Anyone else spooked from buying military marked firearms

[bushmaster1313]

Idiot scratch

 

[Watchdog]

I have read that G.I.’s were taught to push the take down pin againstvthe lower frame when reassembling.

There is no such thing as a "take down pin" on a 1911 or a 1911A1.

The part you're referring to is the slide stop.

 

[PALADIN85020]

In my early "Small Arms of the World" book by W.H.B. Smith, he states that the Ithaca 1911A1s were "...particularly noted for quality." My first 1911A1 was an Ithaca lend-lease pistol that I had accurized and blued; it was not in the best condition when I got it. It served me on active duty and later in the National Guard - I preferred it over my issue pistol, and no one was the wiser. I still have it - here is its current appearance.

By contrast, here's a strictly G.I. issue Ithaca that I own. It's recorded as being one of 5,000 shipped to the Augusta (GA) Ordnance Department on Sept. 9, 1944 for further shipment overseas.

I have quite a number of .45 caliber U.S. military pistols; here's a "pinwheel" picture of them:

Regarding Union Switch and Signal pistols. The finish on these is what was called "Du-lite" rather than Parkerizing. It's a finish that's more of a blue color. Mine is in about 99% condition - one of the nicest in my collection. It was shipped in 1943.

There pictures were taken for an article I wrote in the 2003 Gun Digest on U.S. issue .45 handguns. I won the John Amber award for that year. These were taken with a Pentax film camera on slides, and I had to convert them digitally for posting here. Therefore the quality is not completely up to par. I was pleased that Gun Digest used slick paper for the article, in full color.

You can see more M1911s and 1911A1s in this forum's picture album section here:

http://smith-wessonforum.com/members/paladin85020-albums-u-s-models-1911-and-1911a1-45-pistols.html

John

 

[Watchdog]

I have quite a number of .45 caliber U.S. military pistols; here's a "pinwheel" picture of them:

John

Do you still have the 1911 with the Savage slide? When you say "rework", does that mean it has an arsenal stamp on the frame?

I hear all sorts of things about the Savage slides, the most common being that Savage had a contract to produce some springs and slides, but that the contract was canceled.

I saw one Colt at a gun show years ago with a Savage slide and the "AA" arsenal stamp on it, but it was priced out of my reach.

If you do still have it, could we see some of your excellent photos of it?

 

[PALADIN85020]

Do you still have the 1911 with the Savage slide? When you say "rework", does that mean it has an arsenal stamp on the frame?

I hear all sorts of things about the Savage slides, the most common being that Savage had a contract to produce some springs and slides, but that the contract was canceled.

I saw one Colt at a gun show years ago with a Savage slide and the "AA" arsenal stamp on it, but it was priced out of my reach.

If you do still have it, could we see some of your excellent photos of it?

Yes, I still have this Savage slide pistol. The A.J. Savage company, in California (run by Arthur Savage's son, not connected to Savage Arms), received a contract during WWI to manufacture 1911 pistols. They never completed the contract, but manufactured a number of slides. The marking on the slide was an ordnance "flaming bomb" with an "S" in the center.

Since the contract was never completed, the company was never paid for the slides. Somehow, however, the slides were obtained by the government and used on reworked pistols - usually on Colt frames, which this one was. It is marked with the "AA" stamp of Augusta Arsenal, directly in front of the slide stop.

These pistols are extremely valuable, and I have never seen another besides the one I own. It's in a safety deposit box, so I can't give you a recent digital photo, but here is the one used in my Gun Digest article that depicts its markings.

Hope this will suffice.

John

 

[Watchdog]

These pistols are extremely valuable, and I have never seen another besides the one I own. It's in a safety deposit box, so I can't give you a recent digital photo, but here is the one used in my Gun Digest article that depicts its markings.

Hope this will suffice.

John

Thanks so much.

What's always struck me as interesting is that the Flaming Bomb stamp on the Savage slide is very similar in design to the one on the Springfield Armory 1911s made from 1914 through 1917.

You have any thoughts on that...just a coincidence, maybe? Or maybe an attempt at design standardization? Or even shared tooling? They're both more intricate in design than the later stamps used on military arms in WWII.

No, this isn't my pistol. Unfortunately.

 

[digi-shots]

John, very nice "pinwheel" photo of your 45's.... I may try and do one with some of my military handguns.

A friend of mine has his father's "Savage" that he carried during WWI*****. I'm curious now as to what frame is with the gun.

Great post!

 

[PALADIN85020]

The "flaming bomb" mark has been standardized for a long time; it's the trademark of the Army Ordnance Corps. I served with a number of Army officers in atomic weapons work who wore that insignia on their uniforms to signify their branch; they were very much involved in special weapons development, manufacture and logistics. The stamps on weaponry vary in size and minor details depending on the weapon and the time period. Savage used a similar stamp, but with the enclosed "S" as their particular identification. It's not an official ordnance acceptance stamp.

Linda, It would be impossible for any Savage slide rework to have been actually used during WWI. Those slides were applied to frames as reworks and issued only after that war. Your friend's father may have obtained it somewhat later than the end of the war, but he definitely did not carry it in WWI.

John

 

[digi-shots]

John, sorry about that, you’re right, I mis-typed... definitely WWII !