mjr
Member
Noticed that, too. That's what ruined Ride With the Devil for me--another brass-framed Remington.
Hatfields and McCoys History Channel. Monday
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amazingflapjack
US Veteran
I'm with FT and Cudzu-I won't be watching again. I am a big fan of Costner's, but this is a clinker. I also have roots in this parrt of the south. The accent is more of a Scotts-Irish burr in West Virginia, and would be very difficult to "imitate" in my opinion. As has been pointed out, the south is a land of many accents, with great diversity. I remember when they did that mini series a while back about Charleston S.C. in the civil war. The extras didn't have the "expected" sound to their voices because the local folks have what has been described as a Scotts-highland accent, which is very "light" so they went inland and got some "typical" South Carolinian's to fill those roles. From there, all the way to New Orleans, where folks from one section can be mistaken for someone from Brooklyn by an untrained ear. But the movie folks have to play to what an average audience expects, so... My thought was that they could have gotten better action scenes by hiding a camera outside of a West Virginia beer joint just about anywhere-real accents too!
ColbyBruce
Member
What is all this talk about a Southern accent?
PA Reb
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Actually, I believe if you do some good research you will find that the story so far is pretty close to historical truth. Kevin Costner would also not take part in a project like this if it wasn't at least as close to the truth as possible in a six hour movie.
OP
You would probably prefer the movie "Wrong Turn"
Hey it's worth it just for Eliza Dushku
The Movie "Matewan" was filmed in WV, Thurmond, WV. So some of them get it right.
mpi
Member
Being from WV i wasn't particular impressed by the accents either. i noticed the brass frame too, as i did when i went to see Gettysburg too, to the the startlement of my friends who went along.
the story doesn't seem too far off according to all the things I've read on the subject. Including the fact that cline stirred up and kept instigating much of the friction between the groups. as to court time, both families were well acquainted with the court system, Anse Hatfield in particular was familiar with court system as he had both sued and been sued quite a few times.
in many parts of the state you can tell the different accents by whether you are from town or from a farm outside of town.
as to lawlessness, you really need to look to Fayette county. Thurmond and the New River gorge area, the murder rates were higher there in the coal boom years than anywhere else in the country. Dodge city or Tombstone never even came near. the Dun Glenn hotel had the worlds longest continual poker game, which lasted nearly fourteen years IIRC.
the story doesn't seem too far off according to all the things I've read on the subject. Including the fact that cline stirred up and kept instigating much of the friction between the groups. as to court time, both families were well acquainted with the court system, Anse Hatfield in particular was familiar with court system as he had both sued and been sued quite a few times.
in many parts of the state you can tell the different accents by whether you are from town or from a farm outside of town.
as to lawlessness, you really need to look to Fayette county. Thurmond and the New River gorge area, the murder rates were higher there in the coal boom years than anywhere else in the country. Dodge city or Tombstone never even came near. the Dun Glenn hotel had the worlds longest continual poker game, which lasted nearly fourteen years IIRC.
NFrameFred
Member
We don't have 'accents' . . . God talks like we do . . .
(with apologies to Lewis Grizzard)
(with apologies to Lewis Grizzard)
Firearms Observed:
1. Muzzle Loading Rifles (Confederates and Union Soldiers)
2. Remington Revolvers
3. Sharps carbines
4. Colt SAA
5. Winchester M1866
6. Remington Rolling Block
7. Colt Thunderer (Justice of the Peace)
8. DBL Shotguns
9. Telescopic Sight (Brass)
10. Henry .44 RF
Did anyone notice the Remington Rolling Block Carbine in one scene?
1. Muzzle Loading Rifles (Confederates and Union Soldiers)
2. Remington Revolvers
3. Sharps carbines
4. Colt SAA
5. Winchester M1866
6. Remington Rolling Block
7. Colt Thunderer (Justice of the Peace)
8. DBL Shotguns
9. Telescopic Sight (Brass)
10. Henry .44 RF
Did anyone notice the Remington Rolling Block Carbine in one scene?
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Well, I watched part two last night. Much better. Thanks for all the "how to speak southern" information but can't nobody talk southern better'n we'uns here in north GA. You'ns just don't talk no good english like we do.
Arik
Member
Accents sound ok to me. Dunno whats the big deal its not easy to pull off an accent. All you southern guys try to do an NYC Brooklyn accent 
and make it authentic!
I came to this country when I was 8. Im now 32 I speak English fluently and I still have a slight accent
and make it authentic! I came to this country when I was 8. Im now 32 I speak English fluently and I still have a slight accent
OP
We don't have 'accents' . . . God talks like we do . . .
