I picked this up a week ago and it was advertised as a 1891 second model and it dose have all the features but the ser. # is 954 that should put it in as a first model.
Thanks for any info you have.
Ted
Thanks for any info you have.
Ted
Latest acquired S&W
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OP
Hi and yes all the numbers match. I think it must've come from a set and the other barrel wasn't with it
2nd Model
Hey Ted,
I think yours is actually a second model. The first model still had the round, extended recoil shield like the model of 91 Single Action revolver.
The second model was manufactured from 1905-1909. Total production was 4,617. Starting with serial number 1. The most common was the 22rf with 10" barrel. I think that's what you've got there. Nice gun!
Murph
Hey Ted,
I think yours is actually a second model. The first model still had the round, extended recoil shield like the model of 91 Single Action revolver.
The second model was manufactured from 1905-1909. Total production was 4,617. Starting with serial number 1. The most common was the 22rf with 10" barrel. I think that's what you've got there. Nice gun!
Murph
OP
Thanks Murph
I wasn't sure how the serial number when. Whether they run concurrently or for each model.
I wasn't sure how the serial number when. Whether they run concurrently or for each model.
You have a 2nd Model frame if there is no hand or cylinder stop slots? If the slots are present it could be a factory leftover 1st Model frames to make up early 2nd Model guns. It would not have been originally a combination set. Also, gunsmiths could remove the recoil shield and mill the slots in a 1st Model so the owner could keep up appearances against the competition. You should check the serial number on the barrel to see if it is original to the frame?? It is stamped just ahead of the barrel larch on the vertical flats near the pivot point. The top latch should be numbered as well. As far as I know all 2nd Model SS pistols were 22 and used a 10" barrel, but of course there was always the chance of special orders throughout the production of this model.
As far as finish is concerned, I see the opposite that was mentioned above. The barrel appears to be plum to rust colored without hardly any finish, while the frame seems to have most of its bluing left intact.
As far as finish is concerned, I see the opposite that was mentioned above. The barrel appears to be plum to rust colored without hardly any finish, while the frame seems to have most of its bluing left intact.
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ol777gunnerz
Member
2nd model
You have a 1st-2nd model transition [frame with 1st & 2nd model features], with a first model of 91 barrel as many of them were leftover when they ran out of the 1891 frames. The 1891's had a 2 pin trigger guard frame, the 2nd is a single pin trigger guard frame, not slotted & equipped for a revolver. The 2nd models were standard with a 10 inch barrel, but could be special ordered with 8 & 6 inch barrels. At some point S&W ran out of the 1891 8 inch barrels & then 8 inch barrels with a single letter address were used. I own one of the 8 inch 2nd models with the single address barrel with a serial number way higher than yours, with the much less common nickel finish. The second photo shows the difference in barrel addresses, the top is the 2nd model single address, above another 8 inch barrel 1st model
You have a 1st-2nd model transition [frame with 1st & 2nd model features], with a first model of 91 barrel as many of them were leftover when they ran out of the 1891 frames. The 1891's had a 2 pin trigger guard frame, the 2nd is a single pin trigger guard frame, not slotted & equipped for a revolver. The 2nd models were standard with a 10 inch barrel, but could be special ordered with 8 & 6 inch barrels. At some point S&W ran out of the 1891 8 inch barrels & then 8 inch barrels with a single letter address were used. I own one of the 8 inch 2nd models with the single address barrel with a serial number way higher than yours, with the much less common nickel finish. The second photo shows the difference in barrel addresses, the top is the 2nd model single address, above another 8 inch barrel 1st model
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OP
Thanks to all for the the very informative information
I check to see if there was any slots for hand or stop and there isn't also I found a serial number on the latch under neath and the back of the extractor but I can't find a number on the barrel and they match the serial number on the frame
I check to see if there was any slots for hand or stop and there isn't also I found a serial number on the latch under neath and the back of the extractor but I can't find a number on the barrel and they match the serial number on the frame
I also have a 2nd model single shot with a factory 8" barrel and the single address line. Very well used, but still shoots great!
The number on the barrel (if any) is on the flat surface at the rear---inside the latch recess---on the right side. Easily seen while holding the latch up/open (although you may have to remove any accumulation of dirt).
Ralph Tremaine
Ralph Tremaine
I had oone years back. Serial number was 8xx. Good shooting little gun.
OP
Thanks Ralph
I found the number on the barrel it was covered over with dirt and it matches the frame. Also the front side is a Lyman this would be add after it left the factory I presum.
Thanks to all for the info
Ted
I found the number on the barrel it was covered over with dirt and it matches the frame. Also the front side is a Lyman this would be add after it left the factory I presum.
Thanks to all for the info
Ted
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OP
Thanks Gary
The one in the bottom row is the sight on my gun.
