Itemized Reloading System COST

HorizontalMike

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I have recently returned to shooting after a very long sabbatical, decades long. That said, after a recent day at the range I realized that long-term I need to seriously consider reloading. Money will be too tight for the next ~7-8 months to buy a complete "system" at the moment, so I have several questions in order to plan acquisition of materials and supplies, particularly BRASS.

After surfing the web, I realize that I will most likely need to buy live ammo, shoot, and save/recycle the brass for the next 6-8months, for when I can afford a complete RL system set up.

I eventually want to reload .357 Magnum and .222 Remington brass. So, for starters:
  • What is the best/acceptable live ammo (both calibers) that will provide good brass for the future? Remington, Fiocchi, Federal, Hornady, Winchester, Geco, other?
  • Any concerns over having mixed brass in a particular caliber?
  • Pure brass vs nickel plated?:confused:
And then the BIG QUESTION:
  • Is it possible for someone to itemize ALL needed components and sources for a COMPLETE reloading system for .222 and .357?
  • Is there a good single source/book for instruction?

Thanks for taking the time for this :):):)
 
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First and foremost

First and foremost get a modern reloading manual with a good 'how to' section. I like Speer 14th and Lyman 49th for that.

Decide what kind of shooting you are going to do and get components to match. Bullets, brass, powder and primers.

Press- single stage, turret or progressive. The more you are going to shoot the more automation you will need.

Dies and shell holders for each caliber.

There are a LOT of time saving accessories but these are the essentials.

Scale

Powder measure

Some means of priming, separate or built in to your press

Safety glasses

A caliper is needed to check case lengths. A means of trimming, deburring and chamfering case mouths will be needed.

Case lube and pad

Powder funnel

Loading tray (I use 2)

Case cleaning tumbler is optional

Sooner or later you will need a bullet puller

A powder trickler is a nice thing to have
 
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Reloading is a nice hobby, but unless you cast your own bullets, it is not really a money-saver, especially when you consider your time.

Before you get started, you need to decide WHAT type of load you will be loading. For example, in .357 Magnum, are you going to make a range-appropriate 38 Special load? That will necessitate a different shopping list that making full-power magnums for hunting.

In addition, you need to decide if you are going to use a single stage press (SLOWWWWWW) or a "Progressive" model which turns out a loaded round with each pull of the handle. If you get a progressive, I recommend a type which indexes automatically. A manual indexing machine can, and has, resulted in a distraction causing a failure to index, resulting in a double charge of powder, and KABOOM.

A basic list:

Reloading press of the type you want with dies in the appropriate caliber. I recommend dies that do not require lube - carbide used to be the type, but I have not reloaded in 30+ years. Dillon is a good maker, and they stand behind their products.

Empty cases of appropriate caliber having the type of primer pocket that is "reloadable." You are looking for Boxer primed cases or ammo, not Berdan primed cases or ammo.

Primers of the appropriate size and strength (standard or magnum) - different load/powder combinations require different types. NEVER assume a "magnum" primer is better or gives more thorough ignition because it is more powerful. The opposite is sometimes true as magnum primers don't play well with certain powders.

Powder specific to the load you plan to make. Decide ahead of time if you are making target range loads or hunting. Get a clean burning powder with enough volume that a double charge is less likely.

Bullets of the type and grain weight you intend to make.

A good reloading manual is imperative. The company from whom you buy your powder will have a reloading manual applicable to the type of powder your buy. The purpose of the manual is to provide you with starting "formulas" for your loads, so you do not blow up your gun.

You will need a good scale to test the powder "throw" of your machine. For example, if you need 3.2 grains of powder for the load you are making, the scale is used to test to make sure you have set your machine and adjusted it to throw exactly 3.2 grains of the powder in question. This adjustment is required each time you switch powders as a machine adjusted to throw 3.2 grains of Powder A might throw an unsafe amount of Powder B. Always check and double-check.

