Boxes- How much added value w/gun

[125JHP]

I know its nice to have the correct box for a nice old gun, kinda like wearing period clothes. Many seek the right box, even if it didn't come with their particular gun.

Its been pointed out many times the survivability of cardboard is much less than steel and boxes are much more scarce than the items they contained. so... putting aside the nostalgic visuals and collection satisfaction aspects of the subject... and I know the answer to my next question probably varies, to a great degree on what gun model, time period etc, but I am thinking of the more common to semi scarce periods, that there would be a good supply of collectors looking for... Say boxes from the 50's to pre-plastic era.

How much does the box really add to the saleability of a particular gun or could one realize more bottom line money by selling them separate?

Some actual examples would be nice but since I don't know the subject that well let me make one up, say... a 50's K-38 worth $500 and separately a correct gold box in pretty good shape with a value around $50 (tell me if I am off here).

Would the pair sell for significantly more together? About how much more? and if so why? Same scenario with a 60's or 70's gun. IOW does the rule hold true across more modern time periods.

 

[LoboGunLeather]

The difference is significant enough that there are counterfeit S&W box labels being made so that a period-correct box can be "matched" to the handgun.

 

[ar15ed]

i think it totally depends on the condition of the gun. a 98%+ gun in its original box is definitely worth a noticeable premium. an ugly, poorly refinished, or damaged gun may or may not even be worth the value of its box alone.

the desireability of the gun comes into play, too. having the original box for a minty pre-27 might be worth hundreds of dollars (box along with a nice registered magnum might be worth 4 digits!), while a 90% 1975 vintage model 28 might not bring an extra 20 dollars for having its correct box.

i guess the third thing would be the age of the package. a nice 20s or 30s gun is gonna be very lucky to still have its box in decent condition, and i think it would up the value considerably. an 80s gun might not be worth even a few dollars more with its original box. BUT! i guess as time goes by, it can only help. in 50 years, an 80s gun in its original box may be highly sought after!

 

[madmikeb]

I bought a used but unturned, 1980 vintage 3rd generation Colt SAA in 44 special a couple months ago. When I went to pick the gun up the crew at the shop spent a good two hours trying to find the box, when they finally gave up the manager offered to take $125 off the price. Needless to say I quickly agreed and brought the gun home!

 

[jrs70]

I would not pay top dollar on a pre 14 (95-98% so they said) with out the box, items for the box and stock grips number to the gun. I would have payed good money for the gun as it sat.

But that's just me.

Paul

 

[125JHP]

Thanks for your insight, and I agree with what y'all are saying. ar15ed pointed out several important considerations and that the desirability of the gun itself (whether it be age, condition or scarcity) plays a big role in how much the box adds to the total sale price, if any. This indirectly leads back to my original question.

MadMikeb gives a good example, however he doesn't mention how much it will typically cost to find a box for his gun, and if it is, say, $100 then we can answer my question for that example... that it adds $25 to the bottom line. (Check back with them, they may find it and give it to you once they forget the discount you got), good luck.

One factor already mentioned is gun condition. I would guess that this is a sliding scale since there are probably more newer guns in high condition. At what point do you think the box doesn't add very much based on era? ... 98% in the 70's & 80's, 95% in the 60's and 90% for the 50's or how would you structure it? Does this percentage go much lower as the gun gets older? say, a well used (60%) HE from the 20's with a box is worth a lot more than the two separately? Some of those old boxes get pricey and I would think you wouldn't put a 95% box with a 60% gun very often but I'm talking avg condition whatever that is.

Here's what I'm trying to get at... Any particular gun has value X and an avg box for that gun is worth Y so if you put them together is the sale price Z usually going to be higher than their combined value? And under what conditions it might be better to part them out as the box is not going to bring any added value and may even end up as a throw-in?

I suppose the mania for blank labels and number of boxes for sale brought on the question in my mind, as I too always thought having a box with the gun made it more sell-able, but for how much more was always a question. Especially if the box is not originally for that gun and with the prices of boxes going up regularly, it also occurred to me that there must be a point where the box I found 10 years ago is worth more separately now.

Any other opinions?
Thanks

PS all the numbers and prices I used are made up for example purposes and have no bearing on reality.

 

[ar15ed]

i will jump in and say that (i think!) the gun has to be well above 90%, or so, to make the package worth more than the lone gun and the box seperately! does that make any sense?! the old boxes are bringing crazy money right now. i watch lots of them on ebay every week. if you have a crusty, ugly, old renickled 1905 4th change, and a decent box for it. the gun is just not gonna bring mucho dinero, but the box might very well go out of the ballpark. i recently ran into a perfect example at a gun show. a young man was walking around with a sweet looking, very OLD looking black s&w clamshell box. of course, i asked him what he had, and it was an old breaktop 32. the poor old gun had been buffed so bad, it literally didn't have a sharp edge on it anywhere. most of the stampings were barely even legible. it had a really fresh, very shiny blue job, trigger, hammer, and all. i'm sorry, but, honestly, it was very obviously a clunker with very little real market value. he was asking 500 for the little guy. i have since seen him at two more shows with it. last time, i think he was asking 350, still with no takers.

