I wonder if malls are going to survive

[P&R Fan]

I had about 45 minutes to kill this afternoon before I picked up my daughter from school, so I went and wandered around the fairly large mall we have in town. I would estimate 25% of the stores were vacant. I don't see how a mall can survive like that. This one isn't as bad as the one across town. They have about the same vacancy rate, but they're also about $25 Million in debt.
What are the malls like in your neck of the woods?
Jim

 

[diamonback68]

We only have one medium sized mall and during the week it's a ghost town. Only traffic is at the cinema later in the day.

 

[Alpo]

I don't know. I ain't been to the mall in two or three years.

 

[Pete99004]

Same way around here - dieing a slow death. Nobody has any extra cash for things and only buy what they need when they need it. Sales no longer matter for the most part, because if you don't need it you don't buy it. Internet has hurt some retail, and Wal-Mart has hurt some, but the economy that the Gubbernut wants you to believe is "coming back" isn't and money is short. Going to get worse as inflation is just starting to kick in.

Pete

 

[WuzzFuzz]

Not that I've visited a mall lately, but I see in the paper, and on the local TV, some stores are already having Christmas sales going on.

It wasn't at a mall, sort of a strip center, with one of the larger retail stores, there's hardly any sales clerks there to assist...Ten check outs and only one manned.

What you said Pete....


Bad news........


WuzzFuzz

 

[Dezfan]

They might do better if they didn't allow the gang banging thugs to roam them freely.

After a shooting a year or so ago, I don't go anymore. I've shopped the Sears and the Macy's, but they have separate entrances when I can get in and out without having to pass through the mall area.

 

[WuzzFuzz]

They might do better if they didn't allow the gang banging thugs to roam them freely.

Got to agree with you there Dezfan.....It's been a few years back now, when I went back to Phoenix....When to the Park Central Mall there...Most of the adult shoppers would leave by 6:00 because it was over run with ...let me just call them less than desirables...and you sure wouldn't want to leave your car parked in the lot after the sun went down. Even then, there were several empty stores inside the mall.

I can't remember the name now of another mall further to the west...It had completely closed down.


WuzzFuzz

 

[DCWilson]

It is easy to look at shuttered stores in your own area and think that the country's economy is in the pits. The reality is that there are parts of the country where the basic retail economy barely noticed the recession while the housing market collapsed. Here in Orange County, where tens of thousands of people are out of work because the nature of the economy changed out from beneath them, the two biggest retail centers have continued to do giant business simply because there is always plenty of money to spend at the top end of the inverted income pyramid, and because economic tourism still brings well-heeled international visitors here from any country with a significant high-income sector to its population.

Malls were probably overbuilt at the time of the great retail expansion, but that doesn't mean they are dead. This is a cyclical business. Some retail complexes never dropped a dime's worth of income in the hard times, and many others had to retrench only a little. Some others will have found that projected business levels were badly estimated in the first place, and that cash flow would not pay the construction loans even before the post-2007 slump began to make itself felt in their communities.

Wait five years. Some malls will have been converted to health care/senior housing complexes, others will have mysteriously burned, but vacancy rates in other large retail communities will be low. Will there be pockets of noncompliance with this prediction in parts of America? Sure. There were failing malls even before the recession affected some segments of the retail market. But there is no reason to be hanging any crepe.

 

[Wee Hooker]

Seems malls have a defined life cycle. As soon as they open the newest, others within 50 mi start to decline. Eventually, they all are on life support. ( Personally I believe a mall should be declared DOA when the movie theater moves out.)

I've always thought that a has been mall would make a great senior citizen apartment complex if they partitioned off the empty stores smartly.
Everything is already handicapped accessible, food courts are there, even plenty of exercise and walking space in the winter months.....

 

[rwsmith]

I have very little reason

I have very little reason to go to the mall. Their rents are outrageous so everything is over priced. Maybe Sears and Belk once a year. Oh, and Books a Million.

 

[gregintenn]

What is this mall you speak of?

 

[WuzzFuzz]

Mr. Wilson, I agree with most of what you said...I'm probably more familiar with the Phoenix area....To be sure, the present economy hasn't devastated Scottsdale like it has other parts of the Valley...Scottsdale would be considered more of the high end of the spectrum....Yes they still sell Jaguars, Mercedes, Caddy's, and other high dollar vehicles.

