Does anyone else here have a Scout Rifle?

[Beemerguy53]

...I always liked the concept. Perhaps that's why I'm so fond of the British SMLE Jungle Carbine?

One of my Enfields is a Jungle Carbine...I love the way it feels and handles, but oh-mi-gawd that recoil! It beats me to death!

I remember reading somewhere that it's because the cone-shaped flash suppressor directs energy backward, increasing recoil, and then the little hard rubber buttplate concentrates it over a small area of the shoulder. Whatever the reason, it's a bear to shoot!

But I'll never part with it, though...

 

[Beemerguy53]

not yet- but i'd sure like to pick one up...

The first time you get the chance to shoot a Steyr Scout, you'll be hooked!

 

[mm6mm6]

My version of Cooper's Scout is my 1971 Marlin 336 in .35 Remington caliber. I lightened and smoothed the action. My dad cut the barrel down to 16" and re-crowned the muzzle. I refinished the wood with a satin oil finish. It sports a Leupold Scout Scope on an A/O Scout mount. The leather butt pad is by Custom Leather Work Hand crafted by Lever; and the combination shoots great.

I really like the Scout concept for keeping both eyes open (and maintaining your peripheral vision) when hunting. Specially for wild boar.

 

[GatorFarmer]

I've never had one of the Steyr versions.

I like the Remington Model Seven that I had, but kept it with iron sights. These are the light and handy end of the Remington bolt gun spectrum. Experiments with a Mini 14 and a level action Marlin, as well as trying optics far forward on M4 clones, left me not liking the low magnification pistol scopes forward mounted.

A 4X ACOG with the Docter red dot on top more conventionally mounted would seem to be a better option but didn't exist when Col. Cooper was developing the concept, electro optical sighting systems were also in their infancy at the time. Aimpoints with optional 4x magnifiers are another option that might surpass the original idea of a low magnification LER optic.

 

[Beemerguy53]

I bought me a Savage Scout and its been riding NIB for almost 2 years.

it has ghost rings sights, but want to get a scope, just don't know enough about it as I am a pistolero.

if there is any $$$$ in my hands, it something to do with a handgun.

Not sure if I am going to keep if its just going to sit. I have about 500+ rounds of 308 ball just sitting in a can too.

anyone with scope info that will not break the bank but decent optics, let me know. I may ask the wife for a christmas present.

sorry not to jack the thread, but along the same lines.

No need to apologize...your post is surely on topic.

I don't know how much you'd like to spend, but I did a little Googling (look for "long eye relief rifle scopes" or "scout rifle scopes") and checking on eBay, and found a lot of applicable scopes at all price ranges. Some of them are no-name brands that are ridiculously cheap, that I don't think I would trust, but I also found a new Leupold FX-II Scout Rifle scope for $280, actually cheaper than another site was selling a Bushnell.

Shop around, there's something out there for you. But by all means, get some glass on that rifle and go see what all the fuss is about...you won't be sorry!

 

[Beemerguy53]

I'd followed Cooper's writings about the Scout concept, seen the early attempts at them, and was always interested in the rifles.

I walked into the local gun dealer and they had a new Steyr sitting on the counter along with a sign that read " the only rifle you'll ever need." I remember looking at the rifle and thinking to myself that it had to be the ugliest rifle I'd ever seen, didn't ask to handle it.

Fast forward almost a year later and one of my partners and I are taking one of our annual classes at Gunsite. Late one afternoon we walk over to the Sconce to say hello to Jeff and Janelle and end up down in the armory eating Janelle's brownies while Jeff held court. He hands us his Steyr Scout and proceeds to explain in intimate detail why this rifle is the greatest thing since sliced bread. Jeff would have made a great salesman as within a month, my buddy and I each had Steyr Scouts in .308 and .376.

Jeff said the Scout was "all you needed for anything from mice to moose" and I believe he was pretty close to right. My Scout in .308 is not the only rifle I use but is the one I use the most. It's light, handy, and fast. I've never experienced any of the problems I've read about the Steyr in magazines. The trigger on mine is superb and the rifle fires any ammo I've put in it including milsurp.

Here is a photo taken about a year later at Gunsite. Jeff is holding my rifle for a photo op during a class break (he had just autographed it under one of the bipod wings). Paul Kirschener later used this photo to illustrate the cover of "Shotluck".

Bob, thanks so much for this terrific post! Wow...you have a real piece of history there, a Scout personally autographed by Col. Cooper himself!

When Gun Tests shot the Scout, they sarcastically referenced Col. Cooper's claim that it was the only rifle you'll ever need by saying they didn't expect to go to his house and find his other rifles in the trash. And like you, I have other rifles...but other than my .22 target rifles, I shoot my Scout the most.

It's really funny you mention the Scout's looks. I too had the same initial reaction to it. I'm a traditionalist, blued-steel-and-real-wood kind of guy, and I generally don't like plastic stocks or polymer-framed pistols. Yet the first time I handled the Scout at that gun show it just felt so right, so perfect ergonomically. And then I felt that trigger pull, and was hooked.