There is no way we can teach you all about reloading in a few responses here, but perhaps we can point you in the right direction. Before you do anything, you need to buy a big thick book on reloading and read ALL of it before you spend another nickel.

Reloading is DANGEROUS if done improperly, and if you are not willing to READ the instructions and learn about the process, then you should just buy your ammo. Again, reloading is NOT cheaper unless you cast your own bullets, and even then, it might not be if you factor in the time you could spend with your family, etc. Of course, some people want to "get away" to the "man cave" to reload.

Oh, you must also learn to see the signs of excess pressure and you should probably invest in a chronograph to test velocity of your loads, as another way of double-checking your work.

Reloading really is a science, and just like the science kits of the past, you can unintentionally "blow things up." Good luck!

I agree with the previous post. Don't forget safety glasses and a caliper. The seating depth of the bullet and overall length of the loaded round must be set exactly. A caliper is required to do this. Too deep and pressures will skyrocket and KABOOM. Not deep enough and the loaded round will not fit in the chamber.
 
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It's really tough to read the yellow print Mike.
For start, go to Midway USA or Cabelas and look up the prices on the starter sets offered by Lee, RCBS and others. These will have the basic tools you need to get started but you will add more items as you go.
As far as what makes a complete setup, well...Some people can't live without digital scales or power case trimmers. Most of my stuff is basic, single stage presses and all, but I have what I consider a "complete" set up.
I've never restricted myself to a single source for info for instruction purposes. But I've found that most of the reloading manuals, especially the Lyman books, have good background how-to info.
Been reloading for years and have used all sorts of "mixed brass". Always kept them separated, mainly for trimming purposes.
The internet is your friend here. Hopefully others will offer up some more specific info.
Good luck and have fun.
John
 
I posted this on the Marlin forum about a year ago. Prices may have changed a bit, and it's for .30-30, but you'll get the idea:

Here's a quick cost analysis of reloading v. buying ammo. These are published retail prices, not including sales tax or shipping, which may go up or down. You could probably find better deals, better products, but these are based on what I have bought or would buy:

RCBS Partner kit - $193.33
RCBS dies - $49.99
Shell holder - $7.99
Winchester .30-30 brass 100 count - $33.98
Oregon Trail Laser Cast 170gr RNFP 500 count - $66.50
CCI large rifle primers 1000 count - $29.99
Unique 1lb - $17.99

Total initial outlay - $400.43

Now lets look at cost per round
Let's say you get 5 reloads out of the brass which is conservative, you may get far more - $.06796
Primer - $.02999
Powder for a 6gr charge - $.01542
Bullet - $.133

Total - $.24637

Factory ammo - $13.99 per 20 = $.6995

After about 550 rounds you will have recouped the cost of the press/dies/shell holder. Then you'll be saving ~$.45 per round (not including the need to buy more brass.
 
Some questions answered

I eventually want to reload .357 Magnum and .222 Remington brass. So, for starters:
  • What is the best/acceptable live ammo (both calibers) that will provide good brass for the future? Remington, Fiocchi, Federal, Hornady, Winchester, Geco, other?

    @@@ I stick with the well known brands.

  • Any concerns over having mixed brass in a particular caliber?

    @@@ No problems but having the same brass gives better consistency.

  • Pure brass vs nickel plated?:confused:


    @@@ Your choice. Nickel stays prettier longer. Some say the mouths of the nickel work harden and split easier. Others say no problem. With carbide dies they reload about the same but nickel requires a tad more effort.




    Thanks for taking the time for this :):):)


  • The more you shoot, the more worthwhile reloading is.
 
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I agree with most of what has been said (there are always different opinions on the details but that's what makes life fun :D)

One thing I'd recommend, since you don't have an immediate need to reload, read up and decide what you want for equipment and then look at the want ads in Craigslist and Armslist for used equipment (and possibly components) Many people get involved in reloading and then decide it's not for them (or they get reloading stuff for presents). Reloading equipment pretty much lasts a number of lifetimes so the savings can be substantial.
 
