M&P9C or Glock 19?

A pistol without a manual safety?

If so, why?

As I read about the many accidental shootings involving these pistols, it makes me think they should not be considered for purchase.

If you look at the incidents where individuals have "inadvertent" discharges where no one is injured, shoot themselves accidentally, shoot others accidentally, and have children as young as three years old shoot others or themselves with pistols that do not have a manual safety, you get the picture.

Of course, gun owners who like the non-safety guns will have their arguments, but the only "safety" built into these guns is the "pre-trigger" feature which simply means you have more trigger to pull before the gun discharges! And history shows that this feature does not prevent the trigger being pulled by accident or by a person who otherwise might not know how to or be able to disengage a manual safety (say the 3-year-old toddler who recently shot himself in the head).

As to the relative "quickness" of employing a pistol that does not have a manual safety, consider that training and habituation allows a shooter to adapt to having a positive manual safety as part of the operating procedure for their pistol.

This ran on longer than I expected...but I hope some will consider this and that maybe it will benefit somewhere down the road.

Revolvers do not have manual safeties. Do you consider them unsafe?

If someone finds the trigger to be too light on the Glock or M&P, they have the option of installing one of the Glock NY trigger spring units which bring the pull weight up to 8lbs(for NY1) and 12 lbs(for NY2). The M&P can be ordered with a 10+ lb trigger.
 
I agree, I have a full size 9mm and a shield 9mm. With one round in the chamber and 8 round mag I have ten rounds. Really simple to conceal under a t shirt. Don't really need the compact.
 
I am going against the grain here - never liked the feel of a Glock grip, and shoot crappy because of it. Also no thumb safety which I like for a carry gun. Also, it's larger, physically, which makes it harder to hide. Also not stainless.

On the other hand, the 9c is a beautiful gun, fits my hand well, available with a thumb safety, is comfortable to shoot, very accurate (more than me), and still carries 13 rounds in small configuration, which I consider hi capacity in a 9mm. Even has a lifetime warantee as an M&P, and the slide is black stainless, which helps it be less maintenance intensive, while still more covert. An added bonus right now, with prior military service, or active duty, is an additional $50 rebate from Smith & Wesson, ---- HOW can you beat that?

I just bought one for $350 with the rebate - a smokin deal.

The 9c just may be the perfect concealed carry gun, for when hi cap is wanted.

All that, and a great price this weekend!
 
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A pistol without a manual safety?

If so, why?

As I read about the many accidental shootings involving these pistols, it makes me think they should not be considered for purchase.
Because they are completely superfluous on the M&P. All the thumb safety does is block trigger movement. Sure, it's a benefit when reholstering, but all the NDs you mention would have happened anyway because that same complacent person would have forgotten the thumb safety.


No such thing as a modern semi-auto pistol without any safeties. The M&P has a drop safety and a striker block. Both are very effective and the gun will not fire unless the trigger is held back. Glock works exactly the same way.
 
I consider a manual thumb safety, or a grip safety like on a 1911 (which also has a thumb safety) or Springfield XD/XDM, to be an important feature for a handgun, rifle, or shotgun. For over a hundred years, the U.S. Army has had the same philosophy. Outside factors are not always predictable or controllable. My wife feels the same way, and I respect her opinion more than mine. She carries a Shield 9 with a thumb safety. We both practice draw, release safety and fire.

That said, I think that otherwise, the Glock 19 is almost the optimum single pistol defense solution. Light weight, full 3-finger grip (a very big deal to me), 4" barrel, 15 round magazine, accessory rail. I think it's good enough to warrant the extra cost and trouble of adding a Cominolli thumb safety, which I did--or rather had a gunsmith do. I also discarded the disposable Glock plastic sights in favor of TruGlo TFX combo tritium/fiber sights. Finally added Talon grips. Now, I consider this the ultimate carry/bedside handgun.

I wish Smith & Wesson would take a G19, study its features, and then make a comparable M&P with thumb safety. I would sell the G19 and buy one the same day.
 
I wish Smith & Wesson would take a G19, study its features, and then make a comparable M&P with thumb safety. I would sell the G19 and buy one the same day.
It's called the M&P 9C with finger extension on the mag. I have larger than average hands and get all three of my fingers on there.
 
I was in this exact same spot until recently myself.
I EDC a shield 9 (love it)
I had a FS M&P .40 but just couldn't couldn't shoot it very accurately
(even got a Storm Lake 9mm conversion barrel and mags) didn't help
much.
I think the shape or balance of the FS just didn't work for me.
I am lucky enough to belong to a club that has a lot of "Glock guys"
so I've shot a lot of the different models. The G19 was on my radar.
I liked the Gen 3's I'd shot, but Glocks aren't on the AG's list
here in Mass so you have to buy them FTF and you pay a stiff
premium for them.
I came across a 9C recently for a super cheap deal and couldn't
resist, 4 mags, stippled , only 50 rounds through it.
I bought it, had the trigger done by my gunsmith (no Apex,
brought it down to 6 pounds and shortened the take up and
make it nice and smooth) , changed the back strap on it to a
large, and this morning I qualified firing at the indoor range at
my club with it. I hit 7 out of 10 in the black at 25 feet.

