Changing attitudes about concealed carry

[GypsmJim]

When we were dating, my wife knew I had guns but we never went shooting together because she wasn't interested. When both of my sons turned 7 they got a bolt action .22 for Christmas and they started shooting under my supervision. The guns were always locked up when we weren't at the range and they had no access to them. As they got older they increased their collection. When they grew up and moved out, their guns went with them.

Fast forward - on about our 38th wedding anniversary out of the blue my wife said she would like to get her carry permit and start shooting. She's now a collector as I am and now we shoot with the boys whenever we get a chance.

Sometimes hard to figure out the fairer sex, but in my case I know I married a good one....smile...

 

[GaryS]

In many, if not most, states gun ownership does not require a permit, while CCW does. A young female friend of mine lives in MD. She has a .357 revolver that she keeps at home. I don't think that MD requires a permit for that, only for CCW.

My daughter in law doesn't own any guns, but she's pro gun. She might get a CCW permit at some point, but living in AL, she doesn't need one to buy a gun to keep in her home.

My wife probably wouldn't have a license if my state didn't require it to possess a hand gun even in the home.

As I recall, TN doesn't require any sort of permit for purchase, just for CCW.

BTW, my thanks to the people of TN for electing pro 2A politicians. The states unilateral recognition of all states permits made it quite easy for me to carry last year when I was down there. As it will next spring when I expect to be at the NRA national meetings.

Below is a TN report for all permits issued in 2013 (new and renewed) Female/male ratio stays pretty consistent at 1 to 2 for all age groups until age 61 where the ratio changes quite a bit to mostly men. I guess us old farts just won't give up, eh?

I advocate for everyone to have the freedom to carry. I don't much try to convince anyone to carry. Carrying a gun is a lot of responsibility.

 

[ChattanoogaPhil]

In many, if not most, states gun ownership does not require a permit, while CCW does. A young female friend of mine lives in MD. She has a .357 revolver that she keeps at home. I don't think that MD requires a permit for that, only for CCW.

My daughter in law doesn't own any guns, but she's pro gun. She might get a CCW permit at some point, but living in AL, she doesn't need one to buy a gun to keep in her home.

My wife probably wouldn't have a license if my state didn't require it to possess a hand gun even in the home.

As I recall, TN doesn't require any sort of permit for purchase, just for CCW.

BTW, my thanks to the people of TN for electing pro 2A politicians. The states unilateral recognition of all states permits made it quite easy for me to carry last year when I was down there. As it will next spring when I expect to be at the NRA national meetings.

Right. The numbers posted were for handgun carry permits issued during the year, not ownership or purchase permits. We don't have those.

My guess is that gun ownership for many of the hundred million or so claimed gun owners in America, is a gun somewhere, probably not sure where, probably not sure when last fired.

No one in my family ever carried a gun as far as I know. My father was very pro gun freedom, but had no want for owning a gun. He traveled the globe to areas that would make the most violent places in America look like paradise.

Outside of law enforcement, I wonder how many who would not otherwise own a gun, purchase a gun for the sole purpose of carrying and actually carry on a regular basis? Ratio of gun enthusiasts to non enthusiasts who carry?

 

[GaryS]

Outside of law enforcement, I wonder how many who would not otherwise own a gun, purchase a gun for the sole purpose of carrying and actually carry on a regular basis? Ratio of gun enthusiasts to non enthusiasts who carry?

It would be interesting to know, but absent a nationwide database (a very bad idea) we'll probably never know.

A lot of people carry concealed and don't publicize the fact. Which is the point of carrying concealed.

 

[gunfighter48]

My wife always thought I was a little off for carrying. She wasn't anti gun, which was remarkable since she grew up in New York City. She and I talked about home protection and concealed carry quite often.

We went to a fast food restaurant one day and I ordered a take out meal. While we were waiting for our meal a 20 something male entered the restaurant wearing a black leather overcoat. I always sit facing the door and saw him come in. My wife leaned over and said you need to watch the guy in the coat. It was 85° outside that day and this dude is wearing a full length leather coat!!! I raised my shirt just enough to put my hand on my concealed 1911. He ordered his meal to go and the help got his order to him in record time. The manager had seen me put my hand on my gun. After he left the manager came over and said thanks for watching out for us!!!!!!!!!!