Shop for a couple of reloading manuals. I like the Speer and the Lee handbooks. Before you load the first round, put a notebook in your work area and write down the details of each load.

If I were going to only reload two calibers I would buy a Lee turret press and an extra turret. I would install the dies and a Lee autodisk powder measure on each turret and just leave it set up. You will need the little riser to raise the powder measure up. If you want to load for accuracy then you might get an adjustable powder measure instead. The Lee perfect PM is good and accurate but leaks a bit of powder around the drum.

Dies

Press

Powder scale

Primer pocket cleaning tool

Powder measure

Dial or digital calipers. For this the $20 set from Harbor

Freight will work.

Case trimmer

Some means of cleaning the brass. I use a mix of TSP and citric acid with a plastic pail and strainer. Cheap and reasonably effective. I just can't drop the money for a tumbler, too cheap.

I am a Lee fan. IMHO there is a better alternative for just about everything they make, but only at much higher cost. Check Midway for sales on Lee press kits, except for going to auctions I can't think of a cheaper way to start.

In .357 you might look at hard cast bullets, much cheaper than jacketed for range use.
 
If you don't have to have brand new in the box, check ebay for eqipment,brass etc.
Yes get a good manual, read it, and find someone to mentor you when you start.
 
I just started reloading and got every thing I need to load 38 spc and 9 mm for less than $450. That includes 3 books and brass and bullets and powder, enough to load 500 rds each. With out case cleaning tumbler. If you buy 1000 rds of live ammo at todays prices it will be close to $450. By the way, I didn't actually spend any money. I used my American express value points on Amazon.com, except for the powder and primers. You do not need to buy live ammo and save the brass to get started. Brass and bullets are out there. Powder is harder to find in the brands you really want. Lee 50th anniversary kit is the best value. Hope the wife doesn't find out about the AE thing.
 
Mike,

You'll probably find handloading to be enjoyable just as shooting is. It's the "other half" so to speak - another way to enjoy the sport when you're at home.

I suggest you take a look at Lyman's handloading manual. It's very good for the new handloader.

Also, I sent you a PM. . . .

Krogen
 
You cannot make good ammunition with good quality brass. At this time Remington and Winchester are using old or worn out equipment to make 222 brass I would recommend you buy Lapua, Norma or Nosler. Any of these three are of the best quality. Nosler loads ammo and it is sold by Midway. Norma makes 222 ammo also but I don't know who carries it, and Lapua makes brass only in this round, Champion Shooters Supply had 3 -100 round boxes of Lapua brass in stock last week. My personal advise is to buy as large of quantity of good ammo as you have means to acquire. Then as bargains become available, pick up the reloading gear more affordably. The classic rifle you have will most likely give you groups worthy of the trouble. For several years "Triple Deuce" held held the records for 100 and 200 yard group size and score in BR shooting. If you call Champion Shooters Supply, ask if Carl has time to chat with about 222 Rem, have a note pad handy and take notes. Carl knows more and shoots more 222's than anyone I know or have heard of. He uses 222 were most use 22-250 on varmints. I believe his personal record is 3 prairie dogs on 1 shot. Ivan
 
I do not believe it's possible to begin reloading for under $1000. You'll read posts that tally the cost of -
- Press
- Dies
And maybe a couple of other things.

But reloading seems to be a LOT of small and relatively inexpensive things.

