Are we - dash snobs?

MrTrolleyguy

MrTrolleyguy

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Most, but not all, guns with a lower engineering iteration number sell for more. That ia a fact.

So I ask you are we iteration snobs?
























I think a lot of are to some extent. At least sometimes we are. Of course the particular variations with significant changes make some sense. But when the ejector rod thread rotation direction changes does that rate a value decrease? Or when the diamond disappears from around the grip screw will you pay more for that little diamond? Be honest now!

Let's take the Model 686-3 and 686-4? The dash four gets more "cred" with most people I'd say. Would you agree? Why?
 
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I'm with 629shooter; the no lock revolvers get my dollars first. I am not a P&R snob though...I don't see the utility in a recessed cylinder for other than a rimfire. But I shoot, I don't collect.

And what is wrong with my 686-3? It is great!
686-3_zps4f16a163.jpg
 
Familiarity with dash numbers can help pick out less expensive revolvers that have everything you can use. For 19s shopping for dash 5s or 6s saves about $200 over dash 3s & 4s while getting you finish and accuracy that is just as good. Dash 6s add the improved yoke retention and don't cost a dime more than dash 5s. At the risk of whipping the dirt where the horse rotted away, earlier dashes' barrel pins are non-functional and recesses just make cleaning take longer.

For the never P&R 686s, dash 4s get you easy optics mounting in your old age while still retaining square cornered broach cut rifling for cast bullets. For 2 ½" 686s that you are very unlikely to ever mount optics on dropping back to dash 3s or lower dashes can get you factory supplied photogenic Combats. Both vintages handily avoid new gun prices.

The key is to not pick a dash number for its prestige but rather select features beneficial to you then learn which dash number have them. Using dash numbers doesn't necessarily turn you into a dash snob.
 
As above, but I go much further. I judge each revolver individually. Unless there's a value added feature needed, such as the drilled and tapped topstrap for optics use, then absolutely no preference is given a particular engineering change. Timing, forcing cone wear, trigger pull, throat dimensions, and such are far more important to me.
 
When I bought most of my used S&W revolvers, neither the gun store or I paid any attention to the -#'s. I ended up with some great revolvers. I am a believer that we the marketing department of any company says, "It's new and improved". That means it is easier for them to make money and they will charge more for it! Yes, drilled top straps make the gun more "Scopeable" (if that is a word), but did that make the gun better: only to the person that will use it that way! When S&W changed the thread direction on the the ejector rod nut, I bet every police department armorer cussed them for months, if not years! Ivan
 
The only time I really worried about -#s was when I traded a Safe Queen 21/2 inch 19-5 for a Safe Queen 21/2 inch 19-4.... to get a P&Red gun.

Don't know if this counts; I did grab a 66 no dash with stainless rear sight once..... because of what I'd learned here.
 
MrTrolleyguy said:
Most, but not all, guns with a lower engineering iteration number sell for more. That ia a fact.

So I ask you are we iteration snobs?
Click to expand...

Clearly, BIGOT is more accurate than SNOB. The intensity with which some eschew newer production or even dash levels defies logic in some cases. Too each his own though.
 
The Model 29 series has on dash model, the -3, which is sort of the read headed stepchild. The -2 was the last of the old school pinned barrel and recessed chambers. The -4 (and a very few -3E) introduced the "Endurance Package" which made the 29 able to withstand a great deal more rounds of full power magnum ammo. The -3 had no new good features, and lost the P&R.
 
I am CERTAINLY a "no lock" snob. As far as the dash models if I were a collector I'd (in most cases) stick to the best variation such as my no dash 617 or if I were to buy a 629 whichever was the first with the reliability or enhancement package (-4 ?).

I couldn't care less about picking a model(s) and getting every dash model. I guess that's one reason I'm not a true collector.
 
steamloco76 said:
The Model 29 series has on dash model, the -3, which is sort of the read headed stepchild. The -2 was the last of the old school pinned barrel and recessed chambers. The -4 (and a very few -3E) introduced the "Endurance Package" which made the 29 able to withstand a great deal more rounds of full power magnum ammo. The -3 had no new good features, and lost the P&R.
Click to expand...

Here is a 29-3 I bought NIB in 1987...I'll take the -3's all day long! Since I don't shoot 300 grain silhouette loads, the endurance package is not needed. I normally use 215-250 grain LSWC loaded to my needs. I'm glad it isn't recessed as that is harder to clean, and the little pin does nothing or every other major revolver maker would have used them.

