FINALLY, I found a Heavy Duty!!! (picture heavy duty)

[calmex]

Skeeter Skelton wrote about encountering a Mexican police officer who had a Colt Single Action Army on his hip, .45 Colt and wearing factory Colt grips. Skeeter asked about buying said SAA and the officer stated that he would only trade for a S&W .38 special. Old Skeet traded a .38/44 HD for the Colt.

Maybe you got Skeeter's HD!!

Well, I suppose the possibility exists. However, chances would be against it. We are developing a rather large following for our NRA Action Pistol/IPSC revolver shooting at the range here. There are four Heavy Duty owners in our little group, three of them being the four inch version and one with a five incher. We also now have three Outdoorsman owners (one of whom owns one of the Heavy Duty revolvers as well), and one of the Outdoorsman guns is a worn but mechanically sound Pre-War.

These revolvers, down here, are not so much collectible as they are first rate defensive side-arms. The bad guys use a lot of 9 m.m. hi-caps, which lack the power of a good Keith loading. Sure, they have more shots, but a good 170 grain Lead SWC passing into the engine room at 1,250 fps is probably pretty decisive. And our guys practice, so they can shoot.

I got an email this morning from one of the Moderators on the one of the Mexican gun forums saying that amongst their "in group" nobody is looking for anything other than the Heavy Duty or Outdoorman guns. A lot (and I mean a LOT) of Mexicans simply do not know what they are. I am sure the person who sold me mine thought it was just a big Model 10.

And now, a feeding frenzy has started. I looked quite a while for mine -- and the two Outdoorsman revolvers I found I felt should go to my friends as I already do have Phil Roettinger's revolver here, so it's not like I wasn't totally unprepared compared to my friends who really had nothing of appreciable power at their disposal. Since I always rather shamelessly plug the thread about Phil's revolver in case someone has as yet missed out, here it is; http://smith-wessonforum.com/s-w-ha...47-penultimate-pre-postwar-magnum-mexico.html

Now, however, Phil's gun can stand down and just be a safe queen. I have the Heavy Duty to do any heavy duty that needs to be done and will pursue an Outdoorsman (or another Mexican Heavy Duty) with a calmer disposition.

 

[1Aspenhill]

Congrats! Great looking gun! I bet most of the owners like the 4" better than the other barrel lengths. You are correct on the hi cap vs a trained marksman, one shot is all it takes!
Bill

 

[semperfi71]

calmex,

The "diamond" N-Frame magnas feel better in my hand then do the later "non-diamonds". I think its because the older magnas have a more rounded curve coming off the frame towards the checkering. The later versions are more blocky and square, like the later N-Frame target stocks.

However I do have some N-Frame magnas that I think were made right after the loss of the "diamond" and they seem to follow the lines of the "diamond" magnas in fit.

On the American auction sites the "diamond" N-Frames are starting to command higher prices but they can still be found somewhat reasonable if you have the time. In lieu of you might look for the "non-diamonds" of older manufacture I speak of.

I have enjoyed your previous thread on the Registered Magnum by the way. Tremendous history there.

 

[Duke426]

Cool gun and thanks for sharing the pics with us.

 

[P&R Fan]

That's a great HD. I have a 5" from the early '50s, and carry it every once in a while. I even used it last year to re-qualify for my carry permit. I do stuff like that because I'm a proud dinosaur.
I am interested in the laws in Mexico. Are you limited in the calibers you can own? I know at one point no Military calibers could be owned by citizens. Is that still true? Can you not own a .357 Magnum or larger?
Thanks for the info, and happy shooting!
Jim

 

[calmex]

That's a great HD. I have a 5" from the early '50s, and carry it every once in a while. I even used it last year to re-qualify for my carry permit. I do stuff like that because I'm a proud dinosaur.
I am interested in the laws in Mexico. Are you limited in the calibers you can own? I know at one point no Military calibers could be owned by citizens. Is that still true? Can you not own a .357 Magnum or larger?
Thanks for the info, and happy shooting!
Jim

Jim, I'll get back to you tomorrow or the next day with a good answer. The gun laws here are draconian, and .38 Special is the largest caliber one is allowed in revolvers while .380 is tops for autos. Now -- if you reload -- a lot can happen within those parameters.

It's a holiday weekend here, and my Ice Cream Store is very busy, so a complete answer will have to wait a couple of days. But I did not want you to think I was ignoring you.

 

[calmex]

calmex,

The "diamond" N-Frame magnas feel better in my hand then do the later "non-diamonds". I think its because the older magnas have a more rounded curve coming off the frame towards the checkering. The later versions are more blocky and square, like the later N-Frame target stocks.