That would be a very interesting catalog thank you for sending me the pictures. I'll copy them and keep them with the gun.
Ted
The one in the bottom row is the sight on my gun.
That would be a very interesting catalog thank you for sending me the pictures. I'll copy them and keep them with the gun.
Ted
One more pic. I do not have a page from a S&W catalog that shows a 2nd Model, but I am attaching a 1900 catalog entry on the 22 Single Shot.
Remember, the 2nd Model standard production was only available in .22LR and a 10" barrel, except for early examples using up some available barrels from the '91 and special orders.
Remember, the 2nd Model standard production was only available in .22LR and a 10" barrel, except for early examples using up some available barrels from the '91 and special orders.
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OP
Thanks again that's a very interesting catalog you with great info, there was info on a 32-44 target I have that I don't know about
Great stuff Gary
Ted
Great stuff Gary
Ted
"The one in the bottom row---------------------."
Are we still talking about the front sight (only), or both front and rear---the Lyman Ivory Slide sight? (I've had several carrying the Lyman Ivory bead front over the years---only two with the combination---a Model of '91 (revolver), and a .44 DA 1st------a very effective sight combination---compared to anything---then and now---especially on the larger frame gun where the also larger front bead just jumps right out at you.)
Ralph Tremaine
1891, 1st model single shot RESCUE gun
No play on words here. Some guys collect "shadow box" guns (is that correct ? ). I don't but I will buy a "rescue" gun once in awhile.
Hey, Ralph ... what do you think ?
I needed a project gun like I need another hole in my head but it was so cheap I couldn't resist.
So ... THIS, is my last acquired S&W...about a week ago ... it was one I could just not resist, even if it was just for parts.
Don't hold it against me I also got a 1911 Colt .38AMU (1961) converted to .38 Mid Range (as most of them were after the AMU flopped) the same day. The Colt 1911 AMU to .38 Mid-range was NOT cheap. It was a factory assembly AMU but not sure who converted it to mid-range.
This 1891 has an incorrect (brass) barrel pivot screw but extractor is intact and mechanics work well, AND it is NICKEL. All parts numbers match, too !
Will keep you guys in the loop as I clean it up. I have the correct pivot screw with tubular insert even though this incorrect screw functions correctly. Also have a spare rear and few NOS front sights. LOL.
I paid a pittance for it. Let' see what it does, if it cleans up and shoots well enough or I just use it for parts.
I have about a dozen, new in correct Marbles & Ideal cellphone bags, front sights from Charles Duffy (RIP) that I must own for about 30+ years not so I'm sure i have the front sight, too. LOL !!
Just a side comment here about what a nice and GOOD man Charles Duffy (RIP) was. Decades ago I needed a sight for another single shot, he sends me about 10 or 12 NOS front sights in the proper cellophane pouches, for NO money, with instructions to choose and pay for the sight I like best and return the rest.
I returned NONE of the NOS sights, sending Charles a check to purchased ALL of them. Charles Duffy was a good man !
No play on words here. Some guys collect "shadow box" guns (is that correct ? ). I don't but I will buy a "rescue" gun once in awhile.
Hey, Ralph ... what do you think ?
I needed a project gun like I need another hole in my head but it was so cheap I couldn't resist.
So ... THIS, is my last acquired S&W...about a week ago ... it was one I could just not resist, even if it was just for parts.
Don't hold it against me I also got a 1911 Colt .38AMU (1961) converted to .38 Mid Range (as most of them were after the AMU flopped) the same day. The Colt 1911 AMU to .38 Mid-range was NOT cheap. It was a factory assembly AMU but not sure who converted it to mid-range.
This 1891 has an incorrect (brass) barrel pivot screw but extractor is intact and mechanics work well, AND it is NICKEL. All parts numbers match, too !
Will keep you guys in the loop as I clean it up. I have the correct pivot screw with tubular insert even though this incorrect screw functions correctly. Also have a spare rear and few NOS front sights. LOL.
I paid a pittance for it. Let' see what it does, if it cleans up and shoots well enough or I just use it for parts.
I have about a dozen, new in correct Marbles & Ideal cellphone bags, front sights from Charles Duffy (RIP) that I must own for about 30+ years not so I'm sure i have the front sight, too. LOL !!
Just a side comment here about what a nice and GOOD man Charles Duffy (RIP) was. Decades ago I needed a sight for another single shot, he sends me about 10 or 12 NOS front sights in the proper cellophane pouches, for NO money, with instructions to choose and pay for the sight I like best and return the rest.
I returned NONE of the NOS sights, sending Charles a check to purchased ALL of them. Charles Duffy was a good man !
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The hex nut on that SS does not look period correct. Any basement gunsmith who is savy about these things would have used a square nut on that machine screw!!!
Nice rescue gun.
Nice rescue gun.
I saw that screw at the Ace Hardware Gun screw section.
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