Is .380 ACP effective against canine threats?

[max503]

What were they using? I have used many 380 HP's and most never exited the first jug. If they were using FMJ's I suppose they could get more than one jug, but six I would love to know what brand, and bullet. Thank You. Be Safe,

He said several brands of FMJ's penetrated 7 and stopped in the 8th. He also said Critical Duty penetrated 3-4 and stopped in the next one. A 12 gauge slug stopped in the 1st but expanded. I'm guessing it was a Foster-type slug.
Anyway, that's what he told me and he's not one to exaggerate.

I do have to wonder where he got all the jugs. Maybe from someone who works in a cafeteria. He works at a school.

 

[Echo40]

It's also important to note that .380 ACP was substantially downloaded for decades due to the popularity of cheaply made blowback .380 Pistols which were frankly unsafe to shoot regular loads through, so ammo companies started loading their ammo below Standard Pressure to avoid the possibility of any legal action taken against them because some guy's Saturday Night Special/Ring of Fire pistol catastrophically failed and injured him.

Once the trend of modern, locked breach .380 Pocket Pistols took off, ammo companies started loading ammo to the proper specs again, with some companies loading their ammo right to the edge of SAAMI Specs because the locked breach design can handle much higher pressures than straight blowback.

So in other words, if the guy who did these milk jug tests did so before, I dunno, 2010, then yeah, it's not too hard to believe that .380 ACP FMJ of that era didn't penetrate very well.

 

[oink]

I've never shot a healthy dog with a 380. I have used a P3AT to put several out of their misery injured badly by run ins with cars. Worked well for that.

As for rampaging bad dogs and a couple of sick dogs, I've put them down with subsonic 22lr from an old Marlin bolt. It worked every time. However there were a couple that needed a coup de gras but they were already done.

If I was being threatened by a dangerous dog that I was out on foot with I'd have used my duty gun. But the 22 subsonic worked great from the scoped Marlin bolt when able to make careful shot placement.

Out for a walk I almost shot a couple of young aggressive Great Danes that got after me with my P3AT. They read my mind. When I decided to kill them they suddenly backed off. For the next several weeks I walked with my PF9.

 

[KarmannGhia]

Hornady Critical Defense from a Kimber Micro 380. Ended an attack from a Rottweiler and two Pitbulls. They were attacking my Belgian Malinois through our gate. They were trying to pull her through the gap between the gate and the fence. One shot to the head of the Rottweiler and he was dead before he hit the ground. The pitbulls fled, but were euthanized by authorities later. $2800 in vet bills for my girl and she was never 100% after that. Best dog I've ever had.

With the RIGHT load, I trust 380, but that would me my minimum.

 

[686-380]

Only once

While in an RV park, I was walking my dog, on leash. A woman on a bike approached with an unleashed dog. She asked if my dog was friendly, I said yes. She replied hers was too...then her dog attacked mine.
I drew my .380, using trigger discipline but she rushed to get her aggressive mutt.
I didn't say a word and kept walking.
My after action assessment was I erred.
Not only were the dogs movements too fast, I was in an RV PARK! No clear shot!
A belly gun is difficult at best, to hit what you're aiming at.

Good luck!

 

[alwslate]

I've never been attacked by a large aggressive dog thank goodness so I can only speculate. It seems to me the only way a dog can bite you is to get to contact distance. So it seems to me that you should be able to easily shoot the dog with a point and shoot small .380 like the Ruger LCP.

 

[gym cat]

Shot placement IMO is the obvious answer. I personally think a 380 is marginal at best. Over penetration shouldn't be a concern shooting down at a wild dog, coyote etc. If one has to pull the trigger you want the target to go down and stay down.

 

[mikerjf]

Bigfoot are known to mimic coyotes. I realize that isn’t an improvement.

 

[Llance]

Rabid animals are a whole lot tougher to kill than healthy ones. Like bears and people up on Crack and other mind-altering substances you can shoot them in a "killing" location and they don't know they are dead. That being the case, they seem to think they still have the ability to take you out with their remaining strength. Guess what, they can. Having said that, I will carry nothing less than a .380 as they are the most common PD firearm in the states. Remembering that most wild animals are more cautious of people than dogs, it's best you carry something you are most comfortable with. If it's a .380 fine, if .40 fine too. Just be sure to practice enough that you are comfortable in your ability to hit what you are shooting at. I like the idea of you carrying both a pistol and a can of spray. Use one and then the other, but which ever you use first, be prepared to respond to an officer asking questions. To the question, Did you have to shoot it? Your answer should be, Hell yes, it looked like it was foaming at the mouth. At least that would be my answer.

