Bought my LAST new S&W revolver

I also have no intentions of ever buying a new S&W revolver.

I bought one of the new green no lock comp model 19 revolvers. The ejector rod was not straight. It looked like someone had straighted it enough to worked, but really looked cheep. But the killer was the sights could not adjust enough to get the gun on target. Shot nice groups, but a foot low and left, at 15 yards.

It is such a piece of junk. After having older S&W revolvers, S&W for me no longer exist !

It's just such a poor example of a revolver I have no desire to have it fixed, and too much respect to dump it on another person.

I will enjoy the older, real ones, not the make believe fake one's.
 
Not trashing the complaint you have or the comments anyone else has made, just chiming in from a legal angle and a longer term collector who buys one or two per year for 5 decades, I have a pile.

You complaint is not well described in terms of how the world works today in manufacturing and distribution. The earth is no longer flat and the term common sense has changed in meaning, we all need to keep up.

When an issue comes before any CS group, the issue of shipping relies on many things. Of course with your background as the head guy of the third largest company of it's kind you know that CS people are not located in the supply or parts house and often not in the same state. An electronic communication goes into a first come first served pile of digital orders, you know that.

The CS guys would not likely have any idea how many spare parts of that kind are in storage for some future complaint, especially if that is a part that never or seldom fails. When a product is that good, they do not order or store a lot of those parts, so factually and practically, when those guns are that good, you would normally expect delays, and perhaps until a new production run of that part is ordered. That being said, where do they source small gold bead pieces that are used to enhance visibility for shooting handguns. The CS people would not likely know where those little gold beads come from, because Smith and Wesson produces or has produced many different guns with many different sighting options, perhaps in the thousands.

I assume the gun still shot just fine, but the gold bead might have aided the sight picture?

Personally, I buy one Smith and Wesson handgun per year, sometimes 2 and in recent years only buy new ones. I have had exactly one problem, and that was the cheap little fibre optic piece in the front sight of the 5.7 x 28 handgun. Like yours it just went flying off at the range. Apparently they have a front sight problem. Superglue or epoxy likely would have prevented that. I will be calling them next week and see how my complaint compares with yours.

Historically, I have never ever had a problem with them. I was asked to evaluate a SW AR 10 and we found the rifle was shipped with no rifling in the barrel whatsoever. They made it good immediately.

As to your comment about them not accepting used guns. From a legal standpoint AND from a practical standpoint it is not just a business decision. Once a gun enters private hands, it is a product of unknown damage and there is no idea of whether the gun has fired ammo above the proof testing protocols. It would be legally insane for any company to take a gun back after ownership has changed.

Why? because people who buy things and damage them lie about them and try to return them for a full refund. When a person like yourself, suddenly wants a new gun because the front bead on the front sight fell off, you suddenly become a common sense suspect case.

I once bought a used rifle for a fraction of the cost, the local dealer refunded the full price of the gun and took it back. I was offered the gun cheap with the understanding in writing that it was suspect and I waived all liability. The facts were the guy bought it a week before deer gun season, kept it 3 weeks and brought it back claiming it was not accurate. That was lie, I killed a huge buck with it later and it shoots just fine. People do that.

Keep in mind that Walmart is an easy company to sue, because they have lots of money. Monsanto the company that makes Round Up week killer is an easy company to sue, and Smith and Wesson is easy to sue because they have lots of money. Juries almost always buy into the lies of individuals suing big companies. Did I mention that I am a retired attorney?

Smith and Wesson would put their company at risk for every gun that they accept back as they could not sell it without risk. And the cost of proof testing all such returned guns would destroy any profit margin built into the gun.

Practically speaking, I understand your frustration. I have plenty of money and would like to add a 610, but am not willing to part with $1,200 for one, and probably never will, I have lots others, including vintage that perform very well, and certainly much more powerful than the nice little 10mm, I have them in 1911s and like the round a lot. Milder that 357 wheel guns and just a pleasure for an old guy to shoot all day.

