It's Official: Texas has achieved Third-World Status

[biku324]

Kiwicop:

Yes. We have oil, gas, coal, uranium, hydro, wind, and solar in New Mexico. Wind and solar (the wind seldom rests; we have 300+ days of sunshine annually) are perfect in combination with gas-fired and hydro power generation. Wind turbines don't age badly in our arid climate, and solar on south-facing roofs is fed into the grid, adding supply and reducing the homeowner's or business owner's power costs dramatically.

Not every place is New Mexico.

I think the drive from Christchurch to Queenstown is the loveliest in the Pacific. And your hydro power from water falling from glaciers to the sea is just ingenious!

 

[bulletslap]

Our blackout has been rolling along for 18 hours, the outrages are spotty and do not seem due to ice or wind in my area. It is as if something in the distribution has failed.

Thank God we have a wood fireplace and a big stack of wood !!!

Granddaughter came over with two cats because her house is Total Electric.

Her house will most likely need all the plumbing replaced.

 

[Ziggy2525]

You called it. Half of Texas wind turbines are frozen.

Historic winter storm freezes Texas wind turbines

Your utility distribution network is always susceptible to interruption, no matter the source. Plenty of options to generate power yourselves.

True, but... With the exception of a couple East Coast blackouts, in the past they're usually localized interruptions, limited to one utility's service area, that could be fixed by the local utility.

Now it looks like there will be rolling blackouts in North Dakota because of capacity planning issues (e.g. windmills freezing) in West Texas. That seems like a new twist on things.

 

[Ziggy2525]

...
What's going on in TX is not chronic, it's do to an exceptional set of temporary conditions.

Maybe. If the actual weather patterns aren't matching what they designed/modeled for, we may be seeing the beginnings of a chronic problem.

 

[sourdough44]

I woke up to 76 in the house, woodpile goes out two years. Good luck TX.

Since it's a 'normal' Winter here in WI, haven't missed a beat.

 

[dockmurgw]

Oddly, our neighbors are having rolling blackouts and we're not.

Could this have something to do with that ?
New Mexico population growth - .64%
Texas population growth - 16.4%
That's a lot of new residents tapping into a grid that's not expanding and updating as fast as needed.

 

[glenwolde]

I'm in Fort Worth but haven't had a blackout yet. We must be close to something they consider important. Maybe the Zoo.

If you're close to a hospital or a fire/police station they won't black you out usually. If they do you're the first to come back. A couple of hurricanes near a Fire Station taught me that.

 

[Muss Muggins]

I know a little bit about power grids. We've got a coal fired power plant right here in the city limits. We sell most of our generated power to Columbia, Missouri thru the grid, and buy our power from the national grid at a cheaper rate. If the grid failed, and the incoming grid transmission lines went down, as it did during an ice storm here in 2009, we'd have trouble. And we did. We couldn't just run the power from the local plant to the city.

I asked a buddy of mine that works in management at the local power plant about the Texas problem. Texas doesn't really participate in the national grid. The power generated in Texas is for Texas, and since Texas is having production issues, Texas citizens have a problem.

That's my minor contribution to this discussion . . .

 

[RogerA]

I know a little bit about power grids. We've got a coal fired power plant right here in the city limits. We sell most of our generated power to Columbia, Missouri thru the grid, and buy our power from the national grid at a cheaper rate. If the grid failed, and the incoming grid transmission lines went down, as it did during an ice storm here in 2009, we'd have trouble. And we did. We couldn't just run the power from the local plant to the city.

I asked a buddy of mine that works in management at the local power plant about the Texas problem. Texas doesn't really participate in the national grid. The power generated in Texas is for Texas, and since Texas is having production issues, Texas citizens have a problem.

That's my minor contribution to this discussion . . .

3 degrees here at the house this morning. Power off and on all night. All faucets dripping to keep them from freezing. Should be 60 degrees here Monday.

 

[Ziggy2525]

....

I asked a buddy of mine that works in management at the local power plant about the Texas problem. Texas doesn't really participate in the national grid. The power generated in Texas is for Texas, and since Texas is having production issues, Texas citizens have a problem.

That's my minor contribution to this discussion . . .

I think it's more nuanced than that. The far northern part of Texas, including the Texas Panhandle where the frozen windmills are, are part of the Southwest Power Pool that controls power from North Dakota to Northern Texas, not the Texas ERCOT that controls power in the rest of Texas. Also, from just looking it up, the Southwest Power Pool has a high voltage DC interconnect with ERCOT and agreements to provide power as needed.

Power-wise, ERCOT may not belong to a regional pool, but what happens in Texas doesn't just stay in Texas.

