Detonics Combat Master

[OLDSTER]

I had one of these back in the '90s. VERY well made and and reliable. However, I could never understand why a compact pistol such as this was designed with a sight radius an inch shorter than it could have been. Brainless!

Not brainless; purpose designed to carry the gun in "condition 2" The rear of the slide was designed so the thumb was in position to cock the hammer as the pistol was drawn from holster. BTW, it works very well, and I wonder why other manufactures of SA pistols haven't copied the design; apparently, folks no longer want a gun designed for "condition 2" carry. And in a self defense, adrenalin overload, situation, what does sight radius at 10 feet really matter ( sort of like trigger pull).

 

[Mainsail]

Not brainless; purpose designed to carry the gun in "condition 2" The rear of the slide was designed so the thumb was in position to cock the hammer as the pistol was drawn from holster. BTW, it works very well, and I wonder why other manufactures of SA pistols haven't copied the design; apparently, folks no longer want a gun designed for "condition 2" carry. And in a self defense, adrenalin overload, situation, what does sight radius at 10 feet really matter ( sort of like trigger pull).

One thing I've noticed in the limited time I've owned it; these guns are sprung tightly. The firing pin spring needs to be stiff, the recoil springS need to be stiff, and the hammer spring is stiff to counter the firing pin spring.

All to say, it's really hard to thumb that trigger back when drawing, which isn't helped at all by the short grip.

I'll be carrying C&L when I get it running.

 

[stansdds]

The hammer spring has to be very heavy, powering the firing pin is not its only job. A heavy hammer spring provides a lot of resistance to the slide as it attempts to move rearward during recoil. A light mainspring will result in the slide having little resistance during recoil, allowing the breech to unlock too soon and the slide will batter the recoil spring guide rod head and impart a far greater shock to the receiver.

 

[ContinentalOp]

The hammer spring has to be very heavy, powering the firing pin is not its only job. A heavy hammer spring provides a lot of resistance to the slide as it attempts to move rearward during recoil. A light mainspring will result in the slide having little resistance during recoil, allowing the breech to unlock too soon and the slide will batter the recoil spring guide rod head and impart a far greater shock to the receiver.

In some custom 1911s they'll install a lighter hammer spring, but they'll balance it with a heavier recoil spring.

 

[stansdds]

In some custom 1911s they'll install a lighter hammer spring, but they'll balance it with a heavier recoil spring.

I have been there and done that, but doing that is counter the way J.M. Browning designed the 1911. A heavier recoil spring does less to control the unlocking of the breech, but will propel the slide forward with far more force which can batter the feet on the bottom lug of the barrel, the slide stop pin, and the pin holes in the receiver.

 

[ContinentalOp]

I have been there and done that, but doing that is counter the way J.M. Browning designed the 1911. A heavier recoil spring does less to control the unlocking of the breech, but will propel the slide forward with far more force which can batter the feet on the bottom lug of the barrel, the slide stop pin, and the pin holes in the receiver.

Agreed. I prefer to stick with the standard spring weights.

 

[Lonestar57]

Now I'm no expert on the Detonics CM's nor have I seen all models that were made but there is something on yours that caught my eye while reading this Thread. I only have one; a Combat Master MKVI with the CR prefix and Seattle made but it shoots and handles flawlessly.

It's my knowledge that older Detonics Combat Masters were basically all the same design and the model designations (MK Roman Numerals) were mostly for the different finishes offered over time.

Yours for whatever reason has a cutout on top of the slide above the extractor that I've never seen before. Your extractor base is open and exposed in the extractor channel. Makes me believe you're going to have excessive extractor and firing pin stop movement. Again no expert here but I wonder if it's been modified after factory for some reason. Anyway here's pics from mine (top) and the one you have (bottom). Good luck.

 

[OLDSTER]

Now I'm no expert on the Detonics CM's nor have I seen all models that were made but there is something on yours that caught my eye while reading this Thread. I only have one; a Combat Master MKVI with the CR prefix and Seattle made but it shoots and handles flawlessly.

It's my knowledge that older Detonics Combat Masters were basically all the same design and the model designations (MK Roman Numerals) were mostly for the different finishes offered over time.

Yours for whatever reason has a cutout on top of the slide above the extractor that I've never seen before. Your extractor base is open and exposed in the extractor channel. Makes be believe you're going to have excessive extractor and firing pin stop movement. Again no expert here but I wonder if it's been modified after factory for some reason. Anyway here's pics from mine (top) and the one you have (bottom). Good luck.

WOW! The bottom photo looks like Bubba tried to modify the gun for some reason. My CM is a late 1979 model and looks just like the top photo ( as it should). Good luck on your "project". Please post some photos when ya get her up and running.

 

[Mainsail]

Wow! I hadn't noticed that before.

Anyone know why this would be done?

 

[Mainsail]

I just scrolled through ALL the Combat Master pics on Bing and think the mystery may be solved. Very few pictures show this area.

Given this bit of metal is thinner due to the slide scallop, I'm thinking they were prone to failure in that spot.

I found a sale ad on Guns International and that gun had a piece broken out in that spot. No, they're not the same gun but the serial numbers are only about 2K units apart.

 

[Lonestar57]

Good find. Maybe the one you have broke in that area and someone cleaned it up to look better?

