Help with 2" nickel Victory Model

[Stumpman]

I inherited my Daddy's S&W 38 snub. I remember him telling me it belonged to a friend that had been a colonel during the war. This was his friend's pistol during WW2. The serial number is V763715.
Any info would be very much appreciated.

 

[Bell Charter Oak Holsters]

The Victory M&P model for wartime production was never produced in a nickel finish by the factory. It is plausible that your revolver was customized for it's former owner by a gunsmith.

After WWII there were many surplus Victory's that were converted from .38 S&W to .38 Special by firms such as Cogswell & Harrison, and others. They also offered 2 inch barrel models which simply were cut down 4 or 5 inch barrels. Some early Victory models were blued or black painted but the lionshare, if I'm not mistaken, were parkerized.

I'm sure several of the fellows here who are students of the Victory in particular will have more to add. I'm away from my references at the moment so I can't tell you anything about the serial number in relationship to date range. Best of luck.

Lefty

 

[DCWilson]

Welcome to the forum. The serial number indicates production in the last year of the war, maybe early 1945.

The full identification of your model is Military & Police Model of 1905/Fourth Change, but any gun with a V prefix serial number is just called a Victory model for short. The V was never used on any model other than the 1905 M&P, so there's no chance of confusion.

Can you post photos? Some snubnose Victory models were created after the war by cutting the barrels of guns that originally had four to six inch barrels. It's pretty easy to tell at a glance whether you have one of those or a gun that was originally manufactured with a two-inch barrel.

Also, Victory .38s were produced in two different calibers: .38 S&W Special for American forces, and .38 S&W (also called the .38/200 because of its heavier bullet) produced for commonwealth forces. The rounds are similar but not identical, and after the war some of the .38/200 revolvers had their chambers bored out to take the .38 Special round. The gun's chambering should be stamped on the barrel. What does yours say?

Nickel Victory models are often refinished guns; the wartime finish was a kind of rough matte parkerizing that could be made to look better.

Victory models are famous guns with major historical associations. Congratulations on having one.

 

[Stumpman]

This does not look to to have been altered. It has a crowned barrel and the sight looks to have been original, almost as one piece with the barrel. I will try to get my wife to take a digital photo and try to post it here. I was hoping that the serial number would tell more about the origins.

 

[diamonback68]

This does not look to to have been altered. It has a crowned barrel

The crowned barrel should be a tip off, that's what most of them have that have been cut down from 4".
Just to repeat, the factory never nickel plated ANY Victorys.

 

[Art Doc]

The VMs were all blued or parkerized. A few 2" guns exist but are very rare and none were nickel plated. many of the 4" 38 Special and even more of the 5" 38 S&W (British) guns were altered after the war. Some were nicely done while others were butchered.

Is the locking lug at the front of the ejector rod still there? This was often lost when the barrels were cut down.

The VMs were made 1942-45 and I have one in the V77,000 range that shipped mid 1942.

 

[Stumpman]

It does not have a locking lug. I hope to have some pics up soon. By the way, it shoots to POA at 25' with 158 grn semi-wad cutters. It is very accurate and has a butter smooth DA trigger (9.5lbs on Lyman Trigger Gauge) and a crisp SA break (3.8lbs).

 

[Art Doc]

Guns with the lug missing can be unreliable. Glad yours seems to work OK.

 

[mikepriwer]

Without the locking lug, that means that the barrel has been cut, and
the front sight re-attached. There is no other possibility. And it
has also been refinished, from sand-blast blue to nickel.

It may well be a very accurate revolver, but from a collector
perspective, it is not original. It has been modified, and refinished.

Mike Priwer

 

[Combat]

They are everywhere.

I used to have one of those 2" nickel jobs without the locking lug. Was scared to shoot it, sold it off long ago. I must have seen a dozen like it since then.

 

[Muley Gil]

Look at the chambers. If you see two "steps", it has been rechambered from .38 S&W to .38 special. Many, many British commonwealth revolvers were rechambered this way and had the barrels cut down to sell to American customers as "snub noses".

Lots of times oral history gets mangled. In my own family, my great, great granddaddy supposedly suffered a stomach wound while serving as a Confederate soldier. When the records were checked, he had dysentery.

 

[w10085]

Other barrel options

I have a .32-20 that had the barrel and cylinder replaced and is now a nice looking 2" snub. The only real way to tell is to look at the numbers on the parts. It could be possible that the barrel was changed with a real 2" and the lug was cut off because they didn't want to shorten the extractor rod. Not a smart option but possible. Pictures will tell the story.

 

[Stumpman]

The chambers are not stepped. I have taken some photos. Now I have to recruit my wife to figure out how to post them. Thanks for all the info so far.

 

[Stumpman]

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I'm not sure this will work. I will keep trying if it doesn't work this time.

 

[Art Doc]

Email me your photos and I will post them.

 

[Stumpman]

I will email them to you. Thanks SaxonPig!

 

[Art Doc]

Photos of Stumpman's VM.

As we suspected your pistol has been heavily modified. The barrel was cut and a custom front sight was installed. It has been nickel plated. The lanyard ring was removed. If you are shooting 38 Special ammo it is either an original 38 Special made for U.S. sales or a British 38 S&W that has been reamed for the longer but smaller bore 38 Special (I suspect this is the case). If casings appear bulged after firing it has been reamed.

Losing the front lug is a bad thing. I personally would not shoot a gun so modified. If this were my dad's gun I would retire it as a keepsake and buy another gun to shoot. Restoring this one would cost more than buying another one.

PS: If your gun originally had a 5" barrel this is what it looked like.

 

[Bell Charter Oak Holsters]

I agree with Saxon Pig that this is clearly a post war modified surplus Victory. The correct original grips should be smooth walnut service style. In it's current condition, I don't imagine that makes much difference though. Yeah, I also agree that you should hang on to it as a sentimental family keepsake and find something else to shoot. Best of luck.

Cheers;
Lefty

 

[Stumpman]

I do not have any bulged cases. It still has a tight look-up with very little end shake. Even so, I will not be taking it to the range anymore after reading this! Thanks again.

 

[Stumpman]

One other thing that I am curious about, mine has a marking that is not on your example. On the left side at the top of the trigger guard mine has a stamping. It looks like 2 crossed swords with "M" on one side and"P" on the other. There is a "2" in the lower part of the crossed swords. any idea what this might mean?