Cancelled backorders for Federal 22LR on MidwayUSA

[Jerry N.]

For all the people complaining about canceled backorders from Midway, I have a few questions. 1. Do you currently have .22 ammo, if so, how much? 2. How much .22 ammo do you normally shoot per year? 3. How much .22 ammo and what specific brand did you have on backorder with MidwayUSA?

FWIW, we're not all hoarders. I had a case of CCI MiniMags on backorder. I'm not sure how much I have or how much I shoot, but I have enough for awhile. Scoring the case would have been nice so that I didn't have to be so reliant on the deal of the day and all that goes along with that. There's no doubt that ammo can be obtained. The backorder was a good amount for me at a good price. That combination is hard to come by these days.

As has been mentioned, the rub is not that I didn't get my backorder. I understand the world changed and I also understand it was a long shot. The rub is that I got an e-mail on a regular basis (especially when my CC was about to expire) which got my hopes up, some people were getting their orders filled but worst of all was getting the cancellation a day before they offered MiniMags for sale (limit 10). Especially since the cancellation said that they didn't know when they would be able to get the product from the vendor.

Midway could have:
1. Cancelled my order sooner.
2. Offered me an alternative (i would have been very happy with 10 boxes at the $6.99 they sold them for).
3. Been honest (we were caught off guard) which they knew a long time ago (see #1).

I recognize that the I won't shop at Midway anymore is no big deal to them, but I'm tired of being treated so poorly by companies and I have to draw a line somewhere. My hope is that at some point it will matter.

 

[flybye]

The ROI (return on investment) aspect could very likely be a viable reason for a continued shortage with 22LR. Kinda like the unleaded gas vs diesel pricing. They are getting a ton of ROI with their diesel pricing to offset the lower volume of the product. The lower volume aspect of the 22LR doesn't fit in that aspect of the shortage conundrum because there is a demand for it. Don't like it one bit

Or could it be that they feel, why sell ammunition that should sell for .04 a round when they could sell ammunition that sells for .20 a round or more. I saw the youtube video on making .22 ammunition and it looked more labor intense then center fire ammunition which was fully automated. Am I right I don't know only the manufactures know for sure and I'm wrong a lot of times. It just seems like if they are working 24/7 then there should be .22 showing up. The hoarders and hucksters can't be buying it all especially with limits on the amount you can purchase. I've seen it trickle into some stores and some not getting any, but centerfire is showing up in larger quantities now, but a lot of import ammunition is showing up and over priced ammo is staying on the shelf.

I didn't get to read the American Rifleman article I think the mail person has my copy reading it as with my copies of H.O.G. and Enthusiast magazines as well but she is cute so I don't complain.

OH NO a conspiracy theory get out the tin foil hats look out for the zombies, the government is stock pilling it to deal with public unrest. Some say .22 is the best survival round so load up the bunkers.

 

[JamesArthur60]

The 22 ammo subject never dies. As for Midway, I personally dropped them and switched to Brownells on-line sales. Great website for Chat Now questions. With no 22 ammo, is anyone buying 22LR handguns/rifles? I've looked, but said, no way…no ammo available. The, 'oh wait a couple years and it'll be available again' was nothing but a lie.

 

[slickracer]

Midways' response:

