8 shot revolver differences and considerations

Wide variety of opinions above. I use a TRR8 with a Streamlight TLR 3. Yes there are brighter lights but this one doesnt extend past the muzzle and I think it is plenty bright enough. I agree that a shorter barrel provides less leverage for a takeaway but the benefits of the light outweigh that for me. My TRR8 has never given me any problem and has been very accurate right out of the box. Loaded with some 38 +P or some low to mid level defensive 357, it should be adequate for a HD gun.

I like an 8 shot revolver better than an semi-auto because I believe it is more reliable.

I like the steel 627's too and they work fine but the light attachment on the TRR8 seals the deal for me.

I'm a rightie but I practice 2 handed DA Leftie and Rightie and 1 handed Leftie and Rightie. At action range distances, I am pretty confident except for 1 handed leftie. Just an excuse to practice more.
 
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A Rant Regarding Weapon Lights

I use a TRR8 with a Streamlight TLR 3.
I like the steel 627's too and they work fine but the light attachment on the TRR8 seals the deal for me.

Regarding weapon lights and lights. Here are a few of my considerations and concerns.

1. THERE ARE AS MANY CONS TO THE USE OF WHITE LIGHT AS THERE ARE PROS
As Delta Force former operator Larry Vickers puts it, "I have discovered that there are as many cons to the use of white light at night as there are pros. White light is without peer as a tool to identify threats and target discriminate; however it can also be used against you by illuminating your position for the enemy. This potentially fatal flaw is often overlooked or not fully understood in the world of tactical training as we know it today."

As a result, you have manufacturers just encouraging people to buy rather than asking if you buy, will you take the necessary training so the light is an asset and not a potentially lethal liability.

2. YOU MUST HAVE SPECIAL TRAINING OR CHANCES ARE YOU ARE A TARGET
While there are numerous legitimate uses for a weapon light (executing a no-knock warrant on a team e.g.), in a civilian self-defense application, generally they will make you a target unless you have had the right training in how to employ them without you yourself becoming a target. Too often the untrained just leave their weapon light on because of the false security it provides and use it as if their searching for a lost item. Tritium sites are generally enough unless the light is just too low. Use your light as a last resource and with the proper training.

3. DO YOU KNOW WHAT THE HV TECHNIQUE IS?
If you don't know how to use a light to get the guy to shoot the spot where you just left, you may have a lack of training. That particular skill is called the, 'HV technique' and is basic to weapon light / flash light tactical training. The HV technique involves special manipulation of a light accompanied by movement.

Developed by Vickers and Hackathon, it has also been called the 'flashbulb technique'. May I respectfully say that if you have a weapon light or even a flashlight you use with your weapon, and the HV discipline is unfamiliar to you, you have perhaps a liability level lack of training. Not legal liability - health liability. The light manufacturers will never tell you this. The ops guys fighting at night in low light will.

4. IMMEDIATE SELF DEFENSE NEEDS GENERALLY WON'T HAVE TIME OR NEED FOR A WEAPON LIGHT:
In a typical street robbery, carjacking, home invasion, or similar crime resulting in a need for immediate self defense, there will be neither the time nor the need to deploy a weapon light or flashlight as much as their manufacturers will deny that. These events simply do not take place in total darkness, the distance involved is typically under seven feet, and in a low light environment.

5. HAVING A PLAN AS A HOMEOWNER:
You the homeowner should know the layout of the home, the location of choke points and obstacles, and have a general plan of action built on that knowledge. You won't need the flashlight for navigation. The primary purpose of the flashlight for the homeowner will be target identification and target discrimination. In other words, you the armed homeowner need to know for certain if that is an intruder in the hallway or your teenage son sneaking in after curfew.

6. THERE ARE WORSE THINGS THAN BEING SHOT - KILLING YOUR SPOUSE OR CHILD ACCIDENTALLY IS ONE OF THEM.
Brutal statistic: weapons bought for home defense are more likely to be used accidentally against a family member than on an intruder. There are worse things than being shot, and killing your own child or spouse is one of them. Today with weapon lights being in vogue, we now have multiple cases of people trying to activate their lights, and in extreme stress they instead discharged their weapon shooting someone.

There are numerous cases of cops making this mistake, so much so that the Force Science Institute said gun-mounted flashlights are implicated in an overall increase of accidental police shootings.