Beauty is as beauty does, I guess. And the Scout is one beautiful rifle!

 

[Beemerguy53]

My version of Cooper's Scout is my 1971 Marlin 336 in .35 Remington caliber. I lightened and smoothed the action. My dad cut the barrel down to 16" and re-crowned the muzzle. I refinished the wood with a satin oil finish. It sports a Leupold Scout Scope on an A/O Scout mount. The leather butt pad is by Custom Leather Work Hand crafted by Lever; and the combination shoots great.

I really like the Scout concept for keeping both eyes open (and maintaining your peripheral vision) when hunting. Specially for wild boar.

You've got a great little popper there, nicely executed and beautifully finished! Thanks for sharing.

 

[Snapping Twig]

Here's mine, it's an early model Mini 30 with a .308 bore. 2 x 7 Leupold and I handload for it. 150g NBT @ 2100fps.

One day soon I hope to get a true scout and a really nice lever gun, but I'm still debating caliber. 45-70, 44 mag, 35 Rem...

 

[Muley Gil]

"One of my Enfields is a Jungle Carbine...I love the way it feels and handles, but oh-mi-gawd that recoil! It beats me to death!

I remember reading somewhere that it's because the cone-shaped flash suppressor directs energy backward, increasing recoil, and then the little hard rubber buttplate concentrates it over a small area of the shoulder. Whatever the reason, it's a bear to shoot!"

I bought one of the .308 versions that Navy Arms imported a few years back. Satin nickel and has the regular brass buttplate. Recoil is not bad at all.

Back in my college days, a friend had a .303 Jungle Carbine and yes, that little bugger kicked!!!!! Someone made replacement buttplate rubber inserts that were vented inside, so that they gave a mite under recoil, but still looked like the WW II issue. Don't know if they are still available or not.

 

[Farmer17]

I was a big Cooper fan and followed the development of the Scout rifle from the early days. I like most everything about the concept, except the forward mounted scope, and I seem to do better with a traditional low power scope in the customary rear position. I'm also not that crazy about the integral bipod and would prefer a small bracket(bayonet lug?) on the forearm so a small bipod could be quickly and easily attached.

 

[Spotteddog]

I haven't looked into it in years, but I always thought a post/cross hair (these days it could even be illuminated!) an ACOG or the like would be spectacular in this application. Being able to swing with both eyes open, with a bold POI visible the whole time is a wonderful thing!

 

[GLV]

Get a L/H Savage and have the barrel mowed and scout mount done up front. If your eyes get really troublesome run a Red Dot up front?
Of course you notice how willingly I'm spending your money!

I am right handed, but started shooting long guns from the left side about 20 years ago. Still am slow running a bolt from the left, but levers seem to run better for me. Have an old Marlin 336 torn down, ready for the gunsmith to cut barrel to end of mag tube, and set up for a scout rifle. I have had a couple of Savage left hand bolts, and they are great rifles.

 

[jkc]

"Aimpoints with optional 4x magnifiers are another option that might surpass the original idea of a low magnification LER optic."

I think Gatorfarmer is onto something, i.e., that if Aimpoints had been refined, as they now are, during the Scout Rifle concept development, they may have been favored over conventional LER scopes. Setting aside the alleged benefit of ease of recharging a magazine with the scope/base mounted forward of the receiver (a non-issue with any of my bolt guns) the LER/forward-mounted optic was touted to be the fast-acquisition, both-eyes-open advantage, then a real consideration, now, not much of an issue. I've got Aimpoints on Contender Super 14 pistol barrels, and eye-relief is just not an issue --- angle, alignment, distance, all unimportant --- dot on target = "dead" target. I'd guess that Col. Cooper might have looked favorably on a simple Remington Model Seven stainless/synthetic with an Aimpoint 9000 2x as an acceptable "Scout" rig...

 

[Beemerguy53]

...Back in my college days, a friend had a .303 Jungle Carbine and yes, that little bugger kicked!!!!! Someone made replacement buttplate rubber inserts that were vented inside, so that they gave a mite under recoil, but still looked like the WW II issue. Don't know if they are still available or not.

Thanks for the heads-up...might have to start looking for one of those.

 

[Beemerguy53]

...I'd guess that Col. Cooper might have looked favorably on a simple Remington Model Seven stainless/synthetic with an Aimpoint 9000 2x as an acceptable "Scout" rig...

You know, one of the things I really admired about Jeff Cooper is that he didn't try to patent or trademark the Scout Rifle concept and then profit from it; he didn't care who built a "Scout Rifle" and called it that, and he didn't seem to care if he got the credit for creating the concept, so long as what was built was basically true to his original design.

I can't see too many people, upon coming up with an innovative and marketable firearm design, not running off to a lawyer to make sure nobody else "steals" their design!

