Is there a more practical & versatile cartridge than the .38/.357?
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RobertJ.
Member
I've always been of the opinion that for the reloader, there aren't too many cartridges more versatile than the .44 Magnum.
I love the .357 Magnum, and the .38 Special. I shoot the .38 Special more than any other cartridge.
So when we're looking at both the .357 and .44, and talking versatility, let's consider the range each can be used for.
Each can be loaded down to a power level that a beginner would be comfortable with. Powder-puff target loads. Yes, I know the .44 throws heavier lead, but a 200 gr. WC in my 629-4 still feels like shooting my K38.
At the upper end, however, the .44 Magnum stands head and shoulders above the .357 Magnum.
So, I'm still of the opinion that the .44 Magnum is the king of versatility, with the .38/.357 as the runner-up.
I love the .357 Magnum, and the .38 Special. I shoot the .38 Special more than any other cartridge.
So when we're looking at both the .357 and .44, and talking versatility, let's consider the range each can be used for.
Each can be loaded down to a power level that a beginner would be comfortable with. Powder-puff target loads. Yes, I know the .44 throws heavier lead, but a 200 gr. WC in my 629-4 still feels like shooting my K38.
At the upper end, however, the .44 Magnum stands head and shoulders above the .357 Magnum.
So, I'm still of the opinion that the .44 Magnum is the king of versatility, with the .38/.357 as the runner-up.
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muddocktor
Member
It's not strictly a 1911, but the Coonan Classic is a 1911 type pistol that shoots the 357 Magnum. They aren't cheap but they are fairly available nowadays. And they are an absolute hoot to shoot too, but a reloader's nightmare. They scatter brass all over the range.
Here's mine:
And here is an action shot at the range running some hot 296 reloads:
And I agree that the 38/357 is a great "all in one" caliber. But the 44 Special/44 Mag is a close second. I have rifles, revolvers and auto pistols in both calibers.
There is no doubt that a .44M can be loaded to more power than a .357M but most people don't need or want that much power and recoil. Because .44 bullets are heavier than .357 bullets the .357 can be loaded to have less recoil than the .44. The .357 with 125 gr. bullets can be loaded to a real mouse load or load a 158 gr. to over 1400 fps and it is more buck and roar than most people can handle. Larry
Cal44
Member
OkTime for another caliber for consideration.
The 327 Federal and compatible.
You have the 32 s&w which is just right for repelling hamster invasions.
The 32 s&w long, a good practice and low end defense round.
The 32 h&r magnum for a 38 special level defense round.
The 327 Federal for near 357 magnum power.
And for the experimenter the 32 acp.
All in 6 round j frame sized guns.
Someone needs to come out with a lever long gun in this caliber too and you would have hunting up to deer sized game covered.
The 327 Federal and compatible.
You have the 32 s&w which is just right for repelling hamster invasions.
The 32 s&w long, a good practice and low end defense round.
The 32 h&r magnum for a 38 special level defense round.
The 327 Federal for near 357 magnum power.
And for the experimenter the 32 acp.
All in 6 round j frame sized guns.
Someone needs to come out with a lever long gun in this caliber too and you would have hunting up to deer sized game covered.
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silentflyer
Member
I certainly don't think I am near as qualified pass judgement on handguns/calibers, so I will abide by this gentleman's guidance:
Skeeter Skelton:
My Friend, The .357
Skeeter Skelton:
My Friend, The .357
Jack Flash
Member
That surprises me. I'll have to look up that article and read it. Must have something to do with having a handgun / rifle combination which can share a common round for when you are traveling light, far from civilization.
To my thinking, that's not much better than choosing an M1 Carbine as your only center fire rifle. Sure, it's a good little rifle, but obviously a choice for someone who doesn't hunt much with a rifle, and certainly not at longish ranges to get larger sized game.
You wont get an argument...
You won't get an argument from me. I love to experiment. I shoot the softest bunny poot loads to anti-tank rounds. The wide range of bullets available only add to the fun.
You won't get an argument from me. I love to experiment. I shoot the softest bunny poot loads to anti-tank rounds. The wide range of bullets available only add to the fun.
38SPL HV
Member
There are None more versatile than the 38/357, close second would be 44 Mag imho.
Terrain & where you are.....
