Correct method to clamp revolver in vise

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Hi all, new member here. Just purchased an S&W 640 Pro. Great gun with great sights, for a J Frame. Only problem is that the POI does not coincide with the POA. At 7 yards, POI is about 2-3 inches to the right and 3-5 inches right at 15 yards. Question is what's the best way to clamp the revolver into a vise to drift the sight without damaging it? I know it's not too bad but after paying extra for the sights, I figured POI should be closer to POA.
TIA!
 
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Hi all, new member here. Just purchased an S&W 640 Pro. Great gun with great sights, for a J Frame. Only problem is that the POI does not coincide with the POA. At 7 yards, POI is about 2-3 inches to the right and 3-5 inches right at 15 yards. Question is what's the best way to clamp the revolver into a vise to drift the sight without damaging it? I know it's not too bad but after paying extra for the sights, I figured POI should be closer to POA.
TIA!

Welcome to the Forum!

To drift the sights the revolver should not be clamped in a vise at all. There would be too much play and vibration for the hammer and punch blow to effectively transfer the force to move the sight. You could also damage the revolver striking it in a vise.

The revolver should be held down flat onto a smooth, hard surface and struck with a hammer and punch. You should try using a nylon faced punch first to see of that works. If the nylon absorbs too much of the blow, then you can step up to a brass punch but I would not use steel. It helps greatly if you could have someone hold the revolver frame down on that hard surface (take the cylinder out beforehand) so you could use the hammer and punch without slipping.

HINT: Place a pencil mark on the top of the frame right next to the rear sight so when you move it you have some sort of gauge to judge how much it moved.
 
Oh - make sure there isn't a set screw in the top sight! If there is, loosen it first. Some sights move easier than others. Some will move on their own (if there is a set screw and it is loosened) and some without a set screw feel like they have been welded in! lol.

I recently purchased a professional "sight pusher" because many of the sights now factory installed on the new 9mm pistols are actually night sights and IMO can be damaged by moving them with a punch. Some contain glass viles containing the chemical to make them glow and can crack if struck by a punch.

Also, some of the newer micro 9's have their sights installed so so tight, they are near impossibly to move with a hammer and punch. The sight pusher makes it easy and more precise.

You need not buy one of these for the 640 Pro as they don't contain any night sight vile as far as I know. If this is a one shot deal, you also do not need to spend $100+ for a tool to use only once. The method I described in the above post should do just fine.

BTW, always drift the rear sight in the direction you want the bullet to go. Drift a front sight opposite the direction you want the bullet to go.
 
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First, verify the barrel itself is not canted.

It may actually be easier to move the front sight slightly, instead of adjusting the rear base. If you decide to adjust the front sight, and if you don't have a padded vise, you can carefully secure the barrel in the vise using a couple of business cards, or small pieces of wood on both sides. Use caution when applying force to the vise as you do not want to over-tighten, and cause damage.

Start by using some penetrant on the base and dovetail and letting it work for a few minutes. Remember to strike the dovetail base, and not the sight blade when attempting to move the sight to the right the desired amount.

I've always used a piece of brass bar stock or brass round and a small hammer (4 oz) for this. The brass stock helps prevent damage to the sight itself. Any brass residue left on the sight base can be easily cleaned off with some solvent after the job is completed.



Carter
 
Thanks Chief and Armorer for all the advice. I'll try and drift the sight without clamping it in the vise first after using some Kroil to loosen it. Funny thing is I have one of those "professional sight pushers", an MGW Pro, but it won't work on a revolver. If that doesn't work, drifting the front sight might be a good idea as the dovetail has a smaller surface area. Thanks again!
 
OK, so first I have to admit I had to look up and see what a S&W 640 Pro is.

It's stainless steel and you can clamp the bbl in a vise securely w/o damaging it.
But, you must secure it so there is no vibration of the bbl when you go after the front sight with a hammer & punch to move it in it's dovetail.

To avoid vibration, avoid the padded feature type vise jaws. The rubber or other soft matr'l safety jaws that are common in the trade.

No matter how tight you squeeze that bbl in the vise, with that type of padding the bbl will vibrate. The vibration will make it appear as if the tiny sight is welded into place and not move for you.
Damaging the sight base is more likely the end result if it's fitted tightly to begin with.

I would clamp the bbl ONLY part of the gun horizontal in a bench vise with opposing wooden jaws.
The jaws don't have to exactly fit the contour of the bbl. Flat surface is fine.
But if there is a lot of taper to the bbl, one of the wooden jaws may have to be tapered as well for the assembly to hold in the parallel closing jaws of the vise.
A rough rasp can take care of that quickly.

The frame can hang freely off the end of the vise.
You want the bbl to be as completely held solidly by the un-yielding vise jaws as possible from vibration.
The wood safety jaws that support it will not let the bbl move or vibrate.

Add a thin card or paper shield betw the wood and the bbl surface if you want to to protect the surfaces.

Clamp the bbl up to the high point of the bbl radius diameter.

Don't leave the muzzle hanging free off the end of the jaw. Even a short distance will invite some vibration.

Depending on how long the bbl itself is, you can mount it into the vise jaws at a slight upward angle from below and allow the front sight base to be barely be reachable over the top.
This clamps more of the length of the bbl than the jaw width of the vise and further secures the bbl.