Right then I knew that my wife finally got it. She now understood why I carried. My talking with her did get through to her. She usually asked me if I was armed when we went out after that. I was always armed.

 

[GaryS]

My wife always thought I was a little off for carrying.

I think you've described it exactly. A lot of people think it's an odd, if harmless, quirk that people they know carry firearms for self protection. After all, the police are there to protect us. Sadly most people don't realize that there just aren't enough police to protect us all the time, or maybe even most of the time.

In the end, the person responsible for my safety is me.

 

[cmort666]

I think you've described it exactly. A lot of people think it's an odd, if harmless, quirk that people they know carry firearms for self protection. After all, the police are there to protect us. Sadly most people don't realize that there just aren't enough police to protect us all the time, or maybe even most of the time.

In the end, the person responsible for my safety is me.

What I said to my relatives in Chicago who said things like that to me when I told them I had my Ohio CHL:

• Police have no legal duty to protect you as an individual.
• Police have no legal liability when they fail to protect you as an individual.
• Police have virtually no physical ability to protect you as an individual.

Protect YOURSELF or just don't get protected AT ALL.

If police could "protect" people, Chicago's murder rate would be less than Wolverhampton's.

Cops aren't Doctor Who and police cars aren't TARDISes. They can't just keep doing it over again until you DON'T get robbed, raped or murdered.

 

[ChattanoogaPhil]

I think you've described it exactly. A lot of people think it's an odd, if harmless, quirk that people they know carry firearms for self protection. After all, the police are there to protect us. Sadly most people don't realize that there just aren't enough police to protect us all the time, or maybe even most of the time.

In the end, the person responsible for my safety is me.

I think most law abiding folks believe that the need to shoot someone in self defense while carrying is extremely remote. Outside of law enforcement, no family member, freind or acquaintance has ever shot anyone in self defense carrying or at home-- not an event that is easily concealed. Carrying isnt risk free. How many unintentional discharges are there handling carry guns while holstering? It's not like a gun that's left untouched in a drawer at home.

I get the helpless victim argument. After all, I carry. But I also understand that folks think it is odd and not a worthwhile effort, and i dont much try to convince them otherwise. If they knew the time and money i've invested in practice alone..... they may redefine from odd to nuts.

 

[cmort666]

I get the helpless victim argument. After all, I carry. But I also understand that folks think it is odd and not a worthwhile effort, and i dont much try to convince them otherwise. If they knew the time and money i've invested in practice alone..... they may redefine from odd to nuts.

However, their attitudes tend to change, at least somewhat, when THEY are the victims of violent crime.

My mother was stupid anti-gun... until somebody went upside her head and robbed her... too bad she lived in Chicago and had no recourse of any kind.

A friend's mother was about the same way, and in fact was quite nasty about it... until the millenium and she bought into the endless zombie apocalypse scenarios going around at the time. She frantically called her son asking to borrow a gun in anticipation of "festival". He simply said, "No" and hung up on her.

 

[ChattanoogaPhil]

However, their attitudes tend to change, at least somewhat, when THEY are the victims of violent crime.

My mother was stupid anti-gun... until somebody went upside her head and robbed her... too bad she lived in Chicago and had no recourse of any kind.

Im sure the horror and feeling of helplessness isn't something that quickly fades from memory. Yup, victims tend to get pro gun real quick, at least for themselves.

 

[eveled]

My wife was anti gun, until her smart phone went off with a breaking news alert, to an armed home invasion in our neighborhood. A helicopter flew buy hovering and spot lighting the back yard and our driveway.

She grabbed me by my shirt, and said "Get a gun now and it better be loaded for bear" I had to paraphrase it because there were about 5 words in her sentence I can't type here.

I told her very politely that I didn't believe in guns and I was a pasephist, and that guns were evil.

I never saw the hand coming but my ears are still ringing.

Just kidding about that last part she didn't hit me, but she made it very clear she did not think I was funny. Ed

 

[Madoktor1]

As of Sept 2014 there is 477k permit holders in Tenn.

http://www.tn.gov/safety/stats/DL_Handgun/Handgun/Current_HG_PermitHolders.pdf

Population of Tennessee is 6.5mil
23% are under 18.

Tennessee QuickFacts from the US Census Bureau

477k / 5mil (18 or older) is about 10%. If you changed "adult" from 18 to 21 (21 is required to get a permit) the percentage of course would be higher but I don't have an under 21 number.

