Any Sig Sauer P220 Fans?

[gdogs]

I love my Sigs, and my collection started with a P220.

The 45's - P220 P227 P245

 

[CustomChevyGuy]

CustomChevyGuy, the P220 has undergone a lot of changes over the years.

The one in my post above is from 1986. It has the stamped sheetmetal slide (which was state of the art aircraft technology at the time). The breechblock is held in with a doubled roll pin. The muzzle area is electron beam welded in place. The older grip you liked is probably like mine.

The P220 slides today are made in the USA and are machined from a solid steel billet. They are stronger but weigh a bit more. Currently the grip is a one piece ergonomic grip, which is a love/hate affair, apparently. I like both the early and the later grips, but some hate the later grips. Right now it is the only plastic grip option on the P220, but two piece wood grips, and there are Hogue G10 grips available. Hogue is making most if not all of the wood and G10 grips for SIG.

P220 Nitron Full-Size
This is an example of the latest version with the one piece ergonomic grip.

As a generality, you should be able to put a two piece grip on a model that has a one piece grip. However, my P227 is early enough it lacks the screw holes in the frame and requires adapters. I don't know it the P220 always had screws or if the early one piece grip models lacked the screw holes. Take the magazine out and see if you see two screw holes on the frame on either side of the mag well.

You can see all of the current factory grip styles for the P220 here:
P220 | Sig Sauer

SIG has some plastic grips available:
Black Grip Set, Black Polymer, P220 SLIM FIT, 2-Piece | Parts
FDE Grip Set, Flat Dark Earth, P220 (As Used On Combat) | Parts

The above will fit later model SIGs with the slim mainspring housing. They WILL NOT fit an older SIG like mine with the larger mainspring housing.

Hogue has a plethora of grips for the P220:
Hogue Inc.

Edit: You mentioned a "standard rail" on one of the SIGs. You mean a slotted rail or was it just a smooth frame? The reason I ask is the first SIG rails we slotted but unlike a Picatinny the profile had a slight curve to it. This caused complaints and SIG now makes the slotted rail with a flat profile, more like a true Picatinny.

Ton of good information in the reply, Thank you!

I think the one that I didn't like might have been a newer Carry version, as it had a bit of a shorter barrel. I personally like the older style with the P220 block script on the grips.

This is a photo of the one I handled previously. I was looking for a 1911 on that trip but the LGS I was at, didn't have any that I was considering. The P220 caught my eye, and I seriously considered getting that instead.

As for the rail section, both looked like they were somewhat curved, but the one with the grip I didnt like had the more noticeable curvature..which is what actually made me look at the two rail sections at all..

 

[inspcalahan]

Love the 220s - nothing bad to say about them one bit. This one has been around the block a few times. I've posted the same pic before, but it's the only one I have of it for now.

 

[Brian in Oregon]

Ton of good information in the reply, Thank you!

I think the one that I didn't like might have been a newer Carry version, as it had a bit of a shorter barrel. I personally like the older style with the P220 block script on the grips.

This is a photo of the one I handled previously. I was looking for a 1911 on that trip but the LGS I was at, didn't have any that I was considering. The P220 caught my eye, and I seriously considered getting that instead.

That one has the slimmer two piece grips with the stippled finish and gun model on it. SIG says they will not fit the very early guns. The one piece ergonomic grips (often referred to as the E2 grips) are even slimmer.

The slotted rail has a rounded profile. Most Picatinny accessories will fit it, but some may be loose. This is why SIG has gone to a flat rail design on the latest guns.

I think that is the one piece slide, not the earlier one. You need to look at the other side of the slide near the muzzle to see if it references Germany or if it only has the New Hampshire markings.

