" or 6.125" lengths, though, nor do they cite a reference that I can verify. So that's why I'm asking.

As for the notion that barrel lengths normally vary by +/- 1/8th inch, that strikes me as very strange. Why would this dimension have such a loose variance, when all other parts on the gun have tolerances measured in thousands or ten thousands of an inch? Surely S&W are capable of making barrels the length that they intend them to be.

 

[diamonback68]

As for the notion that barrel lengths normally vary by +/- 1/8th inch, that strikes me as very strange. Why would this dimension have such a loose variance, when all other parts on the gun have tolerances measured in thousands or ten thousands of an inch? Surely S&W are capable of making barrels the length that they intend them to be.

Internal parts yes, frames castings, cylinders and barrels not so much so. Examples: Cylinders need to be milled and machined off square faced, there can be variations there. The front of the frame has variations. Barrel are threaded on the rear and there are variations on the milling of the muzzle crown. When the barrels are threaded onto to the frame fully, the sights can be canted somewhat left or right, so the barrel face behind the thread may have to be milled several thousands to get the barrel centered up. Bottom line is, there is probably no such thing as an exact 6" gun and what difference does it make anyway, it's classified as a six inch gun. Look at J-frame snubbies they are called a 2" gun, but in reality they are 1 7/8" guns, again plus or minus variations on the 1 7/8".
In my opinion, there is nothing special about your gun.

 

[murphydog]

My recollection is there was a proposed law (in the 1970s?) that would have made 6" or less barrel revolvers illegal to buy in a certain state, so 6 1/8" barrels were made to avoid any problems. Much like the 4 1/4" revolvers sent to Canada.

 

[clevolver]

murphydog, that sounds plausible. I have no idea if it's true or not, but it would make sense.

I'm going to have to get a ruler out and measure all my revolver barrels to see how exact the rest of them are. I could see them being off by a small amount, but an eighth of an inch either way seems a bit much.

 

[flagman1776]

I had my M19-3 at the Springfield Service Center back when Officers were allowed to bring guns in... 1977 or so. In the course of the inspection, the barrel cylinder gap was out of spec. The barrel was removed & turned in a turn. Of course the barrel shoulder had to be recut & the extractor shortened as well as the barrel face & forcing cone. So now my barrel is slightly under the original 4" length.

My take is the threading is what can vary & everything keys off that. You have a good gun, leave it at that.

 

[sandwtrader]

Perhaps someone could investigate the possibility of a lawsuit regarding advertized 6" guns having 5 7/8" barrels and using the Model 66 as an example. S&W produced M66-1's for about 6 months with 6 1/8" barrels. Well outside any "tolerance" factors. And you won't find any other model with that same length barrel.

 

[clevolver]

The best advise you will get on this issue, you have already ignored. You should say a "Thank you" to Dick. You have a std. 6 inch barrel gun with std. variation in the barrel length. But, measure to your hearts content, that is one way to learn. The advice of your betters is another simple way to learn. If you use a micrometer or an electron microscope I am sure you will detect even greater variation and uniqueness in your gun.
The most unique thing about your gun is the serial number, it is a one of a kind.
S&W made guns to sell and make a profit. The little bitty variations that collectors and others find falls within the realm of std. deviation.
Enjoy the study of your gun and maybe you can specialize your collection to the variation of 6 inch Model 66 barrels.
Bill@Yuma

Sorry if I seem like I'm ignoring my betters. I haven't discounted what anyone has said on this thread, but I am interested in learning more.

No one here has yet to give any explanation for why so many listings for 66-1's with 6" barrels that measure 6.125" claim to be "rare". I've heard opinions that they are not in fact unusual, which is fine, but I'm still interested to know if there are numbers kept, or why so many people selling 66-1 6.125" barreled revolvers are claiming that they're less common. Seriously, search gunbroker and other sites for a while and count the number of listings that mention this.

I'm not saying I know better than Dick, or anyone else for that matter -- I'm asking why do so many people who are selling them seem to think this is an "unusual" length, and is it in fact unusual/rare. If it's not, no problem, but if there are production numbers available from the factory that would really put it to bed for me. I do appreciate all the feedback on this thread and from the forum members here, who are more experienced and knowledgeable than I am.

 

[clevolver]

A few examples for sale:

Item:8682148 Smith & Wesson S&W model 66-1 6-1/8 in 357 Magnum revolver pinned-recessed For Sale at GunAuction.com

"You are bidding on an S&W model 66-1 with the rare 6-1/8" pinned barrel."

Smith & Wesson 66-1 .357 Magnum (PR24722) - Collectors Firearms

"Smith & Wesson 66-1 .357 Magnum caliber revolver. Rare model made with 6 1/8" barrel. According to the Smith & Wesson book, only a small batch of these were made in the 1970's. Most 6" models .66's were actually 5 7/8"."

Smith & Wesson 66-1 .357 Magnum (PR24722) - Smith & Wesson Model 66 Revolvers

And some discussions on this forum in other threads in the past:

http://smith-wessonforum.com/s-w-revolvers-1961-1980/168773-6-1-8-model-66-1-a.html

http://smith1b-dev.techiemedia.net/...tk-value-model-66-1-6-1-8-th-inch-barrel.html

Seems there are three theories as to "why":

1) It's just normal variance, and depending on how a barrel is fitted it might be +/- 0.125" from the standard measurement.
2) S&W briefly wanted to ensure they were legal if some pending legislation mandating 6" or longer barrels passed.
3) S&W changed to 5 7/8" in order to be under 6" for some shooting competition where barrel lengths had to be under.

Still haven't seen any figures on how many in each length were produced, just references to "The Book" which apparently may be where everyone who claims 6.125 is rare is getting their information from. But no quantities of each length -- possibly because S&W considered them all to be 6" barrels, if the first theory is correct. There are some who'll pay a slight premium for the longer length. Not that it matters to me all that much -- I'm not really into collecting for investment, but I do like to know what I have and what it's worth.

So, it's all trivia I suppose, but it's still interesting to me.

 

[Murdock]

"Rare" in a listing frequently means "It's the only one like it I have for sale right now." Beware hype.

 

[diamonback68]

In over ten years here on this forum and a member of the S&W Collectors Assn, this is the first time I recall this ever being brought up. I know of no one who looks for or collects 6 1/8" 66s. We have pointed our other errors in the book before and this may have been started as a factory worker rumor, who knows. Personally I am not going to get excited by a mere 1/8" if they exist, seems minutia to me when there are known variations in barrel lengths also given the real world fact that 6" and 8 3/8" Smiths bring less than other barrel lengths. Sellers will tell you anything to pump up the price of their gun and look for a quick sale.
I have always work off the old saying, "buy the gun, not the story", it has served me well.