 

[Oldfrt]

Texas does have some northern parts in the South West Power Pool, the problem with the pool is that they have focused a lot with the development of wind generation. The company I work for has shutdown generation of several older coal plants due to the cost of the pollution controls needed. Coal plants produce steam to spin the turbines, when things get cold the plant risks having problems, if something goes bad and the turbine trips that can be well over 500 mega watts of power offline immediately. The harder they push the plants the more likely a trip becomes, think sports car with the throttle held to the floor four hours on end.

What we are seeing is a prelude to the future nationwide as we push to eliminate the big coal burners and no body wants a nuke. I trained in nuclear power back in the late 70's, class of 7708 in the Navy. The only way to replace the big coal plants is with nuclear power, nothing we currently have is capable of replacing the spinning power of a large turbine.

There is talk of going with industrial scale battery reserves to store power, the only problem in our current situation is that several days of inoperable wind and solar could result in battery depletion.

I am saving for a larger generator, only decision is which fossil fuel to go with. I am also working on removing the trees that overhang both of my houses, when that is done then solar becomes viable for me, I can always build a bunker to put in battery backup.

 

[Muss Muggins]

I'm sure it is. That's why I said ". . . doesn't really participate . . . " Suffice to say that the uncharacteristic weather is putting stress on the entire infrastructure. Just giving the thoughts of somebody actively involved in power distribution in the Midwest . . .

I think it's more nuanced than that. The far northern part of Texas, including the Texas Panhandle where the frozen windmills are, are part of the Southwest Power Pool that controls power from North Dakota to Northern Texas, not the Texas ERCOT that controls power in the rest of Texas. Also, from just looking it up, the Southwest Power Pool has a high voltage DC interconnect with ERCOT and agreements to provide power as needed.

Power-wise, ERCOT may not belong to a regional pool, but what happens in Texas doesn't just stay in Texas.

 

[Oldfrt]

Just a little trivia, the South West Power Pool is run by the Department of Energy. They decide who gets to supply power and who sits idle in times of plenty.

 

[Dave.357]

I am a retired Coal Miner.
I remember cheap energy
and times when it was not
Unusual for one parent to
Work one job and take care
Of his family.
Industry has been sold off
To other countries by our
Elected officials.
If you do not have enough
Electric to warm your house
or turn on your lights thank
your elected officials.
They solved the problem
while lining their pockets.

 

[Ziggy2525]

...
The only way to replace the big coal plants is with nuclear power, nothing we currently have is capable of replacing the spinning power of a large turbine.
...

I'm a two career guy. First career I was an engineer. Spent half that career working plant mods in a small 500MW (output) commercial nuke. Agree nuclear is the only option, but... in the U.S. no one has the political appetite to tackle the difficult problems. Things like agreement on a single design/single size/single vendor plant. Creation of a passively cooled commercial reactor that can sit indefinitely without having the reactor cooling pumps running and not melt down. Creation of a commercial reactor that can survive a LOCA and passively do a safe shut down. Some way to deal with the high level and low level waste.

I've been out of the industry for a while now. Seems like there was some chatter about liquid sodium cooled reactors. Doesn't seem like that's gone anywhere.

 

[petepeterson]

Yes. We have oil, gas, coal, uranium, hydro, wind, and solar in New Mexico. Wind and solar (the wind seldom rests; we have 300+ days of sunshine annually) are perfect in combination with gas-fired and hydro power generation. Wind turbines don't age badly in our arid climate, and solar on south-facing roofs is fed into the grid, adding supply and reducing the homeowner's or business owner's power costs dramatically.

Not every place is New Mexico.

I live just outside of Pittsburgh. We have roughly 4.5 days of sun a year. Wind is plentiful, but a windmill would just be fighting the trees for their turn to fall on your roof when it gets windy here.
We are, however, sitting on a trillion cubic feet of natural gas. Seems like different areas should have different solutions for their needs, and a happy medium could be achieved.
Instead, it's the two "sides," with the "My way or the Highway" mentality.
'Murica.

 

[glenwolde]

Now here's a thought. We live on the coast, salt corrosion from the water is an issue for things like outdoor furniture, cars etc. What will the salt laden air do to these turbines in a decade or so?

Is green energy really economic?

I believe the blades at least are carbon-fiber.

 

[tops]

There is a bunch of truth in those two statements. Larry

 

[Harrison]

Problem in Texas seems to be a reliance on wind farms, and in San Antonio a large solar farm, as well as wind. Well, the wind turbines froze up and the solar farm is covered in snow. I understand San Antonio closed down two of it's coal fire plants a couple of years ago. Now we are paying the price

 

[THE PILGRIM]

SE NM is also seeing Electric shut downs.
They are most likely connected on to the Texas Power Grid.

 

[PatriotX]

ERCOT to change Texas energy prices to meet high demand amid winter storm | kvue.com

Emergency meeting yesterday took place, where ERCOT argued vociferously the need to spike prices during these times of 'unprecedented demand.'