You are right, but in wooded areas close shots are much more likely than longish shots. Also, in the SE the biggest dangerous thing you'll have to worry about is Black Bear and there aren't many of those outside the mountain areas. In other words, a .357 rifle would be great for me but not so much in more open territory with bigger, more dangerous animals. Even in the old west it was extremely popular because of its portability, though the cartridges/calibers were different, usually running from .32 and .38 until the big bores hit their peak in the late 1800s and returning to smaller calibers afterward.
You are right, but in wooded areas close shots are much more likely than longish shots. Also, in the SE the biggest dangerous thing you'll have to worry about is Black Bear and there aren't many of those outside the mountain areas. In other words, a .357 rifle would be great for me but not so much in more open territory with bigger, more dangerous animals. Even in the old west it was extremely popular because of its portability, though the cartridges/calibers were different, usually running from .32 and .38 until the big bores hit their peak in the late 1800s and returning to smaller calibers afterward.
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DWalt
Member
At one time and in certain parts of the country such as the Appalachians, the .32-20 was considered an ideal deer rifle. And indeed it probably was if the user was a good enough shot and the game was no more 100 yards away, which was typical in heavy woods and brush. Plus it didn't make much noise. I once had a friend in Western Maryland whose deer rifle for West Virginia hunting was a Winchester Model 43 in .22 Hornet. And he always got his deer.
RobertJ.
Member
Points to ponder:
1. Is there anything that the .38/.357 can do that the .44 Magnum can't?
2. Is there anything that the .44 Magnum can do that the .38/.357 can't?
3. Is perceived recoil relevant to versatility?
Fun debate! And please remember, I'm a huge fan of all of them!
1. Is there anything that the .38/.357 can do that the .44 Magnum can't?
2. Is there anything that the .44 Magnum can do that the .38/.357 can't?
3. Is perceived recoil relevant to versatility?
Fun debate! And please remember, I'm a huge fan of all of them!
Point #2. Calahan said the .44 Magnum can blow your head clean off.
Can the .38/.357 do that?
Point #3. Recoil is relative. Some can't take it. Others don't mind it.
I have 2 .44 Mags and a bunch of .38/.357s and I love them all. What
if we could only have one? I can't even consider giving up one.
Can the .38/.357 do that?
Point #3. Recoil is relative. Some can't take it. Others don't mind it.
I have 2 .44 Mags and a bunch of .38/.357s and I love them all. What
if we could only have one? I can't even consider giving up one.
Jack Flash
Member
And we haven't even discussed the 10mm yet! Folks over on the SIG Forum tell me it's an absolute death ray!!!!!
power and recoil......
Both reach power levels that can be hard to take, but max power in an 'L' frame .357 is probably not as bad as max in a .44 mag. I've never fired a full power .44 mag in a 'N' frame so this is just speculation from what I hear about.
As a side note, the .357 would be a little lighter and smaller in case you had to travel on foot.
I guess if you can use the power the .44 mag is tops, unless you want to go to something like a .500.
Were I in the North woods or the Rockies where big bears, moose and other big critters live, I'll take the .44. Here in the SE a .357 is fine.
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Both reach power levels that can be hard to take, but max power in an 'L' frame .357 is probably not as bad as max in a .44 mag. I've never fired a full power .44 mag in a 'N' frame so this is just speculation from what I hear about.
As a side note, the .357 would be a little lighter and smaller in case you had to travel on foot.
I guess if you can use the power the .44 mag is tops, unless you want to go to something like a .500.
Were I in the North woods or the Rockies where big bears, moose and other big critters live, I'll take the .44. Here in the SE a .357 is fine.
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DWalt:
As a native West Virginian, I can verify the use of .22 Hornet in the Eastern Panhandle for deer hunting. I have a camp over in that area, and have hunted with locals who liked the round. One of the fellows in particular that I remember had what I am sure was a pre 64 Winchester model 70 in .22 Hornet, and told me that his father had left it to him when he passed away, and he still deer hunted with it. I'm not sure that it is still legal as a n approved cartridge or not. I'll have to look that up. But some of those boys over there probably don't care whether it's approved or not.
Best Regards, Les
I guess if I was forced to narrow it down and was being allowed to keep only 1 handgun and 1 rifle, a revolver and a lever gun in 44 magnum would beat out the same combination in 357 - because I reload.