SIG Sauer Proof Marks and Date Codes - Real Gun Reviews

SIG is changing the EXETER NH marking to NEWINGTON NH marking on the latest guns.
Goodbye 'Exeter' markings: Sig Sauer to change roll marks

The P220 in your pic at $670 seems to me to be a bit high for used, especially if it does not have tritium night sights or if they are getting dim. Check that, and bargain accordingly or get them to install a fresh set. Having said that, prices vary regionally and even by state. In states that restrict new guns for state compliance, older ones can fetch a premium. Also, how many extra mags? All SIGs ship with two mags, so if only one mag, a replacement is around $40 to $50.

 

[CustomChevyGuy]

That one has the slimmer two piece grips with the stippled finish and gun model on it. SIG says they will not fit the very early guns. The one piece ergonomic grips (often referred to as the E2 grips) are even slimmer.

The slotted rail has a rounded profile. Most Picatinny accessories will fit it, but some may be loose. This is why SIG has gone to a flat rail design on the latest guns.

I think that is the one piece slide, not the earlier one. You need to look at the other side of the slide near the muzzle to see if it references Germany or if it only has the New Hampshire markings.

SIG Sauer Proof Marks and Date Codes - Real Gun Reviews

SIG is changing the EXETER NH marking to NEWINGTON NH marking on the latest guns.
Goodbye 'Exeter' markings: Sig Sauer to change roll marks

The P220 in your pic at $670 seems to me to be a bit high for used, especially if it does not have tritium night sights or if they are getting dim. Check that, and bargain accordingly or get them to install a fresh set. Having said that, prices vary regionally and even by state. In states that restrict new guns for state compliance, older ones can fetch a premium. Also, how many extra mags? All SIGs ship with two mags, so if only one mag, a replacement is around $40 to $50.

That pic is from a year or two ago, not the one I saw earlier this week. It definitely said Germany, as I vividly remembering my dad laughing and saying how I always liked the German guns, referencing my affinity for the H&K I carry.
I doubt that exact gun is still at the shop, being that it's an old photo. The tritium sights were still visible. I really liked how the trigger felt. H&K mags run about the same price range, so that's not a shock.

I'm blessed to live in Florida, sometimes referred to as the Gun-shine state. We've been lucky enough not to have to worry about the state compliance, or any capacity limits..so far.

 

[Cocked & Locked]

Just one...

 

[Brian in Oregon]

That pic is from a year or two ago, not the one I saw earlier this week. It definitely said Germany, as I vividly remembering my dad laughing and saying how I always liked the German guns, referencing my affinity for the H&K I carry.
I doubt that exact gun is still at the shop, being that it's an old photo. The tritium sights were still visible. I really liked how the trigger felt. H&K mags run about the same price range, so that's not a shock.

I'm blessed to live in Florida, sometimes referred to as the Gun-shine state. We've been lucky enough not to have to worry about the state compliance, or any capacity limits..so far.

Keep in mind it is possible to have the frame made in Germany but the slide made in the USA.

 

[Arik]

Keep in mind it is possible to have the frame made in Germany but the slide made in the USA.

Depending on age yes. It started late 90s and lasted into the mid 00s. Now it's all done here. Since 2000 SIG Sauer Inc (USA) has been organizationally separate from manufacturer SIG Sauer GmbH (SwissArms)

Sent from my XT1650 using Tapatalk

 

[tops]

The SIG P220 has been my favorite double action auto-loader since it's introduction to America in the 1970s

When the choice has been mine, a SIG P220 has been on my hip since 1977

]​

Those bullets look like SWCs. My son had a 220 and a 227 and they wouldn't feed 200 gr. SWCs. Did you do anything extra to get them to feed or was he just unlucky? The same load has always worked like a dream in my 1967 Colt. Larry​

 

[samnev]

My favorite 45 ACP. I own 2 a West German and a stainless steel railed model. Both have performed flawlessly.

 

[Ed Fowler]

Originally posted by Arik: had the early 220 9mm heel release. It was made in 77 and surplus Geneva Switzerland police gun. Nice gun but it jammed something wicked at the range and I traded it away.

Wish you still had it, would trade you out of it. Mine has never ever jammed.

 

[Arik]

Originally posted by Arik: had the early 220 9mm heel release. It was made in 77 and surplus Geneva Switzerland police gun. Nice gun but it jammed something wicked at the range and I traded it away.