(with apologies to Lewis Grizzard)
I really miss Lewis. One of the funniest guys ever.
LazyKB, No offense meant to you fine folk in WV and KY. I prefer to think being Southern is a state of mind rather than a rigid line drawn in the Kudzu. I've known some native Texans that are about as Yankee as it gets! It really kind of depends where you come from. Justin Wilson once told a story that started: "I got a friend from up north, way up north, around Shreveport."
Didn't some southern arms companies make Remington copies with a brass frame? I know they made Colt copies like that.
Didn't some southern arms companies make Remington copies with a brass frame? I know they made Colt copies like that.
hannstv
Member
The city marshal from "Matewan" was a Hatfield, he was later murdered on courthouse steps by mine owners agents.
Damn Yankee
Member
I've been told that anyone who lives North of I- 10 is a Yankee.
UncleEd
Member
With all the comments about the guns, I'm surprised no one has brought up the issue of the kind of saddles used in the film, even depicting the Civil War years.
bobcat
US Veteran
I'm enjoying it, with all the other crappy reality shows on it's a nice change. I can't get to hung up on the accents aren't exactly correct or they used the wrong gun in one scene, it's a movie, a little artistic license is allowed and at least they're not using marlin lever actions or such. It beat dancing with stars or any of the singing shows any day of the week!
Can't wait for Part 3 tonight!
Can't wait for Part 3 tonight!
feralmerril
Absent Comrade
I was able to find this picture of the local "Welcome Wagon".
Wbraswell, no offense taken. Being from a border area that became its own border state in the middle of the war (its a long story that began way before the war of northern aggression) most of us figure we can choose either side and be correct.
I picked up on the saddles early and was disappointed. I was looking for more of a Buena Vista type. Romania sure does have some pretty horses.
I picked up on the saddles early and was disappointed. I was looking for more of a Buena Vista type. Romania sure does have some pretty horses.
NFrameFred
Member
With all the comments about the guns, I'm surprised no one has brought up the issue of the kind of saddles used in the film, even depicting the Civil War years.
I generally like Costner's movies but as a producer/director he usually isn't big on technical details. He seems to gravitate more toward trying to get inside the character's heads (especially when he's portraying someone who was or could have been an actual historical figure) and dwells more on the motivations, reactions, and mindsets. He doesn't seem to realize that a good portion of his audience is educated and astute enough that sloppy detail work (like using guns that never existed or had not yet been invented) actually detracts from what could be a masterful work.
To me, that's one of the big reasons I prefer "Tombstone" and Kurt Russell's fanciful fictionalized Wyatt instead of Costner's "Wyatt Earp". "Tombstone" was very well done technically even if the 'legend' was more portrayed than the man. As much as most anyone could know, Costner probably did a better job of portraying a flawed, conflicted man of his times and circumstances with his Earp but the movie failed on many important aspects for me. To each his own . . .
As far as the horses/saddles and guns, to Costner that just seems to be a minor detail and "close" is good enough. To have the gunfight in "Open Range" maintain intensity and continuous action was more important to him than the fact that it was all physically impossible with his eighteen shot single action revolvers . . .
To him, it's apparently all about the character and the rest is insignificant window dressing.He'd probably remake 1971's "Dirty Harry" with a Desert Eagle . . .
Arik
Member
I think sometimes people put too much emphasis on every little detail. I wouldnt want to see the actors with Glocks and Nike sneakers in that time period but i wouldnt know when what Marlin came out. The only gun i recognized was the Colt SSA. To me all the others were just SA revolvers, single shot rifles, shotguns and lever actions. And i definitely have no idea about horse saddles. Infact the only place i saw horses live was at a track, once. To me, and im sure to many other viewers, it just has to fit the time period.
I was born in 79.
Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2
I was born in 79.
Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2
My wife and I are enjoying this mini-series. The horses, clothes, houses and weapons look to be a little bit too nice. I don't know what anyone who has an inkling of what the Hatfield/ McCoy feud was about would expect anything else but blood and guts. Although this is a time-compressed tale, that's what happened.
Fishslayer
US Veteran, Absent Comrade
This is pretty much where I'm at. I'm more interested in events and what was going on in the characters' heads.
And thanks to this forum I can find out. Some of the members here actually KNEW these people.
feralmerril
Absent Comrade
I know just a little bit about both sides of the issue. I have been a collector of old western era guns, a avid reader of the western era, civil war and once lived and worked in west virginnia and all over the west. I also for a short time was a studio guard at universal movie studios and knew some actors, and watched movies as they were filmed.
I can live with the brass framed remingtons and colts. I do think they should have laid out a few bucks more to get the blued steel replicas though.