 

[Shibadog]

Let me add that I am a confirmed dog lover and have had one in my life as long as I can remember. Shooting a dog is/was a last resort thing for me. Those I encountered all those years ago were feral and very aggressive-and they were NOT afraid of people. We tried yelling, throwing rocks/sticks etc ., all to no effect. Hence the reason we retreated. When we went back, armed, we had a second encounter-much like the first except for our rifles. These were NOT “somebody’s pet” (more like Cujo�&#56883

 

[Echo40]

Let me add that I am a confirmed dog lover and have had one in my life as long as I can remember. Shooting a dog is/was a last resort thing for me. Those I encountered all those years ago were feral and very aggressive-and they were NOT afraid of people. We tried yelling, throwing rocks/sticks etc ., all to no effect. Hence the reason we retreated. When we went back, armed, we had a second encounter-much like the first except for our rifles. These were NOT “somebody’s pet” (more like Cujo��)

You don't have to explain yourself to anybody, and frankly anyone who would accuse another of shooting an otherwise friendly animal without due cause isn't worth responding to.

In my experience, the sort of folks who take the most offense towards others defending themselves against attacking dogs are the sort who has one of those extremely hostile, anti-social dogs who will attack any person or animal they come into contact with, so they're bothered by it because it could happen to their dog one day, but they would rather pretend that their dog as well as all others like it are sweet, innocent, harmless creatures, and that it only acts the way that it does around strangers because it can "sense" that every other person or animal it has ever responded to with hostility was dangerous.

Nobody else is that unreasonable nor accusatory towards those who have so much as expressed a perceived need to defend themselves against feral dogs, much less had to do so.

Rest assured, you did the right thing, the responsible thing, and frankly provided a public service by taking care of dangerous wild animals who almost assuredly would have gone on to attack someone. Other folks would have probably just left them be with zero regard for the safety of others, but you went all the way back out there, tracked them down, and euthanized them in a humane fashion.

 

[Claymore33]

If you have to ask , then it is not enough. we know that .38 Spl + P works
we know 357mag works , we know .40 cal/10mm works, and we certainly know .41Spl/MAG and .44 Spl/MAG works.
Don't wonder , KNOW.

 

[David Sinko]

Dogs...

I shot a pit bull in the 'hood after it started chewing on me on the street without provocation. It let go and was attempting to get behind me to attack my back when I shot it with a .40/180 gr. Gold Dot middle of the body. It ceased the attack immediately, and its blood shot high into the air with each beat of its heart as it staggered on to a porch and died there.

Another time I attempted non-lethal methods to grab a Rottweiler that had been abandoned at the bottom of an outside stairwell. The dog was somewhat aggressive and came charging up the stairwell. Another officer beside me shot it almost point blank with Remington Reduced Recoil 00 buckshot. The dog ran off like nothing had ever happened. There was not a drop of blood and no evidence of a miss. A few minutes later it was found on somebody's porch, finally bleeding out. But it did take the full charge of buckshot without apparent effect.

Another time a full grown pit bull that had been purchased on the internet sight unseen went nuts at a domestic disturbance and attacked everybody in the residence, sending four people to the hospital. Another officer and I went to make sure the dog was contained and it charged the other officer from the back alley. He got the gun out in time and killed it with a few shots with the same Gold Dot ammo.

My former FTO was sent to a call of pit bulls at large from a known problem house. They attacked him in the street, and he killed both of them, again with .40 Gold Dot. I found two of the bloodied and expanded bullets on the sidewalk. Those Gold Dots expanded very quickly and didn't penetrate a whole lot but they worked well against dogs.

 

[jimmyj]

Years ago I was attacked by three Pitbulls. I was able to draw my Deparment Sig-Sauer P-229 .40 loaded with 180 grain JHPs and doubled tapped each Pitbull center mass.Neither of the Pitbulls acted as if They were shot.The sound of the shots turned Them and They retreated into a wooded area.
When backup units arrived we hunted down the pitbulls and finished them off with 12 gauge shotguns.
If I was in yours shoes I would pack a Glock Model 20 10mm loaded with JHPs. ( and a pair of fast running shoes)

 

[jimmyj]

I like big bullets and a lot of them.

 

[lihpster]

The only dog I ever shot was a feral Lab, about 75 pounds, that was attacking livestock and pets in the area. Since I shot him at 50 yards with a 180gr 30-30, he was DRT. Buried right there too.

 

[Echo40]

Based on what I've read here, I think I'll go ahead and just pack my M&P40 Shield. Sure, I can't carry it in a pair of drawstring shorts, but I'd rather sweat it out a bit in cargo shorts from the heat than sweat it out in fear otherwise.

Alas, I don't have any 180gr Gold Dots, but I do have 165gr Ranger Ts, which seems to be a pretty effective round.

 

[mtgianni]

Having said that, I will carry nothing less than a .380 as they are the most common PD firearm in the states.

Any data to back that up? I have not seen a department in the Western States that has any uniformed officers carrying 380.

 

[Llance]

Any data to back that up? I have not seen a department in the Western States that has any uniformed officers carrying 380.

Your assumption that PD stands for Police Department is spot on for some referencing, however my use of the abbreviation is for the words Personal Defense. And yes, there is plenty of reference material for that statement. I'm not trying to be nasty here, just explaining myself. Please don't take offense.

Llance

 

[rosewood]

Four legged critters should be shot in the lungs. They know they are hurt and will run off to die.

This is a good point, any critter knows something is up when they can't breath.

Rosewood