Yes they have those high end resorts with the $500 a night rooms, that do still get filled during the winter months..(Discounts for summer months) So there is still some disposable income being spent. But it's not being spend by the "Joe the Plumber" types...

I would like to be able to say my one younger daughter and her husband will one day be able to afford to buy a home...My one grandaughter...I doubt if they will ever be able to live in a single family dwelling...They're just living pay check to pay check.

I know they're not doing much of their shopping at the malls they have there...It's mostly Wally World, or other discount stores, that usually stand alone.....

Going back to Illinois, to my old home town...There is no longer a Sears store...IN the mall. It's now by mail order....Even the Penny's store that is still there is a ghost of a store.

The once "anchors" of a mall have left....Now it's a mattress store (or at least in one of the stores).

Yes economy has usually been cyclic, but IMO, it's different this time...Very different.

To add, I'm not totally un-familar with your area either...My oldest daughter lives in San Diego...Her husband has a very good job, plus being a retired full Bird Col. from the Army. But I still hear from her how the economy now has affected her and her family out there. She tells me, they shop for the bargains too.


WuzzFuzz

 

[old bear]

We have a LARGE mall about 2.5 miles from the house, that claims it's not just shopping but a designation, upscale stores, and several nice restaurants. the only empty spaces are under renovation with tenants waiting to open shop.

The mall is always crowded, but if you look closely very few people are carrying bags, and those who are, generally have one or two bags at best.

The unemployment numbers may be down, but many of those who have returned to work are now working reduced hours or are underemployed, and most of not all of their income goes to pay for their basic needs.

Sad to say, I don't believe we will ever have the strong middle class we once had. The folks that did do much to make this a strong and Vibrant country.

 

[CajunBass]

If the malls in your area are like the ones around here, and they look like they're dying, just go a few more miles out and you'll probably find a brand new one either just open or being built. In the fourty years since I got out of high school, the "newest, biggest Mall" in town has moved west four times. About every ten years, as the population moves farther and farther out of town, a new mall goes up where there used to be trees. Sometimes those old malls bring in new business, but with the flagship stores gone, all they're doing is fighting a delaying action. Eventually the traffic stops, the small stores close, and the building stands empty and deserted, until it gets torn down.

Between the big stores are a procession of half-filled strip malls, while across the street they're building another strip mall. (There is one beautiful office complex near me that has been there for several years. It had to cost several million dollars. They have NEVER rented one unit. NEVER. You want to talk about a white elephant.)

Someone has money to spend on those things.

Progress.

 

[moosedog]

Where I live it is like that and has been for a while. Michigan's economy was one of the first to go down.
As you move closer to that government experiment that went bad, ie Detroit, it gets much worse.

 

[LouisianaJoe]

Some of the malls in my area require that minors be escorted by an adult during evening hours. Parents were dumping their teens there and going other places.

I do most of my shopping online or at gun shows. I do not like to fight the traffic to get to a mall.

 

[MrJT]

Who needs malls when you have amazon?

I don't know why, but amazon is coming up as a link on my phone. Weird.

 

[luangtom]

Lotsa empty store-fronts around NE Georgia and area. Some locations have up to 40% vacancies. Sure not what they once were and I dread the thought of going to any of them after 6 PM. Luckily, I have a wife that does no more shopping than me.....very little.

 

[shouldazagged]

But...but...aren't they protected by all those ninjas?

I don't patronize them--retired, no money, few needs--but the ones in the affluent, yuppie/boomer part of this city seem to be thriving.

Some of ours in the less-wealthy areas were going under, and one disappeared altogether, long before the recent economic downturn. Mostly, in the case of the one that's completely gone, because new owners cranked up the rents to obscene levels; but also because the thugs were moving in and scaring off the predominantly older clientele.

Needless to say, the greedy new owners didn't want to spring for adequate mall security. And I'll bet they got various juicy tax write-offs when it went south.

 

[Harrison]

Mall?? Mall?? Our mall is the local Walmart, and it seems to be doing a good business. We have a couple of hardware stores and a fishing tackle place, but Walmart is where you go if you want to find anything. Otherwise, it's drive about 50 miles to the mall in Corpus.