AR in 9mm for duty?

JJEH

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Calling all members that have one.

I'm considering getting an AR in 9mm.

Is that something I can use for duty?
Or is it more like a range toy?

I know all the rifle classes are usually 5.56 or .308.
On the fence right now...

Thanks for any and all opinions :)
 
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I have a AR style Just Right Carbine in 9mm that takes M&P mags with a reflex red dot with laser sight
and I think any AR style 9mm would make a good home defense or close range Duty (20 to 100 yds) I also have a Ruger PC9 old model not the one Ruger just came out with. I plan on setting the Ruger PC9 up with the same reflex sights the Ruger is lighter and in my opinion much easier to handle and maneuver. You might want to look at the new Ruger PC.
 
I have two 9mm carbines both good to 100 yards with iron sites. One runs Glock style mags. The 33 rounders are nice. Don't see anything wrong in using them for duty.

I keep the Key-Tec Sub-2000 in the back of my SUV (folded in a compartment with two 33 round Glock mags) in case SHTF on the road.
 
I just got my Ruger PC 9 carbine, but have not shot it. Like many Ruger products, it is as ugly as a mud fence, but will probably be dependable and accurate as most Ruger products are. With the take-down feature and general compactness, let alone the Glock magazine option, I think you might want to at least examine the little Ruger rifle before you decide what to buy.
 
I had a Colt 9mm smg 10" bl issued to be for years, also instructed them for years........I liked it so well that I have a 16" 9mm AR as one of my "house guns". IMO a 9mm carbine would be useful in certain applications as a duty weapon. My wife is a retired LEO and is well versed on the M-16, so the 9mm AR is an easy transition for her. I have our's set up with a surefire 6p.
 
I just took my RRA 9mm AR out to the range yesterday (still need to clean it). Uses the Colt pattern mags.

Back to the question. It depends on what "duty" means to you. My Dept only authorizes 5.56 for patrol.

However, if I were to use a carbine for home defense, I would use my 9mm over my 5.56 (I live in a house with distance between neighbors and the kids are gone so not worried about punching through a wall).

I have a few 9mm PCCs w/16 in barrels (MP5 clone, UZI, SUB2000 and the AR). Of those, I would grab the AR first for anything out to 100 yrds if I went the pistol caliber carbine route.

But, I do want to get my hands on that new Ruger too.
 
Pistol calibers for handguns and rifle calibers for rifles... my dept dumped our MP5's for 223. Seems to be the trend now with increased threats of potential violence and not wanting responders to be under gunned.
 
It depends what that duty is, and on the "AR-9" in question.

The major limitation of the 9mm round is against body armor, but my 16" 9mm AR will launch 115 gr bullets at 1500 fps with a standard pressure load, which is on the borderline for what Level IIIa body armor can withstand. I can get 1600 fps out of it with a +P load but even with a 10 oz buffer it's moving the bolt faster than is healthy for the carbine.

There both Glock and Colt pattern 9mm AR lowers. The Glock use Glock 9mm magazines and that can be a plus if you shot a 9mm Glock pistol.

However I have yet to see a Glock pattern AR-15 based 9mm that has a bolt hold open that actually works, so if you want to use Glock magazines in a 9mm carbine, you need to look at options other than the AR.

The Colt pattern magazines are Uzi based and Uzi magazines will work fine in a Colt pattern 9mm AR - you just have to mill a cut for the bolt stop in them. That's harder than it sounds as the steel in the Uzi mags is hard and I had to spot anneal to get the bit to cut easily. The Uzi mag is on the left, and a Metalform made colt pattern magazine is on the right.

The Uzi mags are stamped, folded and then spot welded along the back where the metal overlaps. The Colt pattern mags are extruded and there is no over lap in the back. That creates space inside at the back of the magazine for a tab to activate a bolt stop to hold the bolt open after the last round is fired. Thus the Uzi mags will not activate a bolt hold open.

Uzi mags were available up until recently for $10-$12 in new condition so it was worth converting them, given that a new Metalform made Colt pattern magazine will cost between $28 and $40 depending on who is selling it, and if they are on sale. But the Metalform magazines are very well made, very reliable and very durable.

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Not all AR9s are created equal either. Colt pattern lowers come in both dedicated lower and magazine block lower formats, and there are three major different types of magazine blocks. A decent magazine block will run you around $150-$200, so unless you have an AR-15 lower you want to use it's cheaper to just get a dedicated lower, and if you want to get a Glock patter lower, a dedicated lower is your option.