However I do have some N-Frame magnas that I think were made right after the loss of the "diamond" and they seem to follow the lines of the "diamond" magnas in fit.

On the American auction sites the "diamond" N-Frames are starting to command higher prices but they can still be found somewhat reasonable if you have the time. In lieu of you might look for the "non-diamonds" of older manufacture I speak of.

I have enjoyed your previous thread on the Registered Magnum by the way. Tremendous history there.

Thank you for the info there, SemperFi. I got up to the Tulsa Gun Show last November and got to meet quite a few of the Forum Members who posted throughout that long thread on Phil's gun. It was really great to put faces to the names.

My partner in crime and I ended up at the S&W Collector's meeting at the end of the night, just before it ended. Lee was giving me the "get up and tell 'em who you are" look but I was suddenly taken with stage fright and did not. Other than stopping to introduce myself quickly to 29Aholic, I simply left early as we had pressing things to do and little time to do them. Most of the members I met were at Lee's table as I kept stopping by to chat with him and anyone who was there.

Next time, I will prepare myself better and be more out-going.

 

[STCM(SW)]

Skeeter Skelton wrote about encountering a Mexican police officer who had a Colt Single Action Army on his hip, .45 Colt and wearing factory Colt grips. Skeeter asked about buying said SAA and the officer stated that he would only trade for a S&W .38 special. Old Skeet traded a .38/44 HD for the Colt.

Maybe you got Skeeter's HD!!

I remember that story, nice old revolver!
Congrats!!!

 

[lazcool]

Well, I suppose the possibility exists. However, chances would be against it. We are developing a rather large following for our NRA Action Pistol/IPSC revolver shooting at the range here. There are four Heavy Duty owners in our little group, three of them being the four inch version and one with a five incher. We also now have three Outdoorsman owners (one of whom owns one of the Heavy Duty revolvers as well), and one of the Outdoorsman guns is a worn but mechanically sound Pre-War.

These revolvers, down here, are not so much collectible as they are first rate defensive side-arms. The bad guys use a lot of 9 m.m. hi-caps, which lack the power of a good Keith loading. Sure, they have more shots, but a good 170 grain Lead SWC passing into the engine room at 1,250 fps is probably pretty decisive. And our guys practice, so they can shoot.

I got an email this morning from one of the Moderators on the one of the Mexican gun forums saying that amongst their "in group" nobody is looking for anything other than the Heavy Duty or Outdoorman guns. A lot (and I mean a LOT) of Mexicans simply do not know what they are. I am sure the person who sold me mine thought it was just a big Model 10.

And now, a feeding frenzy has started. I looked quite a while for mine -- and the two Outdoorsman revolvers I found I felt should go to my friends as I already do have Phil Roettinger's revolver here, so it's not like I wasn't totally unprepared compared to my friends who really had nothing of appreciable power at their disposal. Since I always rather shamelessly plug the thread about Phil's revolver in case someone has as yet missed out, here it is; http://smith-wessonforum.com/s-w-ha...47-penultimate-pre-postwar-magnum-mexico.html

Now, however, Phil's gun can stand down and just be a safe queen. I have the Heavy Duty to do any heavy duty that needs to be done and will pursue an Outdoorsman (or another Mexican Heavy Duty) with a calmer disposition.

Hello everyone!!! Iam new here , and one of the lucky fellows here in Mexico to have CALMEX as a friend and as a shooting Instructor!!! I have been shooting with him for a few years now, and yes !!! he got me into the HD's, I have 3 N frames and here are some pictures, 38/44 HD, Prewar 357mag, and Outdoorsman 38/44HD cheers everyone!!!!!

 

[1Aspenhill]

Calmex,
Are you coming to Tulsa at the end of the month? If so, I'll bring some diamond magnas for you to choose from. They aren't perfect, but maybe you could find a pair that would make you and your HD happy!
Bill

 

[bettis1]

lazcool,

Welcome to the Forum! Glad to know that Calmex has a shooting friend there that can share the enjoyment with him. Looks like you have a very nice assortment of Smiths to play with.

Please feel free to come by the Forum anytime you please. We always enjoy hearing from our members outside our borders about how you enjoy our sport of collecting and shooting these old timers.

Bob

 

[GLL]

lazcool:

Welcome ! Nice assortment of N-frames !
I would love to see a couple more photos of your Outdoorsman. If you are willing I would appreciate the serial number of the Outdoorsman for my files (offline)

Jerry

[email protected]

 

[lazcool]

lazcool,

Welcome to the Forum! Glad to know that Calmex has a shooting friend there that can share the enjoyment with him. Looks like you have a very nice assortment of Smiths to play with.