Wish you still had it, would trade you out of it. Mine has never ever jammed.

I don't know what happened to it. It was the first time at the range and it was pretty bad. Using brass case avg range ammo. Everything was fine then all of a sudden one round got stuck into the feed ramp. I couldn't pull the mag out or move the slide. Finally got the slide to move, locked it back and used my keys to push the round back into the mag. That was a pain. Got it far enough back but the mag would only come out half way and even then it was hard to pull on. Took the slide off and after probably 20 min I managed to pop that round out of the mag and then the mag dropped free. It was a shame too. Nice clean gun even had the Geneva stamps on it and some special weird attachment on the bottom of the mag well.

Sent from my XT1650 using Tapatalk

 

[hkcavalier]

First handgun I bought with my own money was a P220 .45. Very accurate, easy to take down, trigger seemed better than the Beretta 92s I was used to after the Marines. Like an idiot I sold that gun.

Had the opportunity to pick up a P220 Equinox recently, but passed and got a 27-2 instead.

While I like 1911s well enough, if I had to pack a single stack .45 it would be a P220 hands down, preferably a full size SAO one.

 

[DavidFagan]

I still have my Hawes import from the 70's a Browning import BDA etc.
I've NEVER had an issue with any Sig I own.
P210,P220,P224,P225,P226,P228,P229

 

[LT7d103]

I picked up a P220 West German built in 1992 pistol about a week ago. Have not shot it yet as I am waiting on the wood grips I bought and my arthritis is acting up in my dominant hand. Do not like the OEM plastic grips at all. Other than a lot of holster wear, prior police pistol, the gun is perfect mechanically. Locks up like a bank vault. Grips should be here in a day or two, finally.
I am seriously considering getting a Sig Legion pistol. Have read a lot of good things about those.

 

[dgludwig]

QUOTE: "I'm more of a holster collector than a gun collector,..."

A holster collector! Who would have thought?

 

[Ceapea]

Nice Pistols!

Too bad Sig's customer service is so horrible.
After the experience I had with them, I'll never own another Sig Sauer.

That's too bad! I have had nothing but great experiences with Sig and their CS reps. I only needed assistance with one small issue, one time. I have ordered parts and accessories many times. Always a great experience.

 

[dgludwig]

Model39, I noticed that one of your Model 220s has an internal extractor and the other, an external extractor. Have you ever noticed a difference in functional reliability between the two?

A few years back, I bought a Model 220 Carry having the much-maligned internal extractor. Truth be told, after a few hundred (not thousands) rounds fired through that pistol, I did not experience one malfunction. But, when I picked up and held a Model 227 (basically, a Model 220 with a double-stack magazine) mat my lgs, I fell in love with the E2 grip; the same of which is on my SIG Model 226. I sold the Model 220 Carry and bought the Model 227 and have never looked back. It has also been proven to be 100% reliable with hundreds (not thousands, yet) rounds fired through it.

I went with the Model 227 over the Model 220 mostly because I much prefer the E2 grip (some people feel oppositely; everybody's different) over the "standard" one. The extra two rounds of .45 ACP cartridges is just icing on the cake for me.

 

[VinnieL59]

I bought a brand new Stainless Sig 220. It was a fantastic shooter, but being machined from a solid billet of stainless steel without a doubt the heaviest pistol I ever tried to carry as a duty weapon. The rubber grips that came on it fit really cheesy and moved around. I literally couldn't carry it because my pants would fall down. Sold it, and the dealer who sold it has sold it 2 more times since. I own a P-6 SIG in 9mm and it is a fantastic weapon. Came with the original blue plastic box, book in German and original target fired at the factory. Even has the cops name on the box.