I am curious why you just did not shoot it as is, until the new bead comes in the mail, eventually, their data base will find one and be shipped to you. Then you can epoxy it or superglue or whatever. So, did you try shooting it like I did with my fiber optic insert removed? It does make a difference in daylight, but I noticed it did not matter much when I was shooting in a dark range.

As to never buying that brand again, there is always an issue of the competition. I am well aware that Taurus is getting very , very few complaints about their wheel guns. That is when you look at the number they market and the number that actually have problems, the number is statistically insignificant. I am neither a Taurus fan or do I trash them, I have their Rossi lever guns in 454 and 357 and one of their 357 wheel guns, and a couple others, all are perfect in every way. I did send a used Rossi wheel gun back a couple years ago to replace a missing sight, they did, even though I was the second owner, they cleaned and polished the gun, test fired it and had it back in 2 weeks, and it never cost me a dime. Taurus? Who knew. The little 9 shot ultralight is now my tackle box gun, loaded with snake shot for fishing. It replaces my vintage SW model 63, a collectors item that lives in the safe.

You just bought model 63, so your know, mine was made in 1980, barely got the pinned barrel one. You are lucky to find one of that vintage, most folks hang onto them, mine is extremely accurate and I cherish that one.

Just saying, no company should replace or buy back a used gun, one that has legally changed ownership, that is not even a close question. And in my view, there is a logical reason why they cannot immediately tell you when that small part might be found at the supplier and when it could be shipped directly from the source to you, or to Smith and Wesson and then on to you.

Then again, the gun should be just fine, but that the bead would enhance your sight picture during shooting sessions with good light. I am reminded that I have several dozen guns with plain front sights. All of them would be better with gold beads or maybe fibre sights, but they work pretty good without that addition. I carried handguns with plain black front sights in harms way outside the US and at 4 different law enforcement agencies for half a century, and they worked OK. Not trashing your choice, just mentioning an option.

An maybe Taurus would be a better place for your new acquisitions. I love my Rugers, but not very impressed with their customer service at all. That said I will probably keep buying Rugers anyway. And I have some Colts, they have lost their appeal to many, but mine are just fine. None of those companies are perfect, just saying.

I am just suggesting that marketing in the modern world is different and maybe there is a better way that taking a loss on a gun when the proper part will get here eventully.
Gee , guess thats what one gets in new 610 mountain gun, PP quality. Never mentioned suing anyone as have seen enough of such. Fact it didn't have a forcing cone was a " fixable" problem . Another foul up by S&W. Fired it one time and after the results why would I want to keep shooting? Really turned me off. BTW have about 30+ other S&W revolvers and the ones I shoot have been fine. Maybe I'll stick to 1911s…..
 
Talked to 3 different " customer support" guys and none could explain the problem. I asked them why the small part could not be taped to a sheet of paper and mailed in a business envelope, no response. Go figure but I call BS, IMHO the truth is no one at S&W gives a rat azz. Sadly typical of far to many businesses in the US.
I had a problem with the de-cocker on my model 669. Took it to a gunsmith and he could not fix it, but said it was fixed. Sent it to Smith & Wesson because I saw where the 669 had a recall on the de-cocker. It was fixed for free and returned within 14 days even though I was told it might take months.
 
I also have no intentions of ever buying a new S&W revolver.

I bought one of the new green no lock comp model 19 revolvers. The ejector rod was not straight. It looked like someone had straighted it enough to worked, but really looked cheep. But the killer was the sights could not adjust enough to get the gun on target. Shot nice groups, but a foot low and left, at 15 yards.

It is such a piece of junk. After having older S&W revolvers, S&W for me no longer exist !

It's just such a poor example of a revolver I have no desire to have it fixed, and too much respect to dump it on another person.