I'm not looking at the G19 any more, this thing fits my hand perfectly and
points very naturally for me.
I also have a Springfield XDM 3.8 .45 , if I could find a 9mm I'd
jump right on it, but again not on the AG's list in Mass, so it
would have to be FTF and I'd have to pay premium (as I did for my .45)
but as far as feel goes the XDM is my favorite.
Shoot as many of them as you can before you buy, I had no idea I would like
the 9C as much as I do.
 
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Never a big fan of Glocks. Have MP40c and love it. For me it just feels better in my hand which leads to better shooting. And...it's made in the USA!
 
Both are good pistols. The 9c is a bit more concealable than the 19 because it is a little smaller, but others may have different opinions based on their experience and lifestyle. Glock set standards when the introduced the 19. It's size, along with its 15 round magazine capacity, reliability, and accuracy made it a great all-round pistol. The 9c is more of a slight step up from a G26 in size and capacity. I would consider it a great concealed carry pistol if one is looking for capacity without a great deal of bulk. I have carried 19/23s for a number of years, and because of my build and manner of dress, prefer the 9c to the 19/23 when I need to conceal a handgun. I have medium sized hands, so the lack of pinky support doesn't necessarily bother me when carrying the 9c with the flat base plate (I learned with G26/27 that the gap between the edge of the grip and the extended base plate pinched my pinky during cycling/recoil). I like the 9c's factory finger rest base plate, but ace no problem when using a 17 round magazine in the gun without an adapter. Unlike Glocks, the 9c doesn't seem prone to shooter-induced feeding problems caused when "torquing" on the extending full size magazine protruding from the grip.

I am not a proponent or the one-pistol-fits-all train of thought. For years, Glock pistols probably came closer than any to fitting a wider range of shooters, but for those with really small hands, the M&P is the clear winner between the two. In terms of ergonomics. I prefer the M&P, but again, it's a matter of personal preference. With factory night sights, the M&P's are better than the ones Glock calls their own, but again, it is a matter of preference. My two M&P 9s, as well as my 26 currently wear Trijicon HDs. Glock magazines are generally going to cost you less than M&Ps. There are still more holster options for the Glock based on its popularity, but if you shop for gun leather on-line, that should not be a problem.

If you're looking for a concealed carry pistol in a non law enforcement setting, a G43 or a Shield would be a better choice as they're much easier to keep concealed. For an all-round pistol for carry, home defense, and even weekend competition, a G19 would fit the bill nicely. Nevertheless, the 9c is a nice pistol and has its own virtues. For what it's worth, the prices you quoted were pretty decent.
 
My wife has a G19 and I have a M&P9c. IF you want to increase the initial pull weight of the triggers like I did, (no safety on either gun) the 9c ends up a better trigger. Initially I put a NY trigger spring in the G19 which gave us a heavier initial pull but also heavier final pull to fire the gun. So, to lighten the final pull I tried all the Apex and Lonewolf drop in trigger bars and found the Lonewolf 3.5# to be the best. But at a certain point, the problem w/ the Glock is that the trigger pull also finishes cocking the striker and the only way to further reduce that effort is to use a lighter striker spring. I don't want to do that on a defense gun. Also polished the rest of the parts. On the M&P, all I did was install an Apex carry trigger spring and DIY polishing. I prefer the result in the M&P. The M&P is slightly smaller overall and has slightly less mag capacity so you have to weigh those details too.
 
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I'll suggest another alternative - a Sig P320 compact. Better trigger than S&W, better sights than the Glock. A bit more money but worth it.

Try all three and then decide.
 
I have a 9C with Apex FSS trigger kit and thumb safety. I'm most comfortable carrying my 1911 platform pistols (Sig 938, Kimber Pro) and want the thumb safety and a very light, crisp trigger. I don't shoot the G19 very well.
 
I'll suggest another alternative - a Sig P320 compact. Better trigger than S&W, better sights than the Glock. A bit more money but worth it.
Try all three and then decide.

Exactly where I was going if I didn't fall in love with the 9C. The P320 is a great 'all around" 9mm , I believe a little larger than both the 9C and the G19 so for a carry gun I'd look at the 320
Sub compact.
 
I have the 9c and can carry it concealed with the finger extension for the full finger grip. I usually carry an LCP Pocket Holster or a Kahr 9094 belt holster.
I also have a SW9VE pre-SD9VE with a 12 lb. trigger. I have rented the G19, which I consider the best of the Glocks, I prefer the SW9VE grip, but the G19 trigger. I also rented a 26 and a 17.
Another pistol which might make your list is the Beretta PX-4 Compact, which has the DA/SA trigger and a manual decocker/safety.
Geoff
Whose wife claims she will be reloading, whilst I am deciding which gun to use.
 