Anyway, if you are trying to light up the shadowy figure in the hall, but shoot your child unintentionally, you will have to live with the consequences.

How does this happen?

7. Civilians and cops are sometimes using their trigger finger to activate their lights either having no idea that the practice is wrong or not being cognizant that they are doing that. As Sam Preston points out, that has three consequences: 1.) By activating the light with your trigger finger you may lose valuable time when making a deadly force decision. 2.) Accidently turning on your light when you needed to pull the trigger. 3.) Accidently discharging your weapon when you intended to turn on your light.

8. Weapon lights should be activated with the thumb of your non-dominate hand, and then you should be drawing daily to forge the correct muscle memory. Few homeowners are going to train with the light on the gun to the point of learning to work the switches without getting a finger near the trigger, particularly under high stress. Then of course there's the phenomena of trigger searching, even among the highly trained.

9. MANUFACTURERS HAVE AN AGENDA: SELL YOU WHAT THEY ARE MAKING
Some civilians seem to love tactical gear and will often buy it without taking the necessary training to make it a tool and not a life-threatening liability. That's not your fault. That doesn't matter when you're buying 5.11 Tactical Pants at Gander Mountain. It matter when it's your weapon. Manufacturers market this stuff with articles like selecting the best light by SureFire. But please remember: "Whenever you alter something about a lethal piece of gear — like adding a rail-mounted light — you have to include the appropriate level of training." Sam Preston, 21 year LE trainer.

10. THE LIGHT IS A PROACTIVE INSTRUMENT, THE HANDGUN IS A REACTIVE INSTRUMENT
Here is a major principle; there is a distinct difference between the low light needs of a SWAT police officer or a military door kicker (who are both quite often tasked with going into dark places to actively seek out bad guys) and the role of the private citizen in self defense. Because the flashlight is a "proactive instrument," whereas the handgun in self-defense is a "reactive instrument." And so without special training, they can be inherently incompatible in your hands. BTW, LE training generally teaches weapon lights have two and only two functions: 1. Identify threats. 2. Searches in Force Situations. That's it.

11. WHITE LIGHT CAN EQUAL BULLET SPONGE
In our agency State training we were taught to use white weapon light extremely sparingly if at all. Tritium sites are by far the preferred method if your eyes can identify targets using ambient lighting. There is no better way to announce to the world your exact location during periods of low light than turning on a white light. It gives the enemy an exact fix on your whereabouts and can turn your white light into a bullet sponge.

Even some law enforcement agencies can wrongly teach that once you have a subject illuminated you should keep it illuminated. That technique works well if you know you only have one threat; however if there are other threats nearby it is good way to become a human bullet trap. Use your white light conservatively until you have a definite handle on who you're up against. You can always use more white light if needed – it is much more difficult to teach yourself to use less.

12. MY PERSONAL EXPERIENCE WITH THE DANGER OF LIGHT
In 2009 city LE had chased an armed subject through the bank he just robbed, through an adjacent retirement facility, and finally in to a wooded area. Myself and another State officer showed up just as the guy had hit the woods. It was dusk, within another 20 minutes we had like 30 officers from city, county, state, and federal showed up from Birmingham. No one was stupid enough to activate a light, any light. We established a perimeter and waited for the county's thermal imaging to show up. Still didn't find the guy, just saw a lot of orange dots that was the body heat of birds in the trees, so when I left they were just sitting the perimeter until sunrise when they went in and got him the next morning.

Brutally long, sorry guys. But I feel better.
 
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Wow! That was a lot to get off your chest :) Personally, I've never felt the need for a tactical light at home. IMO, nite sights are sufficient for my low-light environment. Plus, I've memorized the location of all the claymores, and that's tacti-cool enough for me ;)
 
I like a tactical light with laser combo. Mine also has night sights. I want to know who I am pointing at but only at the last surprise second.
 
Thinking about getting an 8 shot revolver for home defense. Looking at the 627, TRR, and R8. There are some obvious differences in looks and weight, but what are the significant differences between these models that might affect their use as a home defense gun? Are there any performance/reliability issues to be aware of? I would anticipate putting 2500-3000 rounds per year through it.