 

[Ceapea]

Those bullets look like SWCs. My son had a 220 and a 227 and they wouldn't feed 200 gr. SWCs. Did you do anything extra to get them to feed or was he just unlucky? The same load has always worked like a dream in my 1967 Colt. Larry

I have that same gun (I think... P220 Match, SAO) and it will feed 200 gr and 185 gr SWC bullets. Both loaded to 1.240"-1.245"
I use it for PPC Service matches. It is EXACTLY like cheating, using the Match SAO!

 

[Model39]

Extractors

Model39, I noticed that one of your Model 220s has an internal extractor and the other, an external extractor. Have you ever noticed a difference in functional reliability between the two?

A few years back, I bought a Model 220 Carry having the much-maligned internal extractor. Truth be told, after a few hundred (not thousands) rounds fired through that pistol, I did not experience one malfunction. But, when I picked up and held a Model 227 (basically, a Model 220 with a double-stack magazine) mat my lgs, I fell in love with the E2 grip; the same of which is on my SIG Model 226. I sold the Model 220 Carry and bought the Model 227 and have never looked back. It has also been proven to be 100% reliable with hundreds (not thousands, yet) rounds fired through it.

I went with the Model 227 over the Model 220 mostly because I much prefer the E2 grip (some people feel oppositely; everybody's different) over the "standard" one. The extra two rounds of .45 ACP cartridges is just icing on the cake for me.

Both my Sig 220 45 slides have internal extractors. I have not experienced any trouble/malfunctions with them. The top Sig 220 pictured has a 22LR conversion on it and that slide has the external extractor. The conversion unit works flawlessly. Thanks for your interest.

 

[colt_saa]

Those bullets look like SWCs. My son had a 220 and a 227 and they wouldn't feed 200 gr. SWCs. Did you do anything extra to get them to feed or was he just unlucky? The same load has always worked like a dream in my 1967 Colt. Larry

I have been shooting the H&G #68 in bone stock SIG P220s for 35+ years now. I do not recall a single P220 that these did not function in.

If you bought gun show reloads there is not much you can do.

If you son hand-loads, did he try varying the COAL?

If you son hand-loads, is your son using an H&G #68 or some other SWC design?

 

[tops]

I have been shooting the H&G #68 in bone stock SIG P220s for 35+ years now. I do not recall a single P220 that these did not function in.

If you bought gun show reloads there is not much you can do.

If you son hand-loads, did he try varying the COAL?

If you son hand-loads, is your son using an H&G #68 or some other SWC design?

The bullet we are using is the Oregon Laser Cast 200 gr. SWC. Besides my 1967 Colt 1911A1 they also will work in his two 25-2s and my 1917 and 1937 with and without clips. That leads me too believe the crimp is the correct dia. The OAL is about .015 short of max. I have loaded some .030 short of max. and they still work in the Colt. Larry

 

[jscott]

Best .45 auto ever made. I carried mine for 25 years as an FBI agent.

SIGP220, please advise what round you used when workng at The I and did you experience any problems with the 8 vs 7 round mags? Many of my collegues at Miami-Dade Homicide carried that piece and were very satisified with its performance. Unfortunately my smallish hands could not manage the thumb reach to the decocker so I chose the Smith DAO 4586.

 

[Beauetienne]

My only P220. She's a keeper.

 

[44wheelman]

My only p220 was the Browning BDA. But, more importantly, it got me started on Sigs. I was very impressed with it. Now I've got a couple 229's & 226's in both 9 & 40.

I have a few great shooting 45's, so about 10 years ag, I took the Browning BDA to a gun show and sold it. As I headed to the exit I ran into somebody else selling his BDA too. It was mint, box, even the shipping sleeve. So, for $25 more than I just sold mine for, I upgraded....figured it was just meant to be.

 

[Lesau]

Brian in Oregon:

I see you and others discussing older model p220's. Is there a rule of thumb for time periods that cover older vs newer models? I recently purchased a new in box 220c that was made in 2012. Had just been in the dealers show case for 4 1/2 years. Apparently the compact sao version was not very popular (I love the gun).

Lesau

CustomChevyGuy, the P220 has undergone a lot of changes over the years.