I will enjoy the older, real ones, not the make believe fake one's.
Could you post a picture of your rear sight blade? I have a problem in my mind imagining an adjustable rear sight blade that would be so far to one side as to not allow the gun to shoot forward and only still shoot to one side.

You do know that a replacement sight blade would probably be an ez fix for that correct. As a young cop in the 70s, we often had to adjust both fixed and adjustable sights, as many of the fixed sight Smith and Wessons simply did not come from the factory to shoot to point of aim, but once adjusted they were good for life, so if you ever buy a used cop SW gun, they should have been corrected early on.

For those not familiar, you can just enlarge one side of the rear sight a tiny about and that will correct the problem. Same thing with fixed sights. Here is a blurb from Gun Digest, anybody can fiz them.

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Adjust Iron Sights On A Fixed-Sight Semi-Auto Pistol

To make horizontal adjustments on most pistols, you move the rear sight. Use a brass or copper punch and a hammer, or an adjustment fixture. To move the bullet impact to the right, move the rear sight to the right. Move the sight to the left to move the bullet to the left. Many modern pistols will have a front sight that is installed in the slide by means of a dovetail. Just like the rear, the front sight is pressed into the dovetail and left centered on the slide.

If you have a pistol that strikes right or left of your aiming point, look first at the front sight as a check. Measure it. Is it centered? If it is, then you can proceed to make your corrections on the rear. If it is not, plot the front sight offset, and how it affects your problem. If you find that you have a pistol that hits to the right, and curiously enough your front sight is left of center, perhaps the front is more of your problem than the rear? Center the front sight, test-shoot again, and see what happens.

Unlike barrel turning, you can calculate the exact amount you have to move your pistol sight without trekking back and forth to the range. The ratio of the sight radius to the correction needed is the same as the ratio of the distance to the target and correction on the target. This is the same formula in Chapter 3, using a mill to adjust your sights. The sight correction divided by the sight radius equals the target error divided by the target distance.
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This is often a problem with Glocks, but easily fixed in about 5 minutes, same with wheel guns like the model 19, 66, etc. I have several.

Shooting a foot low at 15 yards sounds a bit strange. He you fired more than one brand of ammo from a rest?

Shooting low is not a problem, like shooting high can be. Why? Because once you decide on the perfect groups and perfect round for that ammo, if you do not have enough elevation adjustment, You just take off tiny, tiny, tiny amounts of the front sight to get to Point of Aim. It is simple, as cops we were doing that in 1970 that I recall, same with every wheel gun. Of course you can twist the barrel sometimes, but why bother when there is an ez fix anyone can do. Turning a barrel is gunsmith work, adjust sights is an operator activity for gun owners.

So, take a picture and post it, any old wheel gun guy can tell you how to fix it, in minutes.
 
Gee , guess thats what one gets in new 610 mountain gun, PP quality. Never mentioned suing anyone as have seen enough of such. Fact it didn't have a forcing cone was a " fixable" problem . Another foul up by S&W. Fired it one time and after the results why would I want to keep shooting? Really turned me off. BTW have about 30+ other S&W revolvers and the ones I shoot have been fine. Maybe I'll stick to 1911s…..

I build 1911s and love them. Not sure what the forcing cone issue is, but send it back. It might take months, but you are going to be months older anyway. Make them make it right, you paid for it, do not let them get away with it, that is how we make companies make better products.

And those of us who do have 30 other handguns, have plenty to shoot while it is being repaired. Just saying, do not let them beat you down, their problem, their nickel, they can fix it.
 
Doubt the trouble will be worth it, I'll just go to my jeweler friend and get him to gold plate the head of the right size nail/ tac and loc-tite it and most likely sell it. Really Po'ed as been looking for a 610 for several years. Just finished a Colt 1911A-1 match pistol. 2 slides, one traditional and one with a green dot. To range tomorrow before dentist. Most likely fire another 50 rounds with my Delta Elite to satisfy the 10 mm itch, lol.
 
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