can't wait for another non IL.. not

[turbo38gn]

Ok, so I went out and added a few non IL revolvers to the family. I was excited, they were what I wanted in new revolvers, half the price and very attractive to the eye. Got to the range Monday night, and within minutes of shooting my beautiful new to me 10-7... I was struggling to empty the remaining couple of unfired rounds, so I could put it back in my bag before it blew up or the trigger locked up beyond repair.... no kidding, thats exactly how it went. Now onto my next purchase, ok, 19-4 snubby, she's a beauty, nickle plated, tight, just can't wait to get a good holster so I can CCW it... not today... I did shoot about 60 rounds through it, mostly +P.. shot ok, but as the rounds added up, I was pretty flustered from the 10-7, I can't tell you exactly what didn't feel right in the middle of those 60 rds, but I had some problems with that one as well.. it began to tighten up, mainly when I tried to open it to dump the fired shells, but it got harder and harder to open... ***.. so back in the bag with that one and out come my MP9 and MP40... I blast out about 150 more rounds, no where near as accurate as usual as by the time I packed in my 2 prize non IL guns I was talking to myself telling myself I should have just bought a new 686 or 627 whatever with an IL and been happy cause I know it would not fail me... ***...

Now that I got that out of my system, there are those that could never trust these guns again... I'm not one of them, I will figure it out and they will be as good a new when I'm done. I played with the 10-7 this morning early, everything functions fine, couldn't see anything wrong, ok, off to the side with that one and out with the 19-4... I can't open the cylinder at all after working it, cleaning, oiling.. I see where I have to push that forward pin under the barrel to open it. I take the side plate off, lots of fine grit in there, looked like the powder grain from the old shells I fired from the night before, blow it out, spray it down with brake clean, blow it out again, oil everything up, still won't open without me pushing that pin forward.. ok, my plan is to bring both of them over to S&W main gate, fill out the paperwork and just have em both gone through.. before I do, I go up to my LGD where I purchased them and tell him what happened, he says bring em back he'll take a look, he used to work at S&W. .... The 19-4 had the cylinder rod back out, easy fix, he said he had the special tools for that, the 10-7 not sure, but he said he'll figure it out... ok, we'll have fun with those 2 guns soon, I haven't lost my faith in them oooold guns... stuff happens, we fix em and move on.. I really wanted to fix em myself, give me a little time, I need to get that book on revolvers I just read about and I'll be ready to learn.. I am old school in I prefer to do it myself, kinda like a few guys arounds here..

Thanks for listening and letting me vent, I kept it in all day and last night too.. I really do like the oldies.. hey.. I bought that M36 off the board last week.. hope I have better luck with that one when I get it..

 

[TOMFD]

Wow, never had 2 old revolvers go bad at the range at the same time . Actually never had 2 go bad ever . Usually , when I buy an old revolver I mini tune it up before range time with a good cleaning and oiling . I found the starting of a crack in the case of a m37 under the barrell prior to shooting and was able to bring back for full refund because I didn't shoot it .That saved me almost 500$ . I have had semi's not go bang when I pull the trigger but not old revolvers .

 

[Amir Fleschwund]

Funny,I never had any qualms about tearing down and rebuilding my series 70 Colt 1911, but much more scared to take apart my Smiths!

 

[turbo38gn]

Wow, never had 2 old revolvers go bad at the range at the same time . Actually never had 2 go bad ever . Usually , when I buy an old revolver I mini tune it up before range time with a good cleaning and oiling . I found the starting of a crack in the case of a m37 under the barrell prior to shooting and was able to bring back for full refund because I didn't shoot it .That saved me almost 500$ . I have had semi's not go bang when I pull the trigger but not old revolvers .

