brass collapsing while seating bullet

[Johnnn01]

The brass bulges out in the area just under the bullet, and
the aol is good.
The brass stamped RP seems to be the only one doing this is RP brass junk? Winchester brass does not do this.
Am I supposed to be lubricating jacketed bullets?

 

[ronnie gore]

brass

sounds like your expander die is not adjusted correctly, or the expander button is to small.

 

[Johnnn01]

Originally I had the expander set too deep.
I have two different bullets one is .4002 they collapse / bulge the case, the other bullet is .3998 and they do not bulge the case.

 

[scooter123]

First, just to clarify, if you aren't having issues with chambering you really don't have a problem or bad brass. It's quite normal for some brands of brass to show a bulge where the the bullet is in the case and it's due to the case having a slightly thicker wall. IMO thicker wall in a case usually means that case will last longer than a thin walled case.

Second, in the event you have a bulge slightly BELOW the bullet and are having chambering issues, read on. Because that is a separate problem related to set up of your tools or in some cases the caliber or choice of bullet type.

You don't mention the caliber but from my experience I can almost guarantee that you are loading a revolver caliber, based on popularity probably 38 special or 357 Magnum. As for how I can say this, I've been there done that. The problem is that with the longer case length of a revolver caliber the Column Strength is reduced (read up on Euler's Buckling Equation for more detail). As a result a case that is just a whisker too long will collapse and bulge if a combined Seat/Crimp set up is used. The solution is to separate Seating from Crimping. I now use separate seat and crimp dies dies for ALL of my revolver loads. I also purchased a second Lee Factory Crimp Die so I could set it up for 357 Magnum specifically without a spacer ring, because I ended up with Magnum brass that was bulged at the bullet and also bulged down near the base and the FCD was the easiest way to resolve that problem. BTW, used Birchwood Casy Super Blue on the 357 Magnum FCD so it is easy to spot which die is for which length case.

On the off chance you aren't having this issue with revolver cases but are instead loading for a semi auto I would still suggest separating the Seat and Crimp operations, because if you pull a bullet and check you will likely find that you are pushing up a significant burr on the bullet jacket and it's that "bite" that is causing your case bulge.

 

[Johnnn01]

the caliber is 40 s&w and I might have too much taper crimp, maybe. I could separate the
seat and crimp, there is an open station that would make things easier.
the rounds do chamber, but I do not feel comfortable shooting them.
I wish I had a picture, the bulge is only on one side, not the normal bulge of the bullet
in the brass where you can sort of see the end of the bullet, but the brass is sort of
collapsing and causing a bulge.
out of about 80 rounds 7 have this problem and they are only rp brass with a .4002 bullet

 

[ironhead7544]

Not sure what you mean. If you are getting a little bulge, it is not a problem. Pics would help. It sounds like you may not have enough flare. Short cases may cause this. If the bulge is not all the way around, the bullet may not seat straight. This could be due to not enough flare or the bullet seater plug not right for the bullet. Try seating without a crimp and see if the bulge disappears. I always crimp in an extra step as this can eliminate problems. I use the Lee Factory Crimp.

Chamfer all your cases when you get them, too.

A lot of people question the looks of their reloads as they will probably look a little different from factory loads.

 

[Pisgah]

Try making seating and crimping two separate operations. It is quite easy to misadjust a seat/crimp die and end up with a bulge or collapsed case. Much easier to be precise when you seat, then crimp.

 

[Johnnn01]

thanks for the help, I will pickup another die to separate the seat and crimp and see what happens

 

[yeti]

It sounds like the bullets are not seating properly. Is it possible that they may be cocked slightly? Seating & crimping in separate steps is good advice until you figure this out.
Add a little more to the expander die and flare the case mouth just enough. Not to lead bullet seating levels, but just enough to get em started squarely..no more.

 

[fredj338]

If you are collapsing cases, you are doing something very wrong. You need to flare the case properly. That is just enough to allow the base of the bullet to fit. Then just enough taper crimp to straighten everything out. RP brass is thin, not suitable IMO for jacketed bullets, any caliber. Check your seating stem, it should have a flat cup face, not rounded.