- Scale
- Tumbler
- Media separator
- Loading block(s)
- Loaded ammo boxes (bags whatever)
- Hand tools (wrenches, pliers, screwdrivers)
- Fine tools (Tweezers, hemostats)
- Bullet puller
- Magnifier(s)
- Task lighting
- Eye protection
- Waste basket
- Recycle container
- Dirty/Clean brass containers
- Compressed air

There's a lot more. Some will say "You don't need eye protection, just wear your shooting glasses". Ok, save 5 bucks there. "I already have a waste basket". Ok, save another 5 bucks. One way or another you need a bunch of stuff. You may already have wrenches and pliers and screwdrivers, but if you steal them from your truck tool box or your garage, then you're going to be mad when you need that 7/16 wrench when you're working on your wife's car and it's not in your tool box.

And I think the most "non-mentioned" piece of equipment in any list of "what do I need" is a rock steady bench. You really can't just clamp a press to a kitchen table. You really do need a heavy, sturdy, stationary bench, anchored to the floor and/or wall. That requires space that's essentially permanent. You really can't just pull out a 200 lb bench from under the bed and set it up in the den.

You're going to get powder and primers all over the floor. You need a safe and easy way to clean that up.

Bottom line, lots of small/inexpensive things, pretty good sized space dedicated to JUST reloading, substantial bench.

Then once you've got it all up and running, you'll likely realize that you don't actually SAVE any money. You spend the same amount but just shoot more often or more rounds per outing.


Sgt Lumpy
 
Nickel Not Popular?

:eek: Wow guys! :eek:

This is great! I have been surfing the suggested links on my 2nd monitor as I read this thread on the first. A full load of information on here, for sure! :D

RE- available brass -- seems like most of what is available in .357 is "nickel" only, with the pure brass "out of stock".

Why is "nickel" more available? Not popular?
 
Have heard nickle cases tend to have splits sooner at the case mouth, so you can't load them as many times as regular brass.
 
I guess it all depends what type of reloading you are doing. If you are going to shoot target loads and for fun at not very high volume, I like my Lee turret press. Lees stuff is good and a lot cheaper than most. If you plan on shooting a lot then you might need a progressive press. They are more expensive and harder to learn on. A single stage press is probably more accurate if you plan on shooting very little. A lot of the bench rest guys use single stage presses. But any of the presses will do any job, it just depends how much time you have.
As for the nickel cases I have found that I don't get as many reloads with them. Just be careful to not flare the case mouth any more than you have to. Try to find as much once fired brass as you can and stock up on it. Buy all of the manuals you can and read up on everything now before you start buying anything. Stock up on powder that the manuals recommend for the caliber you are going to shoot. Get the primers by at least 1000 at a time, they are cheaper the more you buy.
 
:eek: Wow guys! :eek:

This is great! I have been surfing the suggested links on my 2nd monitor as I read this thread on the first. A full load of information on here, for sure! :D

RE- available brass -- seems like most of what is available in .357 is "nickel" only, with the pure brass "out of stock".

Why is "nickel" more available? Not popular?


Check Gunbroker. In 357, about 15 sellers of brass. In 357, brand is not all that important. I shoot Starline mainly, and have some other brands that I found, and no issues with any. For the rifle, I use Lapua in a 6mmbr bench rest rifle and it is very good. For informal type shooting, any brand should work fine.
 
A Lot To Absorb

Much information here. Really don't have the funds to start right away, other than pick up a couple of books. I still want to afford to shoot up a box of 22LR, .222, and .357 once each month or two... :confused:

I understand the desire to just buy brass an get started, but until then I am going to have to get by on the commercial ammo and save the brass. Ideally that might mean that I would have maybe 400rd of .357 and 160rd of .222 brass by July or August. This way I still get to shoot while waiting on that first retirement check to come in ;););)

Looking at Fiocchi .222 50gr Hornady V-Max Is this ammo worthy for its brass?
 
If you're going to shoot 150 rounds of center fire a month,a single stage starter kit will have most of what you need,less dies,a case cleaner and components,so figure $250-300.If you think you'll be shooting a lot more, take a look at the turret and progressive tools.You'll get into a lot more money,but using a single stage for 4-500 shells a month is fairly time consuming,tedious and hard on the lower back.
 
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