The one in my post above is from 1986. It has the stamped sheetmetal slide (which was state of the art aircraft technology at the time). The breechblock is held in with a doubled roll pin. The muzzle area is electron beam welded in place. The older grip you liked is probably like mine.

The P220 slides today are made in the USA and are machined from a solid steel billet. They are stronger but weigh a bit more. Currently the grip is a one piece ergonomic grip, which is a love/hate affair, apparently. I like both the early and the later grips, but some hate the later grips. Right now it is the only plastic grip option on the P220, but two piece wood grips, and there are Hogue G10 grips available. Hogue is making most if not all of the wood and G10 grips for SIG.

P220 Nitron Full-Size
This is an example of the latest version with the one piece ergonomic grip.

As a generality, you should be able to put a two piece grip on a model that has a one piece grip. However, my P227 is early enough it lacks the screw holes in the frame and requires adapters. I don't know it the P220 always had screws or if the early one piece grip models lacked the screw holes. Take the magazine out and see if you see two screw holes on the frame on either side of the mag well.

You can see all of the current factory grip styles for the P220 here:
P220 | Sig Sauer

SIG has some plastic grips available:
Black Grip Set, Black Polymer, P220 SLIM FIT, 2-Piece | Parts
FDE Grip Set, Flat Dark Earth, P220 (As Used On Combat) | Parts

The above will fit later model SIGs with the slim mainspring housing. They WILL NOT fit an older SIG like mine with the larger mainspring housing.

Hogue has a plethora of grips for the P220:
Hogue Inc.

Edit: You mentioned a "standard rail" on one of the SIGs. You mean a slotted rail or was it just a smooth frame? The reason I ask is the first SIG rails we slotted but unlike a Picatinny the profile had a slight curve to it. This caused complaints and SIG now makes the slotted rail with a flat profile, more like a true Picatinny.

 

[Brian in Oregon]

There have been a number of changes made to SIG P22X series over almost four decades, starting with the early "Dolphin Slide" version that Browning imported as the BDA.

This page lists and explains some of the various models of SIG, but does not really get into dates or changes:
http://remtek.com/arms/sig/model/220/220.htm

More basic P220 info:
SIG Sauer P220 - Wikipedia

This page explains date and proof codes:
SIG Sauer Proof Marks and Date Codes - Real Gun Reviews

This page explains the intricacies of where your SIG was made:
Is my "Made in Germany" (or West Germany) SIG Really German? - Real Gun Reviews

This is a registry someone started for serial numbers, date codes, importer, etc.:
Sig Sauer Classic P-Series - Serial Number List and associated manufacture/import years/information - Topic

P220 frame change:
http://sigtalk.com/sig-sauer-pistols/31557-there-frame-change-1993-p220.html

Somewhere around 2000 the slide changed from the stamped sheetmetal to milled stainless steel. This coincided with the slide changing from German to USA production. The early milled slides had an internal extractor and some had issues. The external extractor replaced them.

Over the years grips have changed as well.

There have been numerous minor cosmetic changes. Look at the cocking serrations on the slides over the years, and the top rear side of the slide over the serrations.

And there has been a plethora of different versions, compacts, SAS ("melted" anti-snag smoothing of slide corners for snag free carry), different triggers, different actions (DA/SA. SAO and DAK), finishes, grips, sights, frame material, etc.

 

[BAM-BAM]

Not to hijack the thread...............

One of my 220's is an "Ernest Langdon Special model"; reverse two-tone, all steel with Nill grips...... still new in box.

Ran across it in a LGS...had spoken with Langdon on several occasions durning his Beretta days about the 92 Elite; he advised me to wait as a Elite II was coming... thought I'd use the Sig for IDPA...... but got sidetracked with kids and Soccer...... and then cataracts........so it remains new in box.

Any idea of what they are worth these days................????

 

[Ziggy2525]

I've had only the best treatment from Sig!

Same here.

In the last couple years, I've had CS experiences with Glock, S&W, and Sig. My experience with Sig was way, way better than Glock or S&W.