BUT MAN! the box was superb. i didn't want to harm his feelings, so i didn't offer any free advice, but i think he would be better off selling the box on ebay, and then deciding what he had to try to get out of the old gun, and moving forward. a lousy gun just eventually drags down the potential of the box.

on the other end of the deal, if someone with a sweet, 98% old correct gun for that box, had that box, i think it would help his value significantly.

but you still have to use your brain! it kills me to see folks asking $50 dollars+$10 shipping for a box for a 6-inch model 28-2 or a '75 model 36. usually there is just not enough room in the pricing of a fairly common gun to command much extra for a box.

there are just a lot of variables to consider on a "by particular gun/box" basis.

 

[ar15ed]

see, i am already having to back up a little! i will mention registered magnums again. say you have a 60% 4 inch registered magnum, with a pitted bore and a broken grip panel. the CORRECT numbered box is STILL gonna add BIG value to the package.

speaking strictly for myself, an old (say 30s or 40s back) gun is going to be pretty desireable with its box, even with some considerable wear. obvious bad-refinishing would be way worse to me than honest wear. (the guy's little breaktop being a good example!)

 

[bobbidoll]

OK I need help on boxes, what would be reasonable for boxes only,
blue and/or silver 70"s S&W. and brown woodgrained colt with the styrofoam inserts.
Bobbi

 

[125JHP]

Reasonable is relative. Are you wanting to buy or sell?

A lot of it depend on what area of the country you in. I've bought boxes for as little as .50. Back east they seem to be more plentiful and a little cheaper that what I see out west, although I did recently buy a box for a Colt Govt. 380 for $1.25

I was seeing them at gun shows for $5-$20 with most in the $10 or less range. That was 6 years ago. Nowadays more show dealers seem to know the price potential of boxes and they seem to want to sell em for $20 ~$50. If you can get one you need for under $20 then I'd buy it. I'd buy just about any and all for under 10 when I see em.

 

[Black_Sheep]

I don't see much added value unless the box is original to the gun, otherwise it's just a novelty...

 

[125JHP]

I slightly disagree, sometimes the addition of a box or even plastic carry case can sway a "typical" buyer - it gives them something "extra" for their money and is nice to hold without worry of fingerprints etc.

 

[GF]

Some of us try to put higher condition revolvers together with the correct stocks and box to have a complete set. I like to have some of my collection as it was when it was new.

I probably spend more to put them together like this than I could sell them for but.... it makes me happy AND they're not for sale.

GF

 

[mag318]

Guns in their original boxes will always be more valueable and command more money. Some values are greatly enhanced with the original boxes, Colt SAAs are a perfect example. As for Smith & Wessons, guns that a few years ago wouldn't be considered collectable now are. I believe S&W helped this along when they started using MIM parts and added the LOCK. A lot of people now prefer the older pre lock and pre MIM examples. Collectors are scarfing up early stainless examples, especially in 98% or better condition knowing they will only increase in value. Every collector and shooter I know seeks out examples with the original box. How much a box adds to the value of any firearms depends on the gun itself and how much someone is willing to pay for it.

 

[CALREB]

you know with flea bay the box business has gotton out of control,I saw an ok box for a 17-4 with the docs,big deal sell for 255.00 recently,everyone advertises their box as being from 1955,because of the statement inside,I like having the ORIGINAL box for guns Im buying to collect,but 100.00 extra for a shooter,because of the box no. I personally wouldnt split up an original box and guns,but in some cases you could definitely make more money that way,you only need one or say two buyers to bid them up. bob

 

[rburg]

We have a resident box expert here who hasn't chimed in yet. DanT, where are you hiding?

I collect guns, and I collect boxes. Sometimes I get lucky and put them together. Other times I purchase a gun with a box. You really have no idea if its the exact original box for the gun or not. Others don't have to agree with me. It sure makes a gun more salable if or when you decide to sell it.

The issue of the gun and box being worth more together or apart has been debated here for a long time. When it looks like they're worth more apart, many sellers just separate them. When a buyer insists it just a gun and the box adds no value, the negotiations change. If he's trying to beat me over the head and shoulders, he won't get the box, but he'll pay nearly as much.

Years ago, back on the RM question, I was walking a gun show. We'd set up and I wanted to take a turn around the show. I walked past a table full of good stuff. The owner was Ray Brazile, an he had a little card table set up behind his table. On it was a long RM box. Nice condition if not perfect. He wanted $300 for just the old cardboard. It was tearing me apart. I walked on but was tortured enough to return to my table. My pard was sitting there and asked me what was wrong. I told him. He said I was a fool (John didn't mince words), and to just go buy it. By the time I got back, someone else had more sense than me and was quick with the money. I've regretted it ever since, and I learned a lesson.

When you see a box you crave, just buy it. Don't hesitate. Over time you realize you don't see some boxes very often, if ever. When one comes up for sale, you just spend the money. Grips work the same way.

 

[stumper]

Personally, I don't think there is even a question of if, a "correct" box adds value to a gun. It is only a matter of how much value it adds. Certainly the original box might add even more value but generally it is difficult to determine original vs correct. I think there are very few collectors out there who would not pay more for a gun if it had a correct box with it. I think it's only a matter of how much more. It might only be $25-$50 more for a newer gun up to several hundred more for an older gun - or more.

 

[azasadny]

Typically, I've seen the box/papers that originally accompany the weapon add 10% to the values of the item, but there are always exceptions.