Both are good pistols. The 9c is a bit more concealable than the 19 because it is a little smaller, but others may have different opinions based on their experience and lifestyle. Glock set standards when the introduced the 19. It's size, along with its 15 round magazine capacity, reliability, and accuracy made it a great all-round pistol. The 9c is more of a slight step up from a G26 in size and capacity. I would consider it a great concealed carry pistol if one is looking for capacity without a great deal of bulk. I have carried 19/23s for a number of years, and because of my build and manner of dress, prefer the 9c to the 19/23 when I need to conceal a handgun. I have medium sized hands, so the lack of pinky support doesn't necessarily bother me when carrying the 9c with the flat base plate (I learned with G26/27 that the gap between the edge of the grip and the extended base plate pinched my pinky during cycling/recoil). I like the 9c's factory finger rest base plate, but ace no problem when using a 17 round magazine in the gun without an adapter. Unlike Glocks, the 9c doesn't seem prone to shooter-induced feeding problems caused when "torquing" on the extending full size magazine protruding from the grip.

I am not a proponent or the one-pistol-fits-all train of thought. For years, Glock pistols probably came closer than any to fitting a wider range of shooters, but for those with really small hands, the M&P is the clear winner between the two. In terms of ergonomics. I prefer the M&P, but again, it's a matter of personal preference. With factory night sights, the M&P's are better than the ones Glock calls their own, but again, it is a matter of preference. My two M&P 9s, as well as my 26 currently wear Trijicon HDs. Glock magazines are generally going to cost you less than M&Ps. There are still more holster options for the Glock based on its popularity, but if you shop for gun leather on-line, that should not be a problem.

If you're looking for a concealed carry pistol in a non law enforcement setting, a G43 or a Shield would be a better choice as they're much easier to keep concealed. For an all-round pistol for carry, home defense, and even weekend competition, a G19 would fit the bill nicely. Nevertheless, the 9c is a nice pistol and has its own virtues. For what it's worth, the prices you quoted were pretty decent.

Well said.

I sometimes miss my 9C. Only four rounds less than the 19 and just a hair smaller on both ends. These days even a quarter inch can make a big difference in concealment. When I could dress around it I used a full size magazine with Xgrip adapter. Best adapter made IMO. If I see a used 9C at a decent price I would buy it.

These days I carry the 19 or a newly acquired G43. The 43 is so small and light I don't even know it's there.

I lean toward Glock for one primary reason. My eye sight. I upgrade the sights on all my carry guns to Ameriglo sights. A good friend that owns a LGS can change the sights in a matter of minutes. Changing sights on an M&P is more difficult and takes longer.

Knowing what I know after having owned both would be to buy both. :eek:
 
My perfect carry piece would be a 9C lower with a Shield upper.

Or a G26 lower with a G43 upper.

I've emailed both with the idea.
 
The 19's are the most accurate gun I have ever owned, and I have had a lot of guns. Get the 19.
The Glock 19 is the most accurate gun you've ever owned? You may have owned a bunch of guns, but not good ones if the 19 is the best you've owned.

Amend that to say it's the gun you shoot best out of all those you've owned and it makes more sense.
 
I was a Glock fan boy, never did like the Gen3 finger grooves.
They don't line up with big fingers/hands.

After 20 years of carrying a Glock 23 (same as G19) I switched
from .40 to 9mm and decided on a platform change as well.

After 10 years of ignoring the M&P line I handled a M&P9 FS
in my local gun store, ergonomics are perfect for my large hands
and conceals just as easy as the G23 for me.

Triggers are easy to change, grip shape/angle, not so much.
And the Smith is a good looking pistol compared to the Block
 
I've handled both and determined FOR ME the preference is m&p. The glock seemed to square in the grip feel for MY liking. Ymmv.

Sent from my SM-T817V using Tapatalk
 
About 2 years ago, I was deciding between the two as well. Years ago I had a G23, but I didn't shoot it well. I have a FS M&P9 that I like, but my wife has taken it for IDPA. Interestingly I shoot the G30 pretty well.

I initially was leaning toward the G19, but found the grip & trigger on the 9c better for my use than the G19. Specifically, the 9c was a more natural grip for me (with the pinky extension on the mag) and the trigger was more crisp than the G19 which was spongier. Lastly, the price for the 9c was far less than the G19 at the time (military pricing).

I carry the 9c frequently, compete with it in IDPA. Am very pleased with this gun.

But guns are like shoes- what fits me may not fit you nor your life style or sense of safety.

Either can serve you well- you can't go wrong with either. Figure out what fits you best for your needs, get it and don't look back
 
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