Yes, you are right. Tennessee has a high percentage of permit holders but there are states with higher numbers.

I live in Coffee County and, according to this, we have about 10% with Handgun Carry Permits. I guess that explains why I never get a second look any where when I open carry.

 

[Madoktor1]

My fiance' wasn't anti-gun but she wasn't exactly pro-gun either due to an incident in her childhood. Since we have been together, that has changed. She knew beforehand that I owned firearms, that I hunted and was an avid shooter. I bought her a Marlin 30-30 and she now hunts with me. she didn't want to carry or own a pistol when I got my handgun permit but then she started watching the news and seeing things going on and changed her mind. She got her Handgun permit earlier this year and I bought her a Bersa .380 for our anniversary. She carries everywhere she goes the same as I do. She orders and buys as much ammo now as I do. Every time she goes to Walmart for groceries, she picks me up 100 rounds of .40S&W ammo and about every two weeks, UPS or FedEx is dropping off a package for her with .380 ammo. And we have weekly trips to the range, (usually her idea) and almost daily shoots out back behind the house. Peoples minds and opinions can be changed. I just takes the right stimulus and a good example to follow.

 

[ImprovedModel56Fan]

I think most law abiding folks believe that the need to shoot someone in self defense while carrying is extremely remote. Outside of law enforcement, no family member, freind or acquaintance has ever shot anyone in self defense carrying or at home-- not an event that is easily concealed. Carrying isnt risk free. How many unintentional discharges are there handling carry guns while holstering? It's not like a gun that's left untouched in a drawer at home.

I get the helpless victim argument. After all, I carry. But I also understand that folks think it is odd and not a worthwhile effort, and i dont much try to convince them otherwise. If they knew the time and money i've invested in practice alone..... they may redefine from odd to nuts.

IMO, this is all perfectly sane thinking. Nevertheless, I note that probably any of these folks who are homeowners have fire insurance.

The possibility of an ND is real, as we all know. It's not a big jump from there to a physical injury. Without confidence in my ability to keep this under control, I would be very hesitant to carry.

In truth, I am more likely to need to use my firearm against a dog or a small wild animal than against a human. But you never know. One is always free to leave his firearm at home and perhaps find out the hard way.

 

[Biggfoot44]

And no disrespect to the TN gunowners. Just a question of parameters. I was speaking overall of entire population. Once you start adjusting for age , prohibited persons, that's a big jump. And if you further apply probabilities as to sex, ethnicity, and further age, you can have some very high probabilities for certain groups for holding permits.

 

[ChattanoogaPhil]

IMO, this is all perfectly sane thinking. Nevertheless, I note that probably any of these folks who are homeowners have fire insurance.
.

Well sure, but unlike homeowners insurace, a carry permit isn't required to get a mortgage.

Your point is well taken about what motivates people to take precautions. A lot of folks would not wear a seat belt or use child restraint seats for fear of injury or death for themselves and family. But they will buckle up for fear of a $50 citation.

 

[Houdini1953]

I never really thought about it in this context. We should encourage our spouses and adult children to get their permits, even if they have no interest at this time to actually carry. If for no other reason, to show the law makers how many voters see the value of firearms.

All my daughters carry and have for years and the oldest one is another Annie Oakley she fires and hits the target quickly straight from the hip her 38 revolver, I must remember to never make her ill with me!

 

[pharmer]

I took my wife shooting a dozen times and then paid for the one-stop spiffy CWP class at the Orlando show a year or so back. She will put a 642 in the console of her car when going to "unfriendly territory" but I don't know if she will ever get the "self reliant" mindset. I love her anyway. Joe

 

[getoff]

when my wife and i were dating, the first night she asked me to stay over, i got very nervous. two reasons, first the obvious first time jitters, and second, the fact i had my old combat commander on. nervously i told her to not be nervous, but that i was carrying a gun. she said she was too and i knew then i had found the "one". that was about 10 years ago now. we still shoot on date night, and are still very much in love with each other and guns!

 

[Larry from Bend]

My wife had a S&W .32 when we got married -- Before we met she sometime carried it in her purse. I've always had guns (usually one on me) and it didn't bother her at all.

In fact, more than a few times when she had reason to be frightened by a situation, she has said afterward "I'm so glad you had a gun".