Battle Of The Bulge

[usmc2427765]

I had an uncle that fought in the Battle of the Bulge, he was infantry and I don't recall what unit he was with. He never talked about his experiences but would sometime get the 1000 yard stare. In 1968 I received orders for Vietnam and we had sort of a family going away party for me.

He attended and waited until I stepped out of the house for a breath of fresh air and he then proceeded to tell me of the battle and his experiences. His eyes took on a different look as he described friends lost, being wounded and a short trip to a field hospital and back to the line. At some point his unit engaged an SS unit and it was some of the bloodiest fighting he experienced. They would never surrender and the Americans killed most of them and wounding a few which were taken prisoner. This was about the time of the Malmedy massacre however word of this atrocity had not reached them. With his flat almost lifeless eyes, he relayed to me that no SS prisoners were taken after that.

He survived the war, sort of. And I survived mine, sort of.

 

[crazyphil]

General Sherman was right. War is Hell!

 

[Ogandydancer]

he relayed to me that no SS prisoners were taken after that.
This is something that I had never heard.

 

[cmort666]

he relayed to me that no SS prisoners were taken after that.
This is something that I had never heard.

I've heard it before, and even had they been so inclined, I doubt many Japanese Special Naval Landing Force personnel would have been allowed to surrender in Manila either.

You reap what you sow, and the Germans and Japanese sowed plenty. Needless to say, there are those who would paint THEM as the victims.

 

[Beemerguy53]

...You reap what you sow, and the Germans and Japanese sowed plenty...

I've had a lifelong interest in World War II and the Holocaust. It has always been sadly amazing to me how a cultured, civilized, educated and religious nation got to the point that the mass murder of unarmed non-combatants became acceptable...

In the early 1980s, Robert Conot wrote what has become the definitive book on the Nuremberg war crimes trials. In "Justice at Nuremberg", he presents, in exhaustive, excruciating, heartbreaking detail, what happened in occupied Europe and Russia under the Third Reich. It's still in print, available from Amazon and other sources, and it's very illuminating...

 

[Kinman]

Atrocities are committed on both sides, one man's revenge is another's criminal act.

 

[cmort666]

Atrocities are committed on both sides, one man's revenge is another's criminal act.

Show me the counterpart to Babi Yar committed by the U.S or British Armies in WWII.

Show me the counterparts to Treblinka, Sobibor or Maidanek run by the U.S. or British governments in WWII.

Show me the counterpart to the Rape of Manila by U.S. or British forces in WWII.

You can't say everybody does THAT.

 

[Ogandydancer]

I've heard it before, and even had they been so inclined, I doubt many Japanese Special Naval Landing Force personnel would have been allowed to surrender in Manila either.

You reap what you sow, and the Germans and Japanese sowed plenty. Needless to say, there are those who would paint THEM as the victims.

I had an Uncle who fought against the japanese in New Guinea and as far as I know until his dying day would not buy anything if he knew it was made in Japan. He suffered from foot rot and nail fungus for years because of having to march thru so many swamps. He never said it out loud but I believe he genuinely hated them.

 

[cmort666]

I had an Uncle who fought against the japanese in New Guinea and as far as I know until his dying day would not buy anything if he knew it was made in Japan. He suffered from foot rot and nail fungus for years because of having to march thru so many swamps. He never said it out loud but I believe he genuinely hated them.

They left an impression all across Asia and the Pacific, almost never a favorable one.

 

[Justin T]

My wife's grandad was in the pacific at the end of the war. He was preparing for the invasion when they dropped the bombs, so he is fond of saying those bombs quite likely saved his life. Over the last few years he's opened up about some things, but they are usually the inocuous things that become reasonably pleasant to remember. About the other side of it? He says, "We saw and did terrible things. That's all you'll ever get out of me".

My dad's favorite uncle was of the same mind. Ironically, he and my wife's grandad chewed a lot of the same dirt and likely never knew each other (I've pieced together their travels with some research). He told everyone who asked, "You're not old enough for that sort of story". Regardless of age.

 

[Doug M.]

When I was in college, I had a job in a hotel. My assistant manager's hubby had jumped in on D-Day. He stayed in the Guard and retired a major, but was a raging alcoholic for many years. All he said about it when he got into AA and got his life back together was that he did not drink when he went the Army, and did not stop when he got back. Many of these men (and women), in every war, did things that had to be done, and did not care to talk about those events.

 

[BigBill]

Do you think that war is any different today? I think today they put a word on all the different stresses our guys go through today.

When I took the job building 155 mm howitzers for the us Army they asked me if it bothered me that what I'm building is going to kill people.
I said it's going to save american lives and kill the bad guys. I got the job.

 

[sheepdawg]

My dad was captured by the Americans at Metz in October 44, a place Patton nearly got his *** handed to him by the Germans. He told me SS usually got 45 a.c.p. justice. Thankfully he was Wehrmacht and was treated well.

 

[88IROC]

Battle of the Bulge

A book recommendation. John McManus has written several excellent WW II book. This one I came across last year.

Everybody knows about Bastogne. So this book is instead dedicated to the story of the US troops who faced the first onslaught, delayed the Germans with tenacious defenses, and made the stand at Bastogne possible. It's available in all formats including kindle.

I always liked "Battle: The Story of the Bulge", by John Toland.

 

[Absalom]

I always liked "Battle: The Story of the Bulge", by John Toland.

Toland's work, although a bit dated, is a classic. But it's more of an overview of the whole battle.

The book I pointed out belongs with the more specialized battle studies and in this case devotes its attention to the opening phase of the offensive and those American units who faced the initial German attack, having to improvise a defense without much warning or preparation, a story that deserves more attention.

 

[crazyphil]

"It is foolish and wrong to mourn the men who died. Rather, we should
thank God that such men lived." Gen. George S. Patton, Jr.

 

[fordson]

There are three "Bulge Battle Books" I'd like to recommend.

Toland's "Battle: The Story of The Bulge". Dated a bit as others have said, but a good overview and probably the first one you should read.

John D. Eisenhower's "The Bitter Woods - The Battle of The Bulge". It takes a hard look at leadership, command and control, or lack of it - from both sides.

Charles B. MacDonald's "A Time for Trumpets". This one is a 630+ page tome written by the former Deputy Chief historian of the Army and a company commander who was there. Lots of first person accounts. Very good.

I'm going to pick up a copy of "The Alamo in the Ardennes" to round off my knowledge base of the battle. Thanks

 

[vigil617]

"It is foolish and wrong to mourn the men who died. Rather, we should
thank God that such men lived." Gen. George S. Patton, Jr.

Respectfully, it shouldn't be an either/or, General. It should be both.

 

[brucev]

Just found this initial post and all the responses that have made this a most rewarding worthwhile thread. Thanks to all who offered comments, etc. I will be late to the office. God will understand. My church members ... they will also understand. Sincerely. bruce.

 

[Kinman]

Show me the counterpart to Babi Yar committed by the U.S or British Armies in WWII.

Show me the counterparts to Treblinka, Sobibor or Maidanek run by the U.S. or British governments in WWII.

Show me the counterpart to the Rape of Manila by U.S. or British forces in WWII.

You can't say everybody does THAT.

You are absolutely right, not everybody commits wholesale acts of atrocity.