Thanks for taking the time out of your day to contact us. As you might imagine, since we cancelled thousands of unfillable backorders for 22 Long Rifle Ammunition in the last few weeks, Larry has received a dramatic increase in email volume and can't possibly answer each one so he has enlisted my help to respond to customers. I assure you, this decision was not taken lightly. We knew that it would be wildly unpopular with our customers who had been waiting a year for product, but regrettably when this ammunition run first began we were caught flat footed. Before we realized the gravity of the situation, we had taken far more backorders than our allocations from the manufacturers would allow us to fill in a reasonable time frame. We stopped taking backorders, but kept the existing ones on the books (without payment from customers, of course) to see if the situation would improve. As you well know, it has not. As a result, we have decided to cancel all backorders per our policy once they become a year old because it became evident that old backorders were not going to be fulfilled in any reasonable or predictable time. It is important for MidwayUSA to respect the resources of its Customers and Stakeholders and not keep obligations in place beyond a timeframe that is reasonable. We are very sorry for this, and our inability to get enough product to satisfy our customers demand. Larry agonized over this decision, but we didn't see any other course of action based on the current supply compared to the demand for 22 Long Rifle. I am on Rimfire Central, AR-15.Com and the Smith and Wesson Forum mostly in my personal life. You are correct, we are getting roasted on the forums just like we knew we would. You can see we have been taking a beating over the last two years on 22 availability…but that does not change the fact I can't get enough 22 to cover the demand. Everyone is being treated the same way on this one, which is why no exceptions are being made. As a lifelong shooter, I certainly understand your position. When we first ran out of 22's Larry suspended the employee purchase program and cancelled our backorders because customers come first. At the time, I thought it was temporary. We could see the light at the end of the tunnel…now my friend, I don't see that light. I think it will be years before the industry can catch up because everyone is buying all the 22 they can whenever they can. If everyone would just take a breath and only buy what they need to shoot that month, the industry would catch up. I am getting more 22 ammo in than I have ever gotten in the history of the company! But as soon as you tell someone they can't have something, they have to have it. Guys that maybe fired 500 rounds a summer are sitting on 10,000 rounds and still buying whenever they see it. Until the demand settles, this crazy supply situation will continue. I am sorry we can't meet the orders. Believe me, if we had a way out other than this we would have taken it. I have worked for Larry for 19 years, and actually was a customer at the old gunshop that evolved into MidwayUSA before that. This is the first time I have felt we have failed our customers. And believe me, I don't like it. It won't happen again. We will never again get caught that flat footed and take that many backorders on a product without realistically evaluating how much product we will be able to obtain. I certainly wish I had better news, and am sorry we let you down.



On behalf of Larry, we are truly sorry for this,



Eric Ellingson

Contact Center Supervisor

MidwayUSA


What a bunch of nonsense.

Bottom line seems to be that those of us that believed them when they said they'd honor back orders are screwed. So if you don't have a cell phone app to receive their "notifications" the second they're released you're further screwed by their current business model.

Nice of them to cancel my BOs just in time to send out a notification the ammo I had on BO came in stock.

Larry and Midway can take a flying leap...

I'll preface this by saying I just had to backorder cancelled. I think this is a sincere response and will continue to buy from Midway. In the past year I was able to purchase a case of Blazer, a case of Federal 510 and a case of American Eagle from Midway at pre-panic prices. How many other places didn't jack up their prices? Not many that I can recall. And they've been getting some ammo in lately at reasonable prices. Haters are going to hate but I'm going to give Midway the benefit of the doubt. Like Larry or not, he does A LOT for the shooting sports.

 

[Overpaid Union Thug]

Midways' response:

Thanks for taking the time out of your day to contact us. As you might imagine, since we cancelled thousands of unfillable backorders for 22 Long Rifle Ammunition in the last few weeks, Larry has received a dramatic increase in email volume and can't possibly answer each one so he has enlisted my help to respond to customers. I assure you, this decision was not taken lightly. We knew that it would be wildly unpopular with our customers who had been waiting a year for product, but regrettably when this ammunition run first began we were caught flat footed. Before we realized the gravity of the situation, we had taken far more backorders than our allocations from the manufacturers would allow us to fill in a reasonable time frame. We stopped taking backorders, but kept the existing ones on the books (without payment from customers, of course) to see if the situation would improve. As you well know, it has not. As a result, we have decided to cancel all backorders per our policy once they become a year old because it became evident that old backorders were not going to be fulfilled in any reasonable or predictable time. It is important for MidwayUSA to respect the resources of its Customers and Stakeholders and not keep obligations in place beyond a timeframe that is reasonable. We are very sorry for this, and our inability to get enough product to satisfy our customers demand. Larry agonized over this decision, but we didn't see any other course of action based on the current supply compared to the demand for 22 Long Rifle. I am on Rimfire Central, AR-15.Com and the Smith and Wesson Forum mostly in my personal life. You are correct, we are getting roasted on the forums just like we knew we would. You can see we have been taking a beating over the last two years on 22 availability…but that does not change the fact I can't get enough 22 to cover the demand. Everyone is being treated the same way on this one, which is why no exceptions are being made. As a lifelong shooter, I certainly understand your position. When we first ran out of 22's Larry suspended the employee purchase program and cancelled our backorders because customers come first. At the time, I thought it was temporary. We could see the light at the end of the tunnel…now my friend, I don't see that light. I think it will be years before the industry can catch up because everyone is buying all the 22 they can whenever they can.
Until the demand settles, this crazy supply situation will continue. I am sorry we can't meet the orders. Believe me, if we had a way out other than this we would have taken it. I have worked for Larry for 19 years, and actually was a customer at the old gunshop that evolved into MidwayUSA before that. This is the first time I have felt we have failed our customers. And believe me, I don't like it. It won't happen again. We will never again get caught that flat footed and take that many backorders on a product without realistically evaluating how much product we will be able to obtain. I certainly wish I had better news, and am sorry we let you down.