What is more important to me though is historic accuracy. I belive truth is more interesting than fiction. There have been several movies made on historical events I had first hand or good knowledge of and was dissapointed to see fictonalised events that wasnt as good as what the truth was!
I dont like to see impossible fake action that in real life is impossible for someone to live through. The younger generation has come to expect the impossible and are bored with anything less.
Years ago my dad at the time was about 85 and came west to visit my sisters family and me. My sister had her kids and grandkids over, dad and me for a visit. She put on a arnold schwarzenegger action movie, the one where people get shot, leak out self healing chrome blood etc. Dad looked at me and said something like, this is horse ---- or similar. The others overheard them and sister put in the movie "Bambi" for the younger kids. My grand nephew, about 6 years old complained, "Aw, who can belive this stuff?" Yet I guess he belived the impossible action stuff.
My biggest fanticy if I was granted the impossable, would be to go back in time with modern recording equipment and film historic events and interview those people.
I can live with the brass framed remingtons and colts. I do think they should have laid out a few bucks more to get the blued steel replicas though.
What is more important to me though is historic accuracy. I belive truth is more interesting than fiction. There have been several movies made on historical events I had first hand or good knowledge of and was dissapointed to see fictonalised events that wasnt as good as what the truth was!
I dont like to see impossible fake action that in real life is impossible for someone to live through. The younger generation has come to expect the impossible and are bored with anything less.
Years ago my dad at the time was about 85 and came west to visit my sisters family and me. My sister had her kids and grandkids over, dad and me for a visit. She put on a arnold schwarzenegger action movie, the one where people get shot, leak out self healing chrome blood etc. Dad looked at me and said something like, this is horse ---- or similar. The others overheard them and sister put in the movie "Bambi" for the younger kids. My grand nephew, about 6 years old complained, "Aw, who can belive this stuff?" Yet I guess he belived the impossible action stuff.
My biggest fanticy if I was granted the impossable, would be to go back in time with modern recording equipment and film historic events and interview those people.
OP
Lots of armchair critics.
I am sure all the John Wayne and other Westerns movies were absolutely authentic down to every detail.
Horses of course can run for hours and hours through Death Valley and never stop. Everyone is a expert shot from a horse at full gallop.
He'd probably remake 1971's "Dirty Harry" with a Desert Eagle . . .
OMG, dont even kid with stuff like that
Or... "the wild bunch" with a UZI or MAC-10
We watched the first two episodes and will probably watch the final one tonight.
I found it interesting that Joe Absolom, a British actor who plays the son of a restaurant owner and former plumber in the "Doc Martin" series, was one of the characters. He made a good stab at the correct accent, but you could tell he was struggling with it. I wonder how he landed the part?
All in all, I've enjoyed it so far, although some of the technical details were a bit off. At least they weren't using trapdoor Springfields in the opening Civil War scenes!
John
I found it interesting that Joe Absolom, a British actor who plays the son of a restaurant owner and former plumber in the "Doc Martin" series, was one of the characters. He made a good stab at the correct accent, but you could tell he was struggling with it. I wonder how he landed the part?
All in all, I've enjoyed it so far, although some of the technical details were a bit off. At least they weren't using trapdoor Springfields in the opening Civil War scenes!
John
The series has become more interesting after going to:
Hatfield
especially the family trees.
Jhonse wound up having four wives, Randall McCoy had 16 kids, Devil Anse had 12, and there were several intermarriages between the two families. The current families have had reunions together and celebrated many years of peace. It's likely both Devil Anse and Randall suffered from post traumatic stress syndrome from the Civil War that no doubt affected their later lives and 'the feud'.
The fued was over a period spanning 30 years so the series is necessarily time compressed but historically fairly accurate within the time constraints.
RE: the aledged brass frame Remington, the South had several copies some with brass frames due to the lack of steel during the war such as Spillar and Burr, Rogers and Spencer, Dance and Brothers, Whitney, etc. All of these are reproduced today and available to movie prop suppliers.
Hatfield
especially the family trees.
Jhonse wound up having four wives, Randall McCoy had 16 kids, Devil Anse had 12, and there were several intermarriages between the two families. The current families have had reunions together and celebrated many years of peace. It's likely both Devil Anse and Randall suffered from post traumatic stress syndrome from the Civil War that no doubt affected their later lives and 'the feud'.
The fued was over a period spanning 30 years so the series is necessarily time compressed but historically fairly accurate within the time constraints.
RE: the aledged brass frame Remington, the South had several copies some with brass frames due to the lack of steel during the war such as Spillar and Burr, Rogers and Spencer, Dance and Brothers, Whitney, etc. All of these are reproduced today and available to movie prop suppliers.
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