A brass punch as big as possible that will fit on the sight base edge. ..and use a hammer that has some weight to it.
You don't need to take a home run swing at the punch, but a heavy hammer will give it a lot of dead blow force to the punch strike and not bouce around.

You will be surprised at how easily these sights can be moved with the correct set up which isn't all that complicated to do.

A swipe of a Sharpie pen on the sight and base and a Witness Mark
on the sight and off onto the base before doing anything will show the starting point.
Any movement will easily be seen when the marks move apart.
 
Willfish30,

Sometimes things on the forum tend to get a bit complicated when in truth they are quite simple. All you need to do is remove the Cylinder (1 screw). Then have someone hold the revolver down on a hard & completely flat and smooth surface while you use a brass or nylon faced punch & hammer to move the sight. A pencil reference mark helps prove the sight is moving and by how much.

This is very simple and should take all of 2 minutes. Again, move the rear sight in the direction you want the bullet to move. I've drifted more sights in 50 years than I can remember and usually do so at a shooting bench so I can test it out immediately - then adjust accordingly.

HINT: When testing it, use the ammo you are going to shoot most often as different ammo can have different points of impact with the same sight picture.
 
FWIW, I always find the view of a sight moved to one side more irritating than just remembering to use a little windage!
 
FWIW, I always find the view of a sight moved to one side more irritating than just remembering to use a little windage!

If you own multiple guns you never want to have to remember which gun needs which windage compensation while shooting. Best to get it done correctly, POA=POI. Then, no guess work.

Usually they need to be moved so little the amount it is offset is unnoticeable (assuming there is no other problem with said gun).
 
Chief38,
Good idea about removing the cylinder. I guess removing the grips to make it that much flatter would also help.
 
I had two shooters other than myself shoot the J Frame. One is ex law enforcement that carries a J frame and the other an Expert rated Bullseye shooter that also shot to the right as I did. I'm also a Bullseye shooter so I would know about trigger control. Drifting the rear sights would be my last resort after all else failed.
 
I guess perhaps my method is too complicated, but it always works even on the most stubborn dovetailed sights as on rusted milsurps and crazy tight commercial guns.

Yes I've moved a ton of them by the 'Hold it down against the work bench or shooting bench' method as well,,and it does work if the sight isn't overly tight in it's dovetail (and they shouldn't be).
I've used the method w/o any help holding the gun in position too.
But a stubborn one, or one that's never seen moved before,,I'll wait to get at it with a vise available.

Having no idea here what the OP is up against here,
I opt to advise the OP for a better set up to avoid any damage.
I have no idea how tight S&W runs those small dovetail sights into position. Maybe they are easy to push around, I don't know.

A sight that refuses to move to a misguided punch strike to the gun resulting from what was supposed to be rigidly against the bench and wasn't isn't pretty & not easy to cover up.
..and it isn't necessary.

If you have a lot of experience doing this kind of stuff, and feel confident with the (I'll call it) free hand method,,then do it.

Both methods work, the difference is only in the experience and skill of the person swinging the hammer and holding the punch (and the gun).

It's not a big deal,,but neither is removing and replacing a simple screw.
But look at the nightmares this causes around the hobby and business.

Want to see how they adj dovetail type bbl sights in the Factory Ranges??
The the shooter wacks the sight with a plastic mallet while still sitting in their shooting position.
Maybe that's a better option....

We take much time and effort to buy and or grind the correct screwdriver or pin punch for working on these beauties.
Why not take an extra few minutes to cinch the gun up in a vise securely so there's no vibration or movement.
You don't need an assistant to hold the gun.
You don't need to remove the cylinder as it is outside of the grip of the vise jaws.
Pistol grips can stay in place as well.


That's about all I can say.
 
Chief38,
Good idea about removing the cylinder. I guess removing the grips to make it that much flatter would also help.

Yes - that's a given of course. I remove grips and the cylinder even for normal cleanings. Much easier to clean everything and less stress on the Yoke. Grips do not get beat up.
 
BTW, IF AND WHEN you ever need to mount a revolver in a vise, remove the grips and use "soft jaws" made of hardwood possibly with leather on the inside of them to protect the revolver's finish. Depending on the specific model vise you have, you might also need to knock out the roll pin that keeps the grips in place.

In all the years I have owned and worked on revolvers I have only had to mount one in a vise two times - that's it. Both times I had to remove a squib load bullet locking the cylinder in the gun because one of my shooting bud's failed to properly charge his reloaded bullets. After the second time, I advised him to REMOVE the TV from his reloading room and pay more attention to what he was doing!

I no longer live near him and can't help him out anymore, so he's on his own now - hope he learned his lesson.
 
To drift the sights the revolver should not be clamped in a vise at all. There would be too much play and vibration for the hammer and punch blow to effectively transfer the force to move the sight. You could also damage the revolver striking it in a vise.

The revolver should be held down flat onto a smooth, hard surface and struck with a hammer and punch.

This is horrible advice in my opinion
 
I had two shooters other than myself shoot the J Frame. One is ex law enforcement that carries a J frame and the other an Expert rated Bullseye shooter that also shot to the right as I did. I'm also a Bullseye shooter so I would know about trigger control. Drifting the rear sights would be my last resort after all else failed.

They both have too much finger on the trigger.

That is why my BUG (Back Up Gun) was a Colt Detective Special. I also was the Captain of our PPC Team.

You not going to use a J Frame at 15 yards. Leave it alone and practice more.
 

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