Thanks in advance.
You should be OPK with as you have 8 rounds of 357 Mag cartridges. You probably know that in Evans Marshals tests he found the 357 125 gr SJHP by Federal or Remington (not Remington's low power 357 mag) to be a 97% 1 shot stopper if the bullet hit the torso.

That being said, I would rather have a 40 S&W for a home defense gun. This is because I am an old codger of 72 and a 357 is a little hard for to control with that powerful recoil fore a quick 2nd shot. I have a full size, all steel, Witness in 40 S&W that has very little felt recoil due to it being a semi auto, it has over 13 shots and loaded with Corbon135 gr SJHP the muzzle velocity is about 1300 fps which is close to 357 magnum velocity and energy with much less felt recoil. In Evan's Marshalls study, he shows this round also has a 97% 1 shot stop ration if the miscreant ( I always wanted to use that word ) is hit in the torso.

It se4ems to me that 5the gun you like would serve yuou well and of course, the 357 Magnum revolver is one of the most versitle guns you can get.
 
Of all the guns I have owned, my 627 PC 5" is my favorite. I'm trying to buy a second, just to have a spare.

I would absolutely go with the 5" barrel, unless it is also for CC.

I have revolvers with 2.5" to 9.5" barrels. The 5" 627 is very nimble and agile. The cg is rearward, towards the grip. The slab sided and tapered barrel makes the nose light. It is an ideal house gun, while still being easy to shoot at distance for other uses.

Personally, I can't imagine spraying more than 8 rounds inside my own home. A riot outside, perhaps.
 
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My 627 Perf Ctr has been a big disappointment. It's been back to S&W and I also paid an expert smith a few hundred dollars to try an correct it's design faults. Shoots 38 spcl all day, but 357 FMJs will clog the forcing cone with jacketing material to the point it locks up. The wheel also freezes after 8 or so quick shots of any 357 bullet technology. You must let it cool several minutes before it will open again. Two half moon clips do come with it from S&W. I have a model 60, 3 inch that shoots any 357s I put through it without fail. Put the same stuff in the 627 and no go. On the good side, when the 627 does fire, it's as accurate as shooting a nine. Big frame sucks up the recoil. RMB
 
If you decide to use .357 Magnum Loads for Home Defense make sure you are well versed on Sign Language and Lip Reading because you are not going to have much hearing left if you shoot some rounds off indoors without hearing protection.

Even if you can only go 10+1, a 9mm Glock CZ, Sig or S&W auto may not be a bad way to go.

Or .38 special for Home Defense in your 8-Shot .357 is certainly an option as well.

I personally was in the process of selling off some guns and going to get a Class III stamp for a suppressor for my Sig P226 and get Sub-Sonic 9mm rounds for HD. But I waited too long, and my home State of Connecticut banned new Suppressors and threaded barrels. Yup lots of Problems with Criminals up here offing each other "Silently".

Whichever way you go, best of luck, and hopefully you'll never have to use it for the purpose you have asked here.
 
The notion of shooting someone off while they have ahold of the gun barrel itself is just not real practical. It's possible, but not at all likely. Clint Smith has made similar statements regarding someone grabbing a shotgun and it just isn't realistic and shows he doesn't understand the dynamics of that particular facet of self-defense.

I wouldn't restrict my knowledge to only coming from those who have actually been involved in gunfights.

Ever read Stressfire? I'm guessing not or you'd remember that Ayoob advocates the changing of the vector of the long gun also.

I've already submitted that allowing someone to grab your gun is less than ideal. I realize that the most effective disarm techniques center upon targeting the trigger guard, changing the direction of the muzzle toward the operator, and finally breaking his finger during the strip. The individual who taught me that wasn't an author either, but I'd not question his expertise on the subject.

Jim Cirillo was on the stakeout squad in NYC. Based on the number of gunfights he was involved in, he is a solid reference from which to draw from, especially since the OP is using a revolver to defend himself. He was not just another cop, but rather a member of a group that was immersed in a combat situation regularly. In fact the stakeout squad was so highly effective at winning gunfights and killing their opposition that they were disbanded due to political pressure stemming from the demographics of the suspects.

I concede that it is not wise to restrict ones knowledge, but the voice of experience should be heeded, lest we relearn old lessons with new bleeding.
 