 

[AKAOV1MAN]

I think I own the oldest scout rifle around. It is my maternal grandfathers 1896 Krag 30-40, otherwise known as the US 30 cartridge. It has its original carbine stock without the handguard and a 30mm scope mount that mounts into the original leaf sight screw holes. I has a Williams Foolproof rear sight and the original military front sight. The 30mm mount holds a Kahles 3X LER scope. The stock is not so recoil friendly, but with the 170 gr SP slugs cruising along at 2200 FPS there is not that much recoil to deal with.
It puts down deer, elk, and other game with no problem at all. I do not feel under gunned with anything short of a Grizzly. And even then, many big bear have been taken with the 30-40. It reloads fast with 1-5 rounds, just drop them into the box after you open it. I could make it more well rounded if I hand loaded for it, but I have just about a lifetime supply of good 30-40 ammo-no one else seemed to want any 30-40 8 years ago so I bought a lot of it quite cheaply.
If there is one thing that the Krag is noted for is its slick fast action. I have other rifles, but I just like this one. I may even get it refinished someday...........

 

[BUFF]

Col. Cooper had quite an impact on my thoughts about a lot of things besides firearms, but firearms were a major influence.

I began reading Cooper's writings about 1974. He made immense sense. He had such experience and a keen analytical mind. Going to Paulden, Arizona in early 1987 to attend API-250 was a lot like going to the Vatican to study under the Pope.

As the Scout Rifle became a production affair, I wondered if I dare spend that much money on a plainly unusual concept rifle that might not be too suitable to my needs.

I decided that I could build my own from a rifle i had and see how THAt went first. I had already bought a new Remington Model 7 carbine, 20 inch barrel, stainless steel with synthetic stock, in .308 Winchester. An excellent local gunsmith, Guy Malmborg, did the work.

First, he opened up the front, top of the action and squared it at the rear to allow the use of 5 round stripper clips to recharge it. He modified a Redfield Scout Scope base to sit in two dovetails or square-sided cuts or steps he cut on the top of the barrel where the rear sight assembly was removed, and attached a silver Leupold LER Scout Scope, with the rear of the scope just a fraction of an inch ahead of the forward bridge of the action. Guy devised a clever click-up or click-down auxillary front sight blade down in the middle of the scope base. A coin would suffice to remove the scope and rings,if needed, and he added an Ashley Express ghost ring rear sight on the rear receiver ring to match up with the auxillary front sight blade in the scope mount. I picked a good load and sighted the rifle in with the auxillary, back-up iron sights before attaching the Scout Scope and zeroing it.

I had Guy shorten the buttstock about an inch overall by cutting the stock and adding a different recoil pad, making the rifle a bit handier.

One of the developed features of a Scout Rifle is a unique, 3 point "Ching Sling." Guy removed the 2 exisiting sling swivels and replaced them with Pachmayr's flush-mounted swivels, adding a third swivel on the bottom of the stock just ahead of the magazine floor plate. The Ching Sling has both a normal, full length sling strap but also has a shorter, second strap that forms a very useful, quickly-assumed hasty loop for quick shooting.

With the addition of tuning the Remington's already crisp trigger, the little rifle came alive. The definition of a Scout Rifle as layed down by Cooper includes a repeating rifle capable of shooting a commonly-available cartridge able to take animals up to 1,000 pounds. The rifle should be handy and friendly to use, with a weight not to exceed 6 or 7 pounds and a length not to exceed a meter (39").

My rifle came together in a quick,solid, handy package, a fast-shouldering carbine that put the intermediary power scope right were it needed to be when the shooter uses both eyes, allowing the wide field-of-view to quickly find the target and get the recticle on it.

Mine shoots ball ammo far better than I can hold it. I have fed it British Radway Green 7.62 X 51 mostly, but also Federal Red Eagle and Winchester white box bal equivalent as well, all using FMJ bullets of 147-150 grains, although I will doubtless use a sporting, expanding bullet should the BUFF Scout go deer hunting.

I need to learn my digital camera. If you are aboard any of the Yahoo chat groups, you may be able to see mine here :

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SaltLakeFALers/photos/album/1635137100/pic/656130647/view?picmode=

 

[reddogge]

Here's my version, a Swiss K31 with Leupold IER scout scope. It's not very light or handy though but VERY accurate.

 

[The Highlander]

Col. Cooper is one of the most articulate, thoughtful writers I've ever had the pleasure of reading. Alas, like Finn Aagard and Peter Capstick, I'll never have the chance to meet him.

Someone mentioned he never wanted the notoriety of creating the Scout concept. Frankly, he did the same thing with the Weaver Stance. Jack Weaver invented it, but Cooper popularized it, and ALWAYS made sure Jack got the credit.

Men of honor and morals. Not many of them like that left.

The Highlander

 

[Racegunner]

I always wanted a pre-64 Winchester Mod. 70 Featherweight in 308. They (FN really) are making them again and they are supposed to be really good. As a "traditionalist" I prefer the 70 over the Steyr. I don't need a forward mounted scope, but I do prefer the option to use iron sights without having to remove the scope. Not sure the new 70s can be bought with iron sights. Maybe I don't fully understand the concept of the scout rifle, particularly why is has to be a bolt gun. Light weight is the main benefit that appeals to me. I also like the Hk SL7 and wish they still made it (or wish I still had mine)...even though it was on the heavy side.