Please feel free to come by the Forum anytime you please. We always enjoy hearing from our members outside our borders about how you enjoy our sport of collecting and shooting these old timers.
Bob

Bettis1,
thank you! for sure I will be visiting the Forum, its nice to be able to share all about this Guns, I am in the learning process and CALMEX is a very good instructor and knows his stuff...... The hard part here in Mexico is finding the HD's, then for some reason most of them the previous owners have change the original grips, and finding the right grips down here is almost impossible, I will bring some better pics and serial numbers to get as much possible information on them, Cheers!!

 

[lazcool]

lazcool:

Welcome ! Nice assortment of N-frames !
I would love to see a couple more photos of your Outdoorsman. If you are willing I would appreciate the serial number of the Outdoorsman for my files (offline)

Jerry

[email protected]

GLL, good day, yes for sure I will get better pictures, and will appreciate info about the Outdoorsaman, I will get the serial number,
cheers!!
Lazcool

 

[calmex]

Congrats my world traveling buddy.

It's always good to hear you're doing well as an ex-pat in the land of mañana.

Awesome classic you have there, the HD is still and unfilled tag on my short grail list...I'm jealous.

I was quietly looking for quite a while. Unfortunately, if the owner of one down here knows what he has, it won't be parted with at any price. You need to find one of those people who thinks it's just a big, over-weight Model 10 who wants to trade-up to a new, lighter Model 10. It took me a while, and it was actually Lazcool who found it for me. He sent me photos, and I posted it around our group with the old "Look what Lazcool has found, let me know if you are interested." Nobody, and I mean nobody, got back to me on it. I was not even going to bid because I was sure they'd want a King's Ransom and Lazcool had not mentioned price so I was sure it was out of my reach.

Then, like almost a day later, Lazcool called me in the store and said "Hey, man, you know how much he wants for that Heavy Duty? Like 500.00, man! I don't think he knows what he has."

I had initially been irritated to receive a phone call just at closing time, but my irritation turned to astonishment. "Well, demonios," I said, "for that price I'll take it for myself!"

So, they're out there. And sometimes the one you find hits you on the nose. It all happened so fast, you know?

 

[calmex]

Calmex,
Are you coming to Tulsa at the end of the month? If so, I'll bring some diamond magnas for you to choose from. They aren't perfect, but maybe you could find a pair that would make you and your HD happy!
Bill

Bill:
I'd love to be able to. Unfortunately, Tulsa in the Spring is a week before "Semana Santa", the Easter break. In Canada or the U.S., the Christmas Season is the make-it-or-break-it season. Here, it's Easter. Christmas is becoming somewhat commercialized here -- 22 years ago when I came it was just a quiet time to spend with your family but that is changing. Still, Easter is when everything just goes bonkers.

Also, it's getting hot out there. I have an Ice Cream Store. It would be almost impossible for me to get away. However, my friend Lazcool (who is posting here in this thread for his first time I think) needs a couple sets of grips and I certainly need one set. If you can send me photos of what you have and prices, I'll share them with Lazcool and we'll send you a cheque. I have a U.S. address that things like this can be shipped to and they come down safely (if slowly).

If the economy just continues to slowly improve, maybe I'll get back up to Tulsa again sometime because I had a lot of fun.

 

[calmex]

I should mention here, quietly, that one of the guns in the photos Lazcool posted is an R.M. . Please treat that delicately, as I hope you all know that Mexico has caliber restrictions and .38 Special is the top-end for civilians. Refer to it as an R.M. and we all know what we're talking about but we're not giving up anything to Gran Hermano (the Mexican Big Brother) should they be reading. Mexican Gun Forums are monitored FULL TIME by the Army, trying to learn what they can learn. I doubt they'd monitor here, because it's in English...but better safe than sorry when you're not totally free.

Obviously, he has never fired it, only fondled it. I have never even seen it myself, but I'm going to take a trip to see it after Easter and eat with Lazcool in the "Sirloin Stockade", a sort of Bonanza or Ponderosa restuarant in his city that is just all the rage down here although such chains were starting to fall out of favor up North 20 years ago.

Probably, Lazcool, you should be cautious about posting photos of that one. You know about mine, and I don't post many photos of it either. You know, buddy, just how quick the Gestapo would react if they knew what it was and who you were. I'm just sayin', okay?