Nor have I until Monday... I do have a few older ones, a 629,19-3, and a 10-7 snubby. All have been fine. Of course I have several IL revolvers and they have all been flawless.. Don't ya know, this would be my luck, but I am confident we'll have em better than new soon. Like I said the 10-7 3" just bound up tight as I shot it.. before I could get through 6 shots I knew something wasn't right. Tried another cylinder full and don't think I fired 2 shells... and it was binding hard, like the trigger was really hard to pull, so I unloaded it, closed the cylinder and pulled the trigger a bunch and all seemed fine, loaded back up, one shot and it did the same thing.. the 19-4 snubby should be no problem, guess the rod was loose.. what causes that? And yes, I did inspect clean and oil both guns.... everything seemed fine, I was so excited to shoot them.. at first thought maybe it had something to do with the old ammo I was using, but don't think so.

 

[maglvr]

Funny,I never had any qualms about tearing down and rebuilding my series 70 Colt 1911, but much more scared to take apart my Smiths!

Absolutely "nothing" in there to be scared of!
If you ever built a model as a kid, you did 10 times the work!
They are easier than working on a fishing reel, and who hasn't done that a few times.
Parts are parts, period. They only go together one way and work right, whether it's a fishing reel, a Ford Bronco, a weed whacker or a S&W.
If you have doubts, pull the side plate, snap a pic before you start taking things out.

 

[Maximumbob54]

Don't feel too bad. I only recently learned to check for wear on the hand that rotates the cylinder. My 19 will be going in for parts as well.

 

[kennyb]

the ejector rod becoming loose is very commonplace...simply tighten it...remember the newer smiths tighten counter clockwise...lockup is also commonly caused by grit/dirt under the ejector star...scrub under there and leave dry so as not to attract crud
the IL has nothing to do with either of these problems...as much as some would like to believe!

 

[ladder13]

Pics and/or witnesses or it didn't happen.

 

[turbo38gn]

the ejector rod becoming loose is very commonplace...simply tighten it...remember the newer smiths tighten counter clockwise...lockup is also commonly caused by grit/dirt under the ejector star...scrub under there and leave dry so as not to attract crud
the IL has nothing to do with either of these problems...as much as some would like to believe!

Thanks much Kenny, I appreciate it. I know it's minor, as for the IL comments, those are kind of tongue in cheek.

 

[turbo38gn]

Pics and/or witnesses or it didn't happen.

How do I show you a cylinder that won't open... or a trigger that binds up? you'll have to take a ride up here, we'll go to Smith and Wesson, you can try firing my 2 prize pre lock guns.... When we are done up there, we can hit Hooter's and then I'll send ya home.. But really, it happens... glad I didn't trust em to just carry, you know, since the pre lock guns never have problems.. or so I have been told here.. In the future I honestly plan to buy brandy new 627 Pro, 686 3" and a few more, no doubt they will have IL's, but I would bet my life they will fire everytime.. The odds are probably better than shooting a 15 year old plus gun..

On another note... how bout dem Blow sox!!! grrrrrrrrr

 

[Class III]

If it's only doing it while the revolver is loaded you may have a proplem where the firing pin bushing has worked loose and is rubbing on the head of the shell casings causing the cylinder to be placed in a bind only when the cylinder is loaded. This would give you the same feel as if a primer had backed out, dragging while trying to pull through the trigger. I've seen it happen two times so I know it can happen. On both of the revolvers I saw it happen on, both where returned to the factory for repair. My best guestimate though is that the ejector rod has backed out.

Class III

 

[turbo38gn]

If it's only doing it while the revolver is loaded you may have a proplem where the firing pin bushing has worked loose and is rubbing on the head of the shell casings causing the cylinder to be placed in a bind only when the cylinder is loaded. This would give you the same feel as if a primer had backed out, dragging while trying to pull through the trigger. I've seen it happen two times so I know it can happen. On both of the revolvers I saw it happen on, both where returned to the factory for repair. My best guestimate though is that the ejector rod has backed out.

