Another "warning shots" case

[JohnSW]

What not to do:

"The 34-year-old Carver man fired the gun after he saw what he thought was a stranger or strangers on the roof of his shed at 11:30 p.m. Wednesday, according to the Carver County Sheriff's Office.

The roof climber was a 16-year-old boy trying to retrieve his hat from the roof."

"Jensen told authorities he got his 9-millimeter Ruger handgun and went outside, the news release continued. He "called out to the strangers, then fired three shots into the ground." No one was hurt.

Jensen appeared in Carver County District Court on Thursday and was charged with disorderly conduct and unlawful discharge of a firearm in city limits without justification."

Carver man faces charges after teens climbing on shed faced gunfire - StarTribune.com

 

[686-380]

I'd like to know whether the trespasser was charged with trespassing.

 

[Culina]

And just how did the 16 year olds hat end up on the roof of someones storage shed which must have been in at least the side yard if not the back yard.

 

[robertrwalsh]

Warning shots are, by definition, almost always the discharge of a weapon when there is no imminent threat. That is, generally speaking, both illegal and ill-advised. They also have the bad habit of injuring or killing people and damaging property.

 

[Culina]

Warning shots are, by definition, almost always the discharge of a weapon when there is no imminent threat. That is, generally speaking, both illegal and ill-advised. They also have the bad habit of injuring or killing people and damaging property.

Warning shots are also a way of ending a situation without anyone getting killed.

 

[federali]

Shots Across The Bow

Never let your gun do your thinking for you. Trespass does not justify an armed response, even just to fire warning shots. Perhaps this boy's friends forcibly took the hat and threw it onto the shed roof as a prank but even if he was trying to break into the shed, the shed is not your home and an armed response will almost always lead to a bad outcome.

 

[Arik]

I'd like to know whether the trespasser was charged with trespassing.

Could very easily be what Federali said.

As a kid I trespassed A LOT. in the summer we'd be out playing baseball and quite often the ball would end up in someone's yard. Only way to retrieve was to jump the fence

Never let your gun do your thinking for you. Trespass does not justify an armed response, even just to fire warning shots. Perhaps this boy's friends forcibly took the hat and threw it onto the shed roof as a prank but even if he was trying to break into the shed, the shed is not your home and an armed response will almost always lead to a bad outcome.

Sent from my XT1650 using Tapatalk

 

[arjay]

My father had 10-20 pieces of #7 1/2 lead shot in his back that were a warning from an old farmer who didn't like kids messing around in his orchard.Pop claimed the old guy was just trying to scare them off.

 

[Jack Flash]

My father had 10-20 pieces of #7 1/2 lead shot in his back that were a warning from an old farmer who didn't like kids messing around in his orchard.Pop claimed the old guy was just trying to scare them off.

Did it work?

 

[arjay]

Another "warning shots" case

Did it work?

Dunno,he was a pretty stubborn guy [emoji1]

 

[KSDeputy]

We were trained to never fire warning shots, and to never fire at a moving vehicle. There are good reasons for both.

 

[Protected One]

Warning shots are also a way of ending a situation without anyone getting killed.

"POTENTIALLY"

 

[ChattanoogaPhil]

16 y/o climbing around on the roof of a shed trying to find his hat at midnight while the owner of the shed is firing rounds into ground? Uh hu....

And this is somehow a lesson on gun handling? Sounds like more a gene pool issue for all involved.

 

[686-380]

It's easy for us to arm chair quarterback. We don't know the lay of the land, what the sounds were, or much other than it was around midnight. We do know what the newspaper wants us to believe. Sledding at 11;30 at night, uh huh.

Trespassing at midnight qualifies as doing stupid things at stupid times, in stupid places.

As a homeowner, how vulnerable did he feel? He shot into the ground? Hard dirt, grass?

As it stands, I think he should just plead no contest and take his lickins'. I do not condone his behavior but feel empathy for his plight.

I still think that the trespassers should be charged.

 

[dougb1946]

What was done to make him feel threatened. He is an adult-there should be some ability to make rational decisions.

And yes, sledding at midnight, followed by warm cocoa and a warmer girl. Don't knock it until you have tried it.

 

[whataboutbob]

When a reasonable person is inside their home and saw someone on their shed,would they feel their life was in danger?I think not.call police for this one

 

[Steve912]

It's easy for us to arm chair quarterback. We don't know the lay of the land, what the sounds were, or much other than it was around midnight.

Does the shed adjoin the side of the house, below a second story window? Too much to speculate on.

 

[chud333]

I wasn't there.......


Chuck

 

[Whitwabit]

Warning shots are also a way of ending a situation without anyone getting killed.

could also get you shot !! And of the 3 or 4 cases I've heard of this occurring the usual charge was unlawful discharge of a firearm in city limits ..

The question was asked during my Illinois conceal carry class .. are warning shots allowed and the Deputy Sherriff giving the class said no warning shots are not allowed !! You would be arrested for disorderly and for unlawful discharge ..

 

[Springfeildkid585]

Warning shots are, by definition, almost always the discharge of a weapon when there is no imminent threat. That is, generally speaking, both illegal and ill-advised. They also have the bad habit of injuring or killing people and damaging property.