 

[calmex]

That's a great HD. I have a 5" from the early '50s, and carry it every once in a while. I even used it last year to re-qualify for my carry permit. I do stuff like that because I'm a proud dinosaur.
I am interested in the laws in Mexico. Are you limited in the calibers you can own? I know at one point no Military calibers could be owned by citizens. Is that still true? Can you not own a .357 Magnum or larger?
Thanks for the info, and happy shooting!
Jim

Jim:
Well, it's a slow morning. This is a long weekend here in Mexico, but I think everyone partied themselves out last night. So far, it's a quiet morning. This gave me time to look up this old thread:
http://smith-wessonforum.com/lounge...-law-protocol.html?highlight=Mexican+Gun+Laws

In a discussion between Pasifikawv and myself we manage to touch on much of the actual LAW and the way it is interpreted here in Mexico.

Basically, you can have a .380 or .38 Special. However, although reloading is Prohibited by the Army, it is legal under the actual law. Any .38/44 loading therefore can be loaded if you take the time and risk to "import" your components. Obviously, this is an under-the-table type importation.

Interestingly enough, if you take a 9 m.m. handgun, obtain a barrel for same-same with a .380 chamber, you can load any 9 load using a .380 case with no problems. It's an amazingly strong little case. I have shot over 50,000 of the .380 "Cal" round since I came up with it in 2004 through a variety of firearms and it gets one up to at least 9 performance if you just gotta have that auto.

There is much you cannot do, other things you're not supposed to do but can get away with -- and obviously other things you can just fly off the runway with and soar. It's knowing WHICH is WHICH that makes all the difference. But yes, we can have fun here. And we do. Right, Lazcool?

 

[lazcool]

Jim:
Well, it's a slow morning. This is a long weekend here in Mexico, but I think everyone partied themselves out last night. So far, it's a quiet morning. This gave me time to look up this old thread:
http://smith-wessonforum.com/lounge...-law-protocol.html?highlight=Mexican+Gun+Laws

In a discussion between Pasifikawv and myself we manage to touch on much of the actual LAW and the way it is interpreted here in Mexico.

Basically, you can have a .380 or .38 Special. However, although reloading is Prohibited by the Army, it is legal under the actual law. Any .38/44 loading therefore can be loaded if you take the time and risk to "import" your components. Obviously, this is an under-the-table type importation.

Interestingly enough, if you take a 9 m.m. handgun, obtain a barrel for same-same with a .380 chamber, you can load any 9 load using a .380 case with no problems. It's an amazingly strong little case. I have shot over 50,000 of the .380 "Cal" round since I came up with it in 2004 through a variety of firearms and it gets one up to at least 9 performance if you just gotta have that auto.

There is much you cannot do, other things you're not supposed to do but can get away with -- and obviously other things you can just fly off the runway with and soar. It's knowing WHICH is WHICH that makes all the difference. But yes, we can have fun here. And we do. Right, Lazcool?

Calmex, has always worked hard to find to get as much fun as we can here in Mex, yes we get to have fun!!!
cheers.

 

[P&R Fan]

Jim:
Well, it's a slow morning. This is a long weekend here in Mexico, but I think everyone partied themselves out last night. So far, it's a quiet morning. This gave me time to look up this old thread:
http://smith-wessonforum.com/lounge...-law-protocol.html?highlight=Mexican+Gun+Laws

In a discussion between Pasifikawv and myself we manage to touch on much of the actual LAW and the way it is interpreted here in Mexico.

Basically, you can have a .380 or .38 Special. However, although reloading is Prohibited by the Army, it is legal under the actual law. Any .38/44 loading therefore can be loaded if you take the time and risk to "import" your components. Obviously, this is an under-the-table type importation.

Interestingly enough, if you take a 9 m.m. handgun, obtain a barrel for same-same with a .380 chamber, you can load any 9 load using a .380 case with no problems. It's an amazingly strong little case. I have shot over 50,000 of the .380 "Cal" round since I came up with it in 2004 through a variety of firearms and it gets one up to at least 9 performance if you just gotta have that auto.

There is much you cannot do, other things you're not supposed to do but can get away with -- and obviously other things you can just fly off the runway with and soar. It's knowing WHICH is WHICH that makes all the difference. But yes, we can have fun here. And we do. Right, Lazcool?

Thank you for the interesting bit of information. I am very well read, and I thought guns were almost impossible to own in Mexico. I'm glad, for your sake you can have at least those you mention. And let me state again, that's a FINE Heavy Duty you have there. You'll really enjoy shooting it, as will several generations after you. Those puppies are brute strong, and just plain COOL.
Now we want range reports.
Stay safe.
Jim