Just because we do have a few grizzlies and a fair number of moose up here in the great NW. But it would be REALLY close, and if the 357 pair was ll I had I wouldn't feel too terribly under gunned - even if I had to defend myself against the big critters.
Just because we do have a few grizzlies and a fair number of moose up here in the great NW. But it would be REALLY close, and if the 357 pair was ll I had I wouldn't feel too terribly under gunned - even if I had to defend myself against the big critters.
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cowboy4evr
Member
IMO , the 38special / 357 magnum is the best all around . I for many years load thousands of 38specials with the Lee Loader kit , you pound everything together . It made reloading cheap and gave me availability to enough ammo to shoot --Lots .
I have a friend , a Lieutenant in his local police agency , ( 30+yrs) that started with the 38special . They went to 1911's , which fell apart after 2 yrs of usage . They have tried everal different plastic pistols including glocks.
But he bought his wife a S&W J frame 38 special for conceal carry . There is a lot of bad guys taking a " dirt nap " because of the 38 special was his reasoning .
I cast and shoot a 180 gr cast bullet in my 357's over a max load of W296 . I get stellar performance with that bullet . For years I have shot those out of a model 19 . It"s as tight today as the day I bought it .
I have to say that I concur that the 357 / 38 special is a very very versatile combo to shoot out of one gun . I have and reload for the larger magnums , love them all but feel the best versatility is the smaller , 38-357 . tremendous power available for the size and weight of the gun carried .
I have a friend , a Lieutenant in his local police agency , ( 30+yrs) that started with the 38special . They went to 1911's , which fell apart after 2 yrs of usage . They have tried everal different plastic pistols including glocks.
But he bought his wife a S&W J frame 38 special for conceal carry . There is a lot of bad guys taking a " dirt nap " because of the 38 special was his reasoning .
I cast and shoot a 180 gr cast bullet in my 357's over a max load of W296 . I get stellar performance with that bullet . For years I have shot those out of a model 19 . It"s as tight today as the day I bought it .
I have to say that I concur that the 357 / 38 special is a very very versatile combo to shoot out of one gun . I have and reload for the larger magnums , love them all but feel the best versatility is the smaller , 38-357 . tremendous power available for the size and weight of the gun carried .
Friends:
Let me add another point in favor of the 38/357 over bigger calibers. If we ever become dependent on our own resources, less lead means more bullets. I also mold, size and lubrcate bullets. Not all the time, but sort of as a way to ensure that I am not totally dependent on commercial sources. Whenever I find supplies of lead, I collect it. I try to every now and then melt it down and mold into ingots, and mark them with what I know about the content. I have all sorts of stuff. One guy gave me a lot of auto body lead. It's real soft, and used to (still is?) be used like bonds in auto body shops. Another gave me hundreds of pounds of old fashioned wheel weights. I understand a lot of the new ones aren't good for bullet casting, but the old ones are just fine. And so on.
Anyway, the point is, if you rely on 38/357, you can make many more bullets from a given amount of lead, than if you are loading 44 magnum.
Which, in my thinking, makes that a more desirable choice if you could only have one.
Also, availability: there are very few places in the United States where you cannot find some sort of 38/357 ammunition. Sometimes the big boys are a little harder to find.
Just thinking out loud....
Best Regards, Les
Let me add another point in favor of the 38/357 over bigger calibers. If we ever become dependent on our own resources, less lead means more bullets. I also mold, size and lubrcate bullets. Not all the time, but sort of as a way to ensure that I am not totally dependent on commercial sources. Whenever I find supplies of lead, I collect it. I try to every now and then melt it down and mold into ingots, and mark them with what I know about the content. I have all sorts of stuff. One guy gave me a lot of auto body lead. It's real soft, and used to (still is?) be used like bonds in auto body shops. Another gave me hundreds of pounds of old fashioned wheel weights. I understand a lot of the new ones aren't good for bullet casting, but the old ones are just fine. And so on.
Anyway, the point is, if you rely on 38/357, you can make many more bullets from a given amount of lead, than if you are loading 44 magnum.
Which, in my thinking, makes that a more desirable choice if you could only have one.
Also, availability: there are very few places in the United States where you cannot find some sort of 38/357 ammunition. Sometimes the big boys are a little harder to find.
Just thinking out loud....
Best Regards, Les
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