On behalf of Larry, we are truly sorry for this,



Eric Ellingson

Contact Center Supervisor

MidwayUSA


What a bunch of nonsense.

Bottom line seems to be that those of us that believed them when they said they'd honor back orders are screwed. So if you don't have a cell phone app to receive their "notifications" the second they're released you're further screwed by their current business model.

Nice of them to cancel my BOs just in time to send out a notification the ammo I had on BO came in stock.

Larry and Midway can take a flying leap...

I'm going to have to agree with what was said in the letter....

".....I think it will be years before the industry can catch up because everyone is buying all the 22 they can whenever they can. If everyone would just take a breath and only buy what they need to shoot that month, the industry would catch up. I am getting more 22 ammo in than I have ever gotten in the history of the company! But as soon as you tell someone they can't have something, they have to have it. Guys that maybe fired 500 rounds a summer are sitting on 10,000 rounds and still buying whenever they see it."

I admit I almost became one of those people. When I first bought my M&P 15-22 (my first gun purchase ever) back in November I had no idea that the situation with 22 LR was so dire so I just jumped right in. For someone like me that is new to guns/ammo I thought $5.99 for 50 rounds of Norma Tac22 (for example) was a decent price. When I told my friends and co-workers about buying the M&P 15-22 all of their responses were the same. "Good luck finding the ammo." I was like...."But they usually have it at the gun stores?!" Then after a few of them explained that a very short while ago the same ammo was basically half the price I started to regret buying that rifle. So, I started looking at these forums and paying attention to all of the "available ammo threads". I signed up for various websites' "notify me" alerts for when 22LR was available. I was buying the bulk 22LR at the cheapest prices (cheap by today's standards) whenever I could. I even figured out the the local guns stores were buying their Norma a local guns and ammo warehouse (Midsouth Shooters) and selling it at a markup so I just started buying it there too.

I was doing all this even though I was already sitting on a pretty good supply of 22LR. I came so close to becoming a hoarder. I wasn't nearly as bad as those pathetic losers that are waiting outside Academy and Walmart like clockwork several days a week but I was buying more than I needed. Not anymore. I've since moved on to bigger and better things. I just completed building a 5.56/.223 AR-Pistol that is blast to shoot and will soon buy a regular pistol too. Buy adding more to my "arsenal" to take to the range I won't be shooting up as much 22LR and that will make my current supply last at least 2.5 years at the current rate I'm shooting it.

There is no need for me to buy anymore 22LR. I could have stopped a long time ago regardless of finding additional guns to shoot at the range. That is what everyone should do. Don't wait until your are bone dry to buy it but definitely stop buying it only because it's available if you are already sitting on thousands of rounds. That is the problem. Not the vendors for not being able to keep up.

 

[brucev]

All right. Here it goes. It would have been better for the fellow at midway to have simply drank a cup of coffee to find a backbone and then plainly stated that they made the decision to cancel the BO's b/c it best suited them. Period. Fine.

To try to pretend that they have acted with integrity is absolute hogwash. If I pulled that sort of stunt with someone, they'd call me a liar and have every right to do so. Period. Any and all obscuration on my part would be nothing more than ... hogwash. Period.

I am growing increasingly tired of hearing about how midway has done so much for so many people, etc., etc., etc. Since when is it a thing to applaud when a company acts with integrity? Since when is is a thing to excuse when a company chooses to act dishonestly? The little paragraph in which the fellow from midway seeks to explain away their own failure to act with integrity just does not pass the smell test. It is nothing more than an excuse. To put it a little more bluntly, it amounts to the skin of the truth... stuffed with a lie.