Model29-3L_zpsc42d0c4c.jpg

Model29-3R_zpsd211034c.jpg
 
Sometimes it feels like each dash released is like an entirely different model which is why we continue to grab them up. Take the current model 66. Different in more ways than one compared to all the dash models before it.
 
I have thought about this "dash" thing before, with some wonder, as to desirability. I always felt the earlier examples might indicate a more "hands-on" fitting of the inner system, as well as exterior finish.

I think all would agree the 30s, 40s, guns would have had more attention to perfection than the 60s, 80s....I believe agreement also would follow, that the Model 27, 3 1/2", one of the most desirable and pricey of Smith handguns, is likely to have a higher price tag as a pre-27, or 27-2 than one of the "brand, spanking new" classics.

The other thing that is a bit puzzling is, these dash guns are engineering changes, indicating a change for the better.(?)

Even so, most (collectors) still prefer the no-dash, low-dash, and "pre"model number guns, despite the fact that the changes were brought about by Smith & Wesson, which most all here would argue is the best handgun manufacturer bar none.

So,...if the best handgun company in the world decides a change is needed, why don't the collectors clamor for the "newest, best, most improved"?

I expect it is in part because those buying these revolvers, are the same people who, more or less, feel like a lot of "older" items were actually better, than what we can find these days.
 
It is my understanding that most of the engineering revisions were cost saving on the part of S&W and it did not necessarily mean these changes made the gun better. That said, I try to do my research on the revisions when buying. Of course condition of the gun is top priority. But I do like some no dash models as well as a -3 or -4 occasionally. I do my no means consider myself and expert on these guns. Just my opinion.
 
For me it's mostly about aesthetics; to me a bolt rifle doesn't look right unless it has a Mauser-style claw extractor. In the same vein, Smith revolvers don't look "right" to me unless they have a hammer mounted firing pin. I like P&R, but it's not necessary ;).

This isn't to say that I don't own any push-feed bolt actions, or that all of my S&W's are pre-lock & hammer-nose, just that I prefer the looks of those two features.

-Klaus
 
I'll take anything like no dash or dash 2, no IL or has the IL if it's in nickel I could care less about the dashes, no dashes or IL or no IL I could care less it's buy that nickel.

New or old any s&w gets my juices flowing.

Don't limit yourself to certain things like dashes or no dashes. There's a whole world of different guns to enjoy out there. Remove those blinders and get browsing. New, old, antique, surplus military it's all good. Dabble in a little bit of everything. It's fun, some are affordable.
There looking for a good home.

The dash numbers are the engineering changes that are made to each gun to upgrade it. To me for a shooter the higher the number the better. The new s&w m29-10 is suppose to be the best, in quality, the strongest, m29 that's been ever offered.
I don't play the dash game. I buy what I want to own.
 
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Dashes? No, I'm a model snob. If it has that little MOD in there I just don't like it!

Seriously though, I find that the dash our model may or may not matter on the gun. S&W has made great guns throughout it's history and that dash may be a clue pointing to greatness, or just the opposite.

I will say that the N on an N-frame's serial number is usually an indication that I will dislike the gun. S range forever!
 
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I had a Model 19-5.....some say they are lesser guns.....not even close , its finish was perfect and it was incredibly accurate.
 
I scarcely look at the dash numbers when I add a gun to my S&W collection. If it's a model I don't have and I want I'm done. If there is some reason it seems to be too expensive then I might investigate the dash but, otherwise, neither dashes, stocks, nor boxes matter all that much to me. I just collect the guns for the sake of the guns. Maybe I'm weird, I dunno, maybe I should modify my approach. We'll see.....

***GRJ***
 
DR505 said:
I am not a P&R snob though...I don't see the utility in a recessed cylinder for other than a rimfire. But I shoot, I don't collect.
Click to expand...


Kinda hard to be a P&R snob in this forum (post-1980.). Especially if you're a 686 fan:-)

I couldn't care less about P&R, either.

Human nature being what it is, the negatives are what get the publicity. People don't remember and repeat changes that were improvements, e.g., were I to go shopping for a 629, I'd want a later dash, one that has the endurance package or whatever they call it.

Now I wouldn't call anyone a snob, it's just what they like.
 
I like them all dash or no dash.
I do prefer the firing pin on the hammer. Don't know where this change happened.
I like the old bluing too.
My other issue is the recent barrel shroud. If I want one with a shroud I will get a Dan Wesson and be able to swap barrels.
Just me I guess.
 
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