I held a similar opinion- that warning shots are a bad idea- until I was driving home and my path got blocked by a street fight. Second or third punch knocked one participant out cold, guy who came out on top starts trying to stomp the losers head in. There's three girls trying to pull the stomper off of the victim and failing miserably. So I don't have anything resembling a clear shot. I hadn't planned for this situation so I froze. Thank God the guy backed off before he crushed the victim's skull. In hindsight, I wish I would have put one in the dirt.

 

[Culina]

could also get you shot !! And of the 3 or 4 cases I've heard of this occurring the usual charge was unlawful discharge of a firearm in city limits ..

The question was asked during my Illinois conceal carry class .. are warning shots allowed and the Deputy Sherriff giving the class said no warning shots are not allowed !! You would be arrested for disorderly and for unlawful discharge ..

Well, I can tell you with intimate knowledge that people and wild dogs scatter like ants in the sun when they hear a warning shot. They do freeze for a couple seconds first though, and no the cops never showed up, if the police prevented crime I would have no business firing warning shots in the first place.

 

[SgtStone]

trigger happy?

As far as we can ascertain from the limited information, the householder acted correctly up to the point he fired his weapon. Make an appearance, checkout the disturbance, hold the weapon at "port arms"; correct, likely legal.

Fire a weapon three times without a target? Incorrect, illegal in his city & IMO over-reaction.

I live in a pretty permissive city but two Fourth Of July's back a sitting County Commissioner -- a close neighbor & backer of the county shooting complex -- was arrested and charged with firing a large bore revolver at a tree stump on his own property. 'Drunk as a skunk', no doubt; but a reminder to think before firing.

 

[The Big D]

Far too many...

...people seem to have just one way to resolve a 'problem.'

A gun should be the last resort...never the first. And NEVER A WARNING SHOT(S)...EVER.

Be safe.

 

[Jack Flash]

I agree with those who hold off on making a judgment.


Too much is unknown. There are some 16 year old boys who are about the size of an NFL linebacker. The homeowner could have had a disability. Were the other miscreants circling around in the darkness, perhaps surrounding the homeowner? Of course the boys all say they were engaged in innocent horseplay. But if they really were up to no good, would they be honest about it?


It would make a lot of sense to just stay inside in such a situation, but I wasn't there.

 

[SS57]

In the late 60's and early 70's, I was that kid running around the tiny town of Carver. We did all the normal kid stuff. Lucky for us some stupid A** adult didn't irresponsibly fire a weapon b/c we were on his/her property.
Did he identify his target? Was that target a threat of great bodily harm or death to him or his family? Did he know what was beyond the target?
MN law states that to be charged with trespassing you first have to be asked by the land/home owner to leave and then refuse to leave.
Thank God no one was hurt. And maybe the kids had a little something extra in their underwear that night.

 

[JohnSW]

MN law states that to be charged with trespassing you first have to be asked by the land/home owner to leave and then refuse to leave.

Good point:

609.605 TRESPASS

(3) trespasses on the premises of another and, without claim of right, refuses to depart from the premises on demand of the lawful possessor;

 

[686-380]

Intentions...

In the late 60's and early 70's, I was that kid running around the tiny town of Carver. We did all the normal kid stuff. Lucky for us some stupid A** adult didn't irresponsibly fire a weapon b/c we were on his/her property.
Did he identify his target? Was that target a threat of great bodily harm or death to him or his family? Did he know what was beyond the target?
MN law states that to be charged with trespassing you first have to be asked by the land/home owner to leave and then refuse to leave.
Thank God no one was hurt. And maybe the kids had a little something extra in their underwear that night.

We had a case, in a canyon outside of city limits. A cowboy (real) arrived back to his campsite, to find a group of delinquents vandalizing/stealing his property. He discharged his weapon into the ground to scare them off. They high-tailed it back to town, where the cops stopped them for driving crazy. The "innocent" kids told the officer how the mean old cowboy threatened them. The cowboy had called the cops himself in the meantime. They were arrested.

I'll repeat my statement about the news story the OP provided. We read what the newspaper wanted us to believe.

 

[TAC]

Warning shots are also a way of ending a situation without anyone getting killed.

Seriously? If someone fired a warning shot at me, how am I to know if it was in fact a warning shot? I'd return fire, with full intention to stop the perceived threat, immediately!

 

[b_san]

16 y/o climbing around on the roof of a shed trying to find his hat at midnight while the owner of the shed is firing rounds into ground? Uh hu....

And this is somehow a lesson on gun handling? Sounds like more a gene pool issue for all involved.

Agreed, unfortunately it's in MN and the police, courts and even most of the Fudds up here are hostile to any kind of defensive firearm use. So it wasn't a smart idea to actually fire unless he was in immediate danger and even in that case he'd have had a court case and a major headache.

 

[mrchuck]

In Texas, "trespassing" is a dastardly act and often times the trespasser "feels" the wind pass by him, and then the report of the firearm.
My advice is to NEVER trespass in Texas. Texas is different.