Internal Lock Failure - Happened to Me?

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Could this be a case of the dreaded lockup?

Having read so much about cases of IL failure (lockup), I considered that this phenomenon was a rare one and limited (mostly) to hard-recoiling revolvers.

Today, at the range with my new(ish) Model 21-4 firing midrange (~850 f/s) 44 Special 200 grain loads the gun locked up not once, but twice.

When it locked, I could move neither the hammer or trigger. The cylinder would open normally. The flag thingy just peeked out alongside the hammer.

After the second ocurrance, I cleared the weapon and closed the cylinder. Noticed the hammer drop a tiny fraction of an inch the instant it latched, and the lockup cleared.

Been firing Smiths for 40 years and have a passel of them. This is the only IL one and, I do believe, it will be the last.

21-4.jpg
 
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That sure sounds like a lockup to me. I took care of my 642 yesterday.

Once you remove the lock, you can get a plug to fill in the hole it leaves behind. Do a search on these boards for "FS the Plug", read through the thread, and order the correct plug from John. He shipped mine in a couple of days. And be sure to watch the youtube video demonstrating the procedure.

Hey.... I just "plugged" John's "plug" ! :)
 
I am not endorsing or slamming the lock, but I have to ask.

If I read your post correctly, you never touched the lock and your revolver jammed. You continued to not touch the lock and the revolver un-jammed.

I am not sure that I would call that a lock failure.

You state this is a fairly new revolver. You also witnessed the hammer go forward as the extractor rod and center pin locked the cylinder closed.

Did the trigger fully return to it's proper position or was it slightly rearward? I would have a gunsmith pull the side plate and examine the lock work.
 
Did the trigger fully return to it's proper position or was it slightly rearward?

As far as I could tell, the trigger was in its proper position. Last year, I had the bolt on my M60 break. This locked the gun up totally, and the cylinder (naturally) could not be unlocked. At first, I thought this was what happened here. Obviously not the case here.

thanks,
 
Before you get up on the soap box and preach, did you open up the gun and look at it and clean it. could have something on the inside that done it or the center pin is a hair short and the bolt did lock it up from recoil. There is alot to happen here than just the lock, did you have to take a key and un-lock it, or the spring on the flag broke. If that is what happen you can turn the gun up side down and the flag will drop down. If you can't figure it out call and send it back and see what the factory says about it. I'm Not beating up on you, please understand that, just have a hard time writing what I'm thinking sometimes.
 
I've only read about a couple of credible lock failures. The rest were clearly problems unrelated to the lock, reported by guys who simply don't know how a S&W revolver works. My guess is that IL failures are less common than cylinder stop problems, maybe happening with about the frequency of broken hammers. In other words very rare, and hardly something to worry about. No telling what's causing your problem, but it probably isn't the IL.
 
I'll take the gun off your hands. What you experienced was probably an IL failure, not a high primer or debris under the extractor or bulged case or half stroke or other problem. Your gun will enjoy the company of my IL competition guns that get out weekly and enjoy the CA sunshine.
 
I'll take the gun off your hands. What you experienced was probably an IL failure, not a high primer or debris under the extractor or bulged case or half stroke or other problem. Your gun will enjoy the company of my IL competition guns that get out weekly and enjoy the CA sunshine.

I didn't realize the problems that you mentioned could cause the flag to pop out, as the OP experienced.
 
Well, sounds exactly like what happened to my 66 a few weeks ago. Of course, my 66, being made back in about '72, has no lock and it turned out to be an issue with the rebound spring. My point is that there are just too many things that could go wrong with a revolver to justify concluding that it's a lock problem based entirely on the symptoms you describe. I'd have the gun checked out by a competent gunsmith.
 
FWIW I bought a 638 w/the IL new about 6 months ago. I've put the hottest +P - Buffalo Bore - through it repeatedly (several hundred) and never had a problem.

While I don't care for the IL (took advantage of an excellent price & the $50 rebate) I would not hestitate to carry this one for personal protection.

If S&W had a problem early on I'm guessing they solved it.
 
When my 60-14 locked up I could not open the cylinder and had to use the key to get the hammer and trigger to reset...
 
I suppose I got lucky like 'old cop'... TRR8 built in 2009 per the paperwork... 1000 rounds in, not an issue... not even the slightest budge of the lock. I have never had it 'locked' but I don't plan on touching it. Although I'd like to 'plug' it at somepoint, I just assume not touch the thing.. not really get the point.
 
One old guy's take on the lock

From reading a number of threads on this subject it boils down to this for me.

The lock will probably never fail. But:

1. It looks ugly
2. It's unnecessary
3. There are plenty of nice used revolvers out there without it
4. And, it just MIGHT fail once in a blue moon

So, why mess with it at all, ever?

Easy to say for me since I've got more revolvers than I'll ever need, but worrying about an unneeded and possibly unreliable safety device is something I just don't plan to do. Period.
 
I have a M386 NightGuard.
After 200 rounds of 38spl range ammo, I started testing 357's.
The gun locked on the 2nd 357.
I had to use the "key" (which is actually only a wrench) to unlock it.
When I got home, I pulled the lock flag.
 

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