Rolling blackouts aren't a sign of supply failure to them. They're a sign that they need to be charging more.

 

[biku324]

SE NM is also seeing Electric shut downs.
They are most likely connected on to the Texas Power Grid.

Yes, that's the 'little Texas' region of Hobbs, Carlsbad, Artesia, and Roswell. They are linked to Excel, but most of the state is with PNM.

 

[biku324]

I live just outside of Pittsburgh. We have roughly 4.5 days of sun a year. Wind is plentiful, but a windmill would just be fighting the trees for their turn to fall on your roof when it gets windy here.
We are, however, sitting on a trillion cubic feet of natural gas. Seems like different areas should have different solutions for their needs, and a happy medium could be achieved.
Instead, it's the two "sides," with the "My way or the Highway" mentality.
'Murica.

Absolutely different regions have different needs, different resources, and should have different solutions.

 

[HOUSTON RICK]

No worse than a normal Ohio winter day, but the infrastructure and driving skill sets here are not up to it. All in all, a nice day or week, to work from home. I hope power comes back for those without it later today as promised.

 

[rockquarry]

Wind turbines have never been a reliable source of energy. Without subsidies, there would be no wind farms.

 

[Dave_n]

To those in Texas (and elsewhere) effected by the ice and cold, we hope you all hunker down, keep warm and survive until it warms up again.

While Karen and I were driving through Texas we were surprised at the number of wind turbines, especially around Amarillo, in a place where the economy was based on oil and gas (just like our home provence of Taranaki). We never gave a thought to them freezing even though we have heard of the "Texas Blue Norther".

In the last 18 months a big (for Kiwiland) wind farm has been established between our town and the one just south east of us (17 km/10 miles away) We can actually see some of the turbines from the end of our street and they are a blight on the ocean view when driving along the highway. Now here's a thought. We live on the coast, salt corrosioin from the water is an issue for things like outdoor furniture, cars etc. What will the salt laden air do to these turbines in a decade or so?

Is green energy really economic?

When I was "commuting!!" between DC and Wellington for Uncle Sam around 20 years ago, I remember the wind turbines overlooking the Cook Strait and I could certainly speak for the wind sheer through CS when flying out of Wellington to places on the South Island and KC may well know the term "flying chipolatas" for the Swearingen (spelling?) turboprops that made those runs. You certainly needed a strong stomach or remembered not to eat before takeoff!! That wind certainly had enough power to run many wind turbines. Dave_n

 

[Kiwi cop]

Texas does have some northern parts in the South West Power Pool, the problem with the pool is that they have focused a lot with the development of wind generation. The company I work for has shutdown generation of several older coal plants due to the cost of the pollution controls needed. Coal plants produce steam to spin the turbines, when things get cold the plant risks having problems, if something goes bad and the turbine trips that can be well over 500 mega watts of power offline immediately. The harder they push the plants the more likely a trip becomes, think sports car with the throttle held to the floor four hours on end.

What we are seeing is a prelude to the future nationwide as we push to eliminate the big coal burners and no body wants a nuke. I trained in nuclear power back in the late 70's, class of 7708 in the Navy. The only way to replace the big coal plants is with nuclear power, nothing we currently have is capable of replacing the spinning power of a large turbine.

There is talk of going with industrial scale battery reserves to store power, the only problem in our current situation is that several days of inoperable wind and solar could result in battery depletion.

I am saving for a larger generator, only decision is which fossil fuel to go with. I am also working on removing the trees that overhang both of my houses, when that is done then solar becomes viable for me, I can always build a bunker to put in battery backup.

That bastion of Green activity, Germany, has had to build hundreds of new coal fired power plants after shutting down the older nuclear plants that were developing issues.

 

[wetdog1911]

Weather is going to happen, wheather it's a hurricane, or ice storm. Loss of power happens, just Be Prepared.

I did old school heating for my shade house years ago.
Aladdin Blue Flame heaters, using kero or mineral spirits. Could remove the top and cook on them and I brought them along to SC. Also brought my Aladdin lamps (very bright!).

Use them a good bit in the winter as one is plenty for a single room and not having to heat the entire house. No lines for kero and 3-5gal jugs are good for a week at least.

It's nice to have a backup.

Rob

 

[bigwheelzip]

That bastion of Green activity, Germany, has had to build hundreds of new coal fired power plants after shutting down the older nuclear plants that were developing issues.

Interesting statement. Be curious to see a reference?

From what I found, Germany is closing all 7 of it's remaining nuke plants in the next two years.

Also, they seem to have 1 new coal-fired power station out of their total of about 80 coal-fired power stations.

An agreement to close all remaining coal-fired power plants by 2038 is in effect, with at least 17 coal-fired power stations being closed in the next two years.

 

[GaryS]

Believe nothing Bill Gates says.