 

[nicky4968]

The Lyman M die may be a better expander die than the one you're using.

 

[mikld]

Is there an actual bulge in the case or a "wasp waist" area where the bullet has enlarged the case a bit? If there is a bulge, something is putting pressure on the case an resulting in the case walls bulging outward. Add a bit of flare to the case mouth. Measure the bullets with a micrometer. Measure the case mouths if possible. Normally .002" difference should be enough neck tension. Some manufacturers will use thicker brass in their cases and when sized (squeezed from the outside) the case mouth will be smaller...

 

[Alk8944]

I have been reloading .40 S&W since shortly after it was first introduced, about 20 years now. I have loaded thousands of rounds, all brands of cases, Lead, Jacketed and Plated bullets, and have never seen what you are describing! Pictures would help, but the situation makes no sense as you describe it.

Two thoughts:

1) Are your Remington cases .40 S&W originally, or are they 10mm trimmed to .40 S&W length? If they are trimmed 10mm you can't do that! Internal taper will cause what you describe.

2) As suggested, seat and crimp in two steps, or at least to set the crimp properly. If you are using a taper crimp die start by backing the seater die out 2-3 full turns. Place a ready to load case in the shell holder, run the ram up all the way, then screw the die down until the crimp just touches the mouth of the case. Back the die out 1/3-1/2 turn and set the lock ring. Seat a bullet in a charged case and seat a bullet to the desired/specified LOA in several cases (you might need them). Using these cases, back out the seating stem, release the lock ring, run a loaded case into the seater and turn the die down until it touches the mouth of the case. Lower the ram, turn the die in 1/3 turn and then crimp. Measure mouth diameter compared to about 1/8" down the case. Continue to screw the seater down, crimp, and measure until the case mouth is .002-.003 smaller that the case body just below, then stop, and set the lock ring. With the cartridge all the way up screw the seating stem down snug against the bullet. Take another loaded case and seat and crimp in one step, measure the LOA. If too long adjust the seating stem down a few thousandths until length is correct again. Then set the lock ring on the seater stem. You should now be ready to seat and crimp that bullet style in one step. If you do it just as I have described whatever problem you are seeing will go away, guaranteed.

Note: If you are using mixed brass, as it sounds you are, you will experience a different amount of crimping effort between brands. Be sure to always move the press handle all the way to the stop when moving the ram up, and for all operations.

 

[SMSgt]

You have a tight sizing die. Of course a larger diameter bullet will cause more bulge than a smaller bullet, but unless the case exceeds SAAMI dimensions it shouldn't be an issue.

Now a truely collapsed case is an entirely different issue and must be corrected. i reload Rem cases all the time and other than being softer I find no reloading differences.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

I think he has the seating/crimping die set incorrectly. the crimp is being applied before the bullet is seated causing the case to buckle.

 

[SMSgt]

PICTURE PLEASE

 

[gwpercle]

Post some photo's. Could be the bulge with larger diameter bullet is in the normal range for reloading. Cast bullets, which are normally larger than jacketed, often show a slight bulge at the base and it is normal.
Collapsing a case is not normal. Picture worth a thousand word's here.

Gary

 

[blujax01]

The OP stated that the bulge is on one side. This is an indication that the bullet is going in crooked. I agree with the poster who said to check the seating stem for correct orientation.

 

[Pisgah]

I think he has the seating/crimping die set incorrectly. the crimp is being applied before the bullet is seated causing the case to buckle.

+1. At least the most likely and easiest-to-check cause.

 

[Wolf1775]

I think he has the seating/crimping die set incorrectly. the crimp is being applied before the bullet is seated causing the case to buckle.

+1 as well. When I started reloading this happened to me on the first few rounds, and then after I adjusted the seating/crimping die I stopped having problems.

Try following what the video shows; it should help out some. If it doesn't, then your brass might be too thin, which might also be cause for some other concerns.

http://youtu.be/OPtdEFS2CAo