Given the way midway has handled this matter, they have placed themselves in the same class as Cheaper Than Dirt, etc. They make no offer of a substitute product, etc. They just cancel the BO. And, if one does not just say "Thank you very much!," then you can always rely upon someone to opine that you are wrong for objecting, etc., etc., etc.

It is the oddest thing in the world. Almost routinely one hears of some screw up by government at the federal or local level. Almost routinely one hears such screw ups declared to the the fault of that particular agency of government. Citizens and taxpayers are not criticized for expecting government to function correctly nor are they criticized for refusing to tolerate screw ups that cost them money especially when those "errors" are the result of egregious errors on the part of people who are supposed to know better. Almost routinely in such cases, there is the expectation that those responsible for the failure will be held responsible.

Why should it be any different at all when the mistake, error, failure, oversight, miscalculation or just plain screw up is the result of a business instead of a branch of government? I just can't see any reason at all to cut midway any slack. Nor am I at this time persuaded by those who would offer excuses for conduct that would be condemned out of hand if it were done not by midway but by some branch of government. Sincerely. brucev.

 

[BE Mike]

I'm wondering if some of these canceled back orders have freed up .22 ammo to other companies. I was at a store yesterday and they had quite a bit of pistol ammo and .22 ammo for sale. First time in a long time I've seen such availability at the brick and mortar stores.

 

[Overpaid Union Thug]

I'm wondering if some of these canceled back orders have freed up .22 ammo to other companies. I was at a store yesterday and they had quite a bit of pistol ammo and .22 ammo for sale. First time in a long time I've seen such availability at the brick and mortar stores.

Some of the big box stores started changing up their stocking times. They are doing it to thwart the hoarders and those that are only buying it with the intent of selling it at a markup. Maybe that is why you are seeing some. I got lucky at Walmart late one night a while back and scored a 1000 round brick that (in addition to what I already had foolishly bought as an ignorant newb to the gun world) enabled me to not have to buy anymore for a very long time. The cashier explained to me how they were attempting to stop the hoarders. LOL!

A couple of the Academy employees told me that one of the "regulars" that would be waiting outside the store on truck days before the store was open threw a fit about the random stocking times. He just couldn't fathom that there might be other people in the world besides him that want to buy the same thing. I tell you man some people just don't get it. Why someone would possibly need all of that ammo at once is beyond me. Reminds me of Gollum from Lord of the Rings. I guess the boxes of 22LR are their "PRECIOUSES." And the thought of hitting up all the stores at certain times several (or more) days of the week in order to buy up the ammo is beyond me as well. Sounds like some people need to get a life. If the stores stick to the random stocking times those hoarders will have to practically live in those stores in order to be the first to get their Preciouses. That or they'll just have to be content with what the already have. Maybe instead of EVENTUALLY shooting it they can just polish them and put them in little display cases around their house or just cuddle with them and continuously whisper "MINE!" over and over to pass the time between checking the available ammo threads online and running out to the local big box stores to buy 22LR at the old standard price before someone else does.

 

[ScrapmasterFlex]

My other backorder, 5000 rd cs of Federal Gold Medal Match HV 40gr RN just got canceled... it was $400 (my Rem ThunderBlt 5000rd cs was $220).


Sucks.

I will not continue to discuss it because I will have to say some things contrary to what a few people seem to think is acceptable etc. and I'll wind up banned. But hey, at least I have a decent stash of .22LR at the present. Sure could have used it tho

 

[Harrison]

It is very sad what Midway has done with orders for 22RF. I too had an order for 5000 rounds, which I placed in 2-13, was placed on BO, and than notified my BO was canceled. In my part of the world, 22 at a reasonable price, and in quantity is difficult to find and pistol powder, if available at all, is outrageously expensive. This state of affairs lasting over two years goes beyond mere supply shortages.

 

[Krogen]

My other backorder, 5000 rd cs of Federal Gold Medal Match HV 40gr RN just got canceled... it was $400 (my Rem ThunderBlt 5000rd cs was $220).

My backorder for the same ammo was also cancelled this morning. I have given up on Midway to honor their word, market pressures notwithstanding.