My 627 Perf Ctr has been a big disappointment. It's been back to S&W and I also paid an expert smith a few hundred dollars to try an correct it's design faults. Shoots 38 spcl all day, but 357 FMJs will clog the forcing cone with jacketing material to the point it locks up. The wheel also freezes after 8 or so quick shots of any 357 bullet technology. You must let it cool several minutes before it will open again. Two half moon clips do come with it from S&W. I have a model 60, 3 inch that shoots any 357s I put through it without fail. Put the same stuff in the 627 and no go. On the good side, when the 627 does fire, it's as accurate as shooting a nine. Big frame sucks up the recoil. RMB

Have you measured the chambers?

How about have you looked at the finish of the chambers?

Consider having it finish reamed....again....
 
I see no reason to water down your home defense firearm by choosing 38 Spl ammo, even the excellent Gold Dot 135 grain +P. Muzzle blast in confined space is indeed an issue. I have electronic ears or ear muffs near by as does my wife. The special mounting rails are standard on my Glock G20SF as well as a customized older G20 with a light continually mounted as primary night gun. I use a convention flashlight to illuminate while I investigate. It is poor practice to point a loaded gun at some unknown until it is identified as a threat. Use of the non-dominate hand to active the light is my preferred technique. I like the 8 shot stainless steel 4 inch 627 with 8-shot full moon clips for reloads. I typically fire single shots at varmints about the farm, easily reloaded as singles, lessening the hassle of a 7 round moon clip with an empty 8th round. Shotguns and rifles are an immediate option if time allows and the parameters of the threat or action are known. If you stick your handgun out in dualist fashion, perhaps your technique of house searching needs to be re-evaluated. If no lives are at risk, let them have the stereo and call the police. Ambushes are your best response, rather than give that advantage away to someone else. If you bedroom door is broken open from the outside, it will be pretty obvious to a jury that you avoided a deadly encounter until no other choice was available to you. If you choose a handgun for home defense, keep you current handgun as a second backup. Get fully dressed, double armed and mobile phone in hand if the situation called for a response. A pistol does have reduced flash in equal size cartridges due to no barrel-cylinder gap. A good revolver has less to remember under stress. Your choice. The memory under stress Glock 15 rds vs S&W 8 rds is somewhat of an issue. Either one is hopefully a squeeze and shoot until problem is solved, long before either runs dry if I have my wish.
 
I'm not sure I would be giving up much with 38 special +P from the standpoint of real world effectiveness and I think you would see a gain in the amount of aimed fire you could produce in a given amount of time compared to 357 magnum due to recoil. Also, the ability to use the same load in the 642 is a plus. As for sound, 8 rounds of 38 is going to be pretty darn loud indoors. I like the idea of muffs near the bed - I may incorporate that into our barricade location for the whole family.

Again, being in CA, the comparison becomes 10+1 vs. 8 shots with regard to capacity, so while no small decrease, it isn't as cut and dry as it might be if standard capacity mags were available.
 
How about just another 642? Then you are at the ten round point, and have a total spare, which allows for any mechanical break down. I have a 327, and a 627 and am far more likely to carry two jframes than the larger revolvers.
 
How about just another 642? Then you are at the ten round point, and have a total spare, which allows for any mechanical break down. I have a 327, and a 627 and am far more likely to carry two jframes than the larger revolvers.



That is the problem I have. Two J Frames or one N Frame?





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Recently purchased Model 327 - took to the indoor range & in just a short time firing it had a bloody crook in my thumb from the skin blistering off. Looked like I had raked leaves for an hour. Changed grips to a smaller set from Altamont - same effect. So if you are going to shoot it a lot either don't get the 2" barrel or don't plan to shoot .357 loads (38 cal not too bad) or get shooting gloves.
 
How about just another 642? Then you are at the ten round point, and have a total spare, which allows for any mechanical break down. I have a 327, and a 627 and am far more likely to carry two jframes than the larger revolvers.

It's not the craziest idea, and less expensive as well.
 
Every watch duck dynasty when Phil takes the two gals hog hunting. There too busy talking when he says cover your ears before he shoots a hog. Well the gals ears must of been ringing for sometime.


I can picture my misses sleeping when I say cover your ears when someone is in the house. I'll get a big HUH, WHAT?

Home defence vs hearing loss.??????
 

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