Class III

Very good, thank you. The ejecter rod definitely worked loose on the 19-4 snubby. Should be all that is wrong with that one. On the 10-7... your description of the head of the shell casing rubbing absolutely sounds like what it was doing. When I opened up the cyl. and removed the cartridges, closed the cylinder, I could pull the trigger all day long and it functioned fine.... Load it up, pull the trigger and it got progressively harder to pull the trigger or for the cylinder to turn... after each shot.. either way, my local gun dealer has both guns, I'm waiting to hear back.. it's killing me, I wanna know now!! I wished I kept them in my possesion longer to poke at them...

 

[TOMFD]

On another note... how bout dem Blow sox!!! grrrrrrrrr

Wow,,,That was Cruel!!!

 

[turbo38gn]

Wow,,,That was Cruel!!!

I'mn sorry Tom, I am a diehard fan.. it's killing me. I know they will win their share, Texas will lose 6 in a row at some time. It all equals out, but it's terrible to watch, then listen to WEEI and the D&C there talk about DiceK and how bad he is or the know nothings call in with whats wrong and the woe is me calls.. Just drives me nuts... Listening on the rad today when Bard came in had me out of my mind, just as Reyes did laast nite.. I mean what the Hay... !!! Don't get me going on Drew in right field either... Ok, I gotta stop now, I won't talk about the Celtics tonite.... I can't watch it anymore... is it over yet..

 

[turbo38gn]

If it's only doing it while the revolver is loaded you may have a proplem where the firing pin bushing has worked loose and is rubbing on the head of the shell casings causing the cylinder to be placed in a bind only when the cylinder is loaded. This would give you the same feel as if a primer had backed out, dragging while trying to pull through the trigger. I've seen it happen two times so I know it can happen. On both of the revolvers I saw it happen on, both where returned to the factory for repair. My best guestimate though is that the ejector rod has backed out.

Class III

I just remembered something... when the 10-7 was binding up and I kicked out the shells... one of the shells had a scratch across the back of the shell. I'm going out on the bench, I think I threw the shells in a box. I remember seeing the scratch and pointing it out to one of the range officers I called over, but he really didn't acknowledge my observation...

 

[turbo38gn]

Holy smokes.... I just went through the empty shells... I am amazed with what I just found. First off, the primers have to distinctly different striker pin marks. I could actually sort the rounds I shot in the 10-7 from the rounds I shot in the 19-4... kewl. Now, I shot 60 rounds in the 19-4 so I was right on there.. but the 10-7, I would have sworn I couldn't have shot more than 10 shells... I shot 18 rounds. I just took a pic with my phone, lets see how it looks.. I post it in a few... you can see the gouge on the shell from one side to the other across the primer

 

[Class III]

That mark is either being caused by the ejector rod backing out and forcing the cylinder to the rear and dragging on the recoil shield or the firing pin bushing has worked loose and has moved forward gouging into the head of the casing. Can't tell which one without looking at both points on the revolver, but both should be easy to diagnose. If the ejector rod has backed out. Tighten it (it's reverse threaded). You can tell if the bushing has worked loose by placing a straight edge across the bushing. The bushing should be slightly below the level of the recoil shield. If it's the bushing send it back to S&W as that is a factory fitted part.

Class III

 

[turbo38gn]

Ok.... here's the update. All fixed up, no big deal. My LGD I bought them from jumped in when I mentioned I was going to drop them off at S&W and I was ok with spending a few bucks if I had to to make em 100%.. He said give them to him, he stands behind anything he sells.. That's one reason why I deal with him. The 19-4, just needed the ejecter rod snugged up. The 10-7 had a tight cylinder hole. Not sure I remember the correct terminology, but it needs somewhere around 4-6\1000th clearance and 1 hole had zero.. Whatever he did... they both shot absolutely beautiful, that's it in a nutshell. The trigger on the 10-7 DAO has to be around 5lbs.. very nice for me.

Here's the family portrait I took last nite of my April purchases, including a M36, Ruger Mark III and a new BG380 with holster..

 

[Dave T]

Maybe it's a sign of age but 10-7s and 19-4s are not "old" guns in my world. I don't consider them old unless they are at least from before the days of model numbers. My $.02 worth.

Dave