 

[kreuzlover]

Why aren't they still making this "combat wonder pistol?", anyone know? If they were all that good, seems to me they would still be in production. Just wondering...........

 

[Mainsail]

Why aren't they still making this "combat wonder pistol?", anyone know? If they were all that good, seems to me they would still be in production. Just wondering...........

Detonics had two or three iterations. Like AMT, Dornaus & Dixon, and a few others, the small production gun companies seem to have a hard time staying afloat.

I imagine someone still owns the patents to the Combat Master design, even though it isn't too terribly unique. This was the gun that got Colt to make an Officer's Model.

The gun is a piece of history, because small big-bore autos were not readily available in the 70s and 80s.

 

[stansdds]

Why aren't they still making this "combat wonder pistol?", anyone know? If they were all that good, seems to me they would still be in production. Just wondering...........

Probably because Colt introduced their Officer's ACP, then nearly every other 1911 clone maker started offering cut-down 1911's with much lower price tags.

Detonics had two or three iterations. Like AMT, Dornaus & Dixon, and a few others, the small production gun companies seem to have a hard time staying afloat.

I imagine someone still owns the patents to the Combat Master design, even though it isn't too terribly unique. This was the gun that got Colt to make an Officer's Model.

The gun is a piece of history, because small big-bore autos were not readily available in the 70s and 80s.

Seems to me Jerry Ahern bought the rights to the Detonics line and had them in production briefly somewhere in the late 1990's or early 2000's. I do not know who currently owns the rights, but there is a Detonics, but they do not make anything that looks like a 1911 clone.

 

[kreuzlover]

Because? The small versions of John Browning's crowning pistol achievement just DO NOT WORK WELL! I've owned some of the cut down 1911's, and they are just not up to snuff. Like I said earlier, I shot next to guy in CCL class, and he had a Detonics. It jammed, or otherwise malfuntioned at least once every magazine. The instructor finally made him use HIS 9mm Beretta to finish the course. This does't sound like a gun I would want to carry to protect my life, but some out there have drunk the kool-aid, so carry one if you must.

 

[OLDSTER]

Because? The small versions of John Browning's crowning pistol achievement just DO NOT WORK WELL! I've owned some of the cut down 1911's, and they are just not up to snuff. Like I said earlier, I shot next to guy in CCL class, and he had a Detonics. It jammed, or otherwise malfuntioned at least once every magazine. The instructor finally made him use HIS 9mm Beretta to finish the course. This does't sound like a gun I would want to carry to protect my life, but some out there have drunk the kool-aid, so carry one if you must.

Really ?? LOL. You need to do some more research.

 

[kreuzlover]

Ok, what wonder cut-down 1911 do YOU carry or prefer, OLDSTER? And I am on oldster, too! LOL

 

[Borderboss]

I just scrolled through ALL the Combat Master pics on Bing and think the mystery may be solved. Very few pictures show this area.

Given this bit of metal is thinner due to the slide scallop, I'm thinking they were prone to failure in that spot.

I found a sale ad on Guns International and that gun had a piece broken out in that spot. No, they're not the same gun but the serial numbers are only about 2K units apart.

I think I would find an expert gunsmith to weld some metal back into that area, just to be safe. I can't understand why that area would be prone to breakage. For me, I would want the extra metal to make sure the extractor is held as properly as possible.

I have always liked these guns, but never bought one when they were new. I ended up going with a Colt Officer's Model instead back then.

 

[Mainsail]

Because? The small versions of John Browning's crowning pistol achievement just DO NOT WORK WELL! I've owned some of the cut down 1911's, and they are just not up to snuff. Like I said earlier, I shot next to guy in CCL class, and he had a Detonics. It jammed, or otherwise malfuntioned at least once every magazine. The instructor finally made him use HIS 9mm Beretta to finish the course. This does't sound like a gun I would want to carry to protect my life, but some out there have drunk the kool-aid, so carry one if you must.

I'll ask again since you ignored the question the last time I asked:
And to be honest, wouldn't you be able to say that about any 1911?

Or, wouldn't you be able to say that about any Ford motor vehicle?

Or, wouldn't you be able to say that about any Chevrolet motor vehicle?

To what firearm do you trust your life? If I find a single empirical example of that gun failing, will you abandon it as quickly?

 

[stansdds]

Because? The small versions of John Browning's crowning pistol achievement just DO NOT WORK WELL! I've owned some of the cut down 1911's, and they are just not up to snuff. Like I said earlier, I shot next to guy in CCL class, and he had a Detonics. It jammed, or otherwise malfuntioned at least once every magazine. The instructor finally made him use HIS 9mm Beretta to finish the course. This does't sound like a gun I would want to carry to protect my life, but some out there have drunk the kool-aid, so carry one if you must.

With barrel lengths less than 4 1/4 inches, they are more difficult to make reliable, but certainly not impossible. Cheap ones with out of spec receivers can be impossible to make reliable, but that also applies to Commander and Government Model size 1911's.

I think I would find an expert gunsmith to weld some metal back into that area, just to be safe. I can't understand why that area would be prone to breakage. For me, I would want the extra metal to make sure the extractor is held as properly as possible.

I have always liked these guns, but never bought one when they were new. I ended up going with a Colt Officer's Model instead back then.

I cannot be 100% certain, but I think that at least some of the Detonics slides are cast steel, which would explain fractures in thin areas.