I have two. The first was built off a PSA AR-9 16" carbine, although to be honest the only thing that is still on it is the lower as everything else got replaced. It just would not shoot to the level of accuracy I wanted. However with a RRA upper and a free floated Ballistic Advantage barrel it's now a solid 2 MOA carbine at 100 yards with 115 gr HAPs of XTPs.

My other is a 10" RRA LAR-9 pistol with a brace. It's equally accurate with the same loads and only loses about 50 fps in velocity. It also has a 11.25" barrel given that the barrel is a bit longer in the blow back operated AR as the barrel comes all the way back to the bolt face, which is located at the front of what would be the bolt carrier in a .223 AR-15, since no barrel extension is used in the blow back operated 9mm AR.

It's critical that the bolt and buffer assembly be heavy enough to manage the load you are shooting in it. If there is not enough weight in the system, bolt velocity will be excessive and you'll start breaking bolt stops in a Colt pattern AR-9.

I zero mine at 125 yards with the 115 gr HAP or XTP at 1500 fps, which leaves it 3" high at 75 yards, and 4" low at 150 yards. At 150 yards it still has about 1021 fps left, compared to 1130 fps at 100 yards.

So if the "duty" in question requires 2 MOA accuracy at 100 yards and an effective range of no more than 150 yards, then it'll work. The noise level is significantly lower than with a 16" AR-15. The 9mm will produce about 117 dB in a 16" carbine, compared to about 156 dB for a 16" .223. That's a big plus for the 9mm if you ever have to shoot in indoors in an emergency.


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Typical 100 yard group:

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First: I'm not a police officer.

The 9mm H&K MP-5 was a standard SWAT and Anti-terrorist weapon for several decades........ IIRC; it took gold at the 73 Olympics

I have and like my 9mm Beretta CX4; which is a bit shorter and lighter than an AR.....like the fact it can share magazines with my Beretta 92s and 15,17,18,20 and 30rd factory ( and Mec-Gar) magazines are available........ with a red dot good rapid fire 'fist size" groups at 50 yards are much easier with a PCC than a handgun

I view mine as fun at the range and a good suburban PDW teamed with my Beretta handguns.

All that said if I were a police officer I think I'd go 5.56 ..... though BB57 makes some very good points..... IMO especially about the noise level... unless you have electronic ear muffs.
 
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I would reserve it for range only.

If you need a rifle because a handgun is insufficient, that rifle should be chambered in a rifle caliber rather than a pistol round.
 
I have one I built myself it's really a fun and inexpensive gun to shoot.
Technically mine is a pistol not a carbine.
I'm not sure I would call it just a range gun. You can shoot the hottest +P ammo and they won't blink an eye and the longer barrel gives you more velocity. Mine is a dedicated lower with colt style mags. I'll say one thing you will defiantly need a mag loader because those 32 round mags are a thumb killer.
 

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I view mine as fun at the range and a good suburban PDW teamed with my Beretta handguns.

The Israelis used the Uzi extensively as a personal defense weapon and it is very good in that role, as is a 9mm AR carbine or brace equipped pistol.
 
I'm not a LEO, but if I were, I'd sure want something that's able to defeat body armour.
 
We were issued MP-5 sub guns for years and I was very happy with them. Having said that, we replaced them with the M-4 in 5.56 and for approximately the same size and weight I had a longer range rifle with the ability to defeat body armor and barriers. I'd say 9mm good, 5.56 much better.
 
I have had a couple of carbines that shot .45acp. Both were about the size of a AR 15. I sold them. If I want pistol ammunition, I use a pistol.
 
Thank y'all for the replies and thank you BB57 for your detailed post. Y'all make good points. I'm still on the fence though. Everybody's got a 5.56 and it's honestly not my favorite round. I might just save up and get a .308 AR.
 
Thank y'all for the replies and thank you BB57 for your detailed post. Y'all make good points. I'm still on the fence though. Everybody's got a 5.56 and it's honestly not my favorite round. I might just save up and get a .308 AR.

Take a hard look at the DPMS Recon II 308......love mine.....best out of the box trigger I have ever shot on an AR.....extremely accurate with 168 FGMM.
 
Thank y'all for the replies and thank you BB57 for your detailed post. Y'all make good points. I'm still on the fence though. Everybody's got a 5.56 and it's honestly not my favorite round. I might just save up and get a .308 AR.

You just want a new gun! :D Anything you could possibly use a 9mm AR for is not a job for 7.62x51. (Of course there's nothing wrong with wanting a new gun - or two! ;))

That's said, if I wanted a pistol-caliber AR it almost certainly would be 10mm - IF suitable magazines are available. 7.62x39 is a nice round in the AR, but we need PMAGs in that caliber. :(
 
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