M&P9L CORE Frustrations

[SCO19]

Have a 2014 M&P9L CORE.

I live in Europe so it's much harder here to test gun's and ammo. I bought the CORE because I learnt to shoot on the M&P22 so it was a natural progression.

At the range we only have Sellier & Bellot 115g, I've put 700 rounds through the CORE and although I get groups (8m / 15m / 25m) it wasn't as good as I expected it to be. The trigger was also a surprise (not in a good way) coming from the M&P22.

Anyway, today I was shooting steel targets, that can be knocked over. From 10m to 20m. 7 targets to knock down, magazine loaded with 14, so 2 shots per target.

I was useless, probably knocked over 2 targets. Again and again I tried sometimes I would get 4 or 5, but never a clean round. I was starting to think about taking up golf when my friend said I should try the 'club gun'.

That's a CZ which has about 10,000 rounds through it, never cleaned and dropped on a regular basis. The trigger was so light compared to the CORE my first shot scared me! Second shot high, but that gave me an idea of where the aim point was, then from shot 3 onwards cleared all the targets like a pro.

Thinking it was luck, I tried again, same, all targets down first shot.

Before I go and buy a CZ SP01-Shadow, what do you think could be the reasons for this?

CZ is all steel so I guess less recoil?
CORE doesn't like 115g bullets?

Stick with the CORE and try and master the gun?

Not sure... baffled by the whole thing.

 

[Bkreutz]

Have a 2014 M&P9L CORE.

I live in Europe so it's much harder here to test gun's and ammo. I bought the CORE because I learnt to shoot on the M&P22 so it was a natural progression.

At the range we only have Sellier & Bellot 115g, I've put 700 rounds through the CORE and although I get groups (8m / 15m / 25m) it wasn't as good as I expected it to be. The trigger was also a surprise (not in a good way) coming from the M&P22.

Anyway, today I was shooting steel targets, that can be knocked over. From 10m to 20m. 7 targets to knock down, magazine loaded with 14, so 2 shots per target.

I was useless, probably knocked over 2 targets. Again and again I tried sometimes I would get 4 or 5, but never a clean round. I was starting to think about taking up golf when my friend said I should try the 'club gun'.

That's a CZ which has about 10,000 rounds through it, never cleaned and dropped on a regular basis. The trigger was so light compared to the CORE my first shot scared me! Second shot high, but that gave me an idea of where the aim point was, then from shot 3 onwards cleared all the targets like a pro.

Thinking it was luck, I tried again, same, all targets down first shot.

Before I go and buy a CZ SP01-Shadow, what do you think could be the reasons for this?

CZ is all steel so I guess less recoil?
CORE doesn't like 115g bullets?

Stick with the CORE and try and master the gun?

Not sure... baffled by the whole thing.

I suspect a number of things that contribute to your situation.

1. The number of rounds, like you said, the CZ had 10,000 rounds through it and the Core has 700, pistols get smoother as the round count goes up. My Core has 70,000 rounds through it.

2. The trigger is a weak point on the M&P, it was one of the first things I changed on my competition Core. I went with the Apex FSS and trigger.

3. Bullet weight, the 1:10 rifling in the Core is more friendly to heavier bullets. I've changed the barrel to a KKM 1:18 and shoot 124gr bullets. My stock barrel is better with 147gr bullets.

I don't know what the availability of aftermarket triggers in Europe (they may be restricted items), but I think your pistol would benefit by putting more rounds through it and trying a heavier bullet. It sounds like you are shooting what we call bullseye or target shooting. The M&P wouldn't be at the top of my list for that. I'm sure the CZ is a better choice for that. I use the M&P for action pistol so speed is as important as accuracy. (accuracy is important, but the target area is bigger). Hope this helps.

 

[icelander]

I have a CORE 9L also. When I'm shooting for accuracy the trigger is a handicap. When shooting for speed it doesn't seem to make as much difference. Technique probably comes into play. Also the sights have a wide gap for the width of the front sight. This also makes for less accuracy but easier acquisition at speed? Finally, it is not a target pistol, but plenty accurate for what it is designed to do. Keep shooting it, the trigger will get better and you will get more comfortable with it.

All that said, if I want to shoot really fast, I use my 945. It seems like bowling pins fall off the table at the sight of it. Great trigger and great sights do make a difference!

 

[Motorsporting]

I've never had a problem hitting the target with my CORE. I've competed with it in IDPA and it more than successfully completed an advanced pistol class (1000 rounds and "rough" handling). Have you tried letting others, maybe the range master, shoot your pistol? Are the sights correct? Have you tried different ammo? The CORE trigger is pretty nice, compared to other polymer pistols, IMHO.

 

[walkin' trails]

Dry fire will improve both the trigger and your mastery of it. If there are any firearms trainers in your area, consider signing up for classes they offer. I have no experience with the CZ, but it's trigger, having a single action mode, will have better characteristics than a poly double only. The M&P trigger will not be the same, but it can still be mastered.

 

[Venenoindy]

SP01 vs CORE is not apples to apples comparacion, the CZ is a heavier handgun and in my opinion much more forgiving platform (still very accurate platform). Any polymer frame handgun will be harder to shoot well but you can still manage to shoot well with practice, CZ's with trigger work done some shooters say its like cheating because they are in some way easier to shoot well and I tend to agree. As far as combat accuracy I have had no problems with both of my Pro (4.25 and 5"), if the CORE is a new platform for you it may take you a bit before getting used to it.

 

[marathonrunner]

core

I would venture to say if you really want a gun out of the box that will basically outshoot everything, get the Walther ppq. that has the sweetest trigger. the heckler and kock would be a close second or if not that, a glock with a trigger job. my m*p's are now good shooters ever since I changed triggers. the stock trigger are awful

 

[ScottN]

Many people shoot the Pro models low. I suggest you shoot it from a rest and see where you're at on a target. I was low on the Pro I used to own so I switched to a .160 height front sight (which is the stock height for the standard M&P) and that brought me back on target.

After you shoot it from a rest, then go to the web site below and use the formula to figure out what height you need for the front sight.

www.dawsonprecision.com SIGHTS FRONT Category

As for the trigger, I was a bit disappointed in the Pro as well. It will get better the more you shoot it, or Apex makes excellent trigger packages. The Duty/Carry package will give you a great 5 pound trigger. The Competition package will do the same but results in 3-4 pound trigger.

 

[Wyatt p. Tato]

I would advise you trade the M&P for a CZ. If you can afford it. You will continue to want it. Life is too short, you will enjoy the CZ.

 

[AGoyette]

First off, I don't think it is fair to compare a 22 with a 9mm. The 9mm actually has some recoil compared to the 22. Likewise it is not fair to compare a new gun with a well broken in gun.
From reading what you posted, I would saw that your issue is two fold. First, you need to get used to your gun. I would shoot at paper starting pretty close (like 7 ft) and see where your gun hits. I would also practice trigger control. Try different parts of your trigger finger on the trigger. Some guns like just the tip of your trigger finger versus others that like up to the first knuckle, each gun is different.
The second part lies with your trigger. I find the the stock trigger is not all that great, even with the Pro's and CORE's. I am not a fan of the physical trigger itself. It felt thin to me. All of our M&P's have Apex parts in them. In our 9c's I put the Apex duty/carry kit in (DCAEK) and added the polymer trigger. I left in the stock trigger return spring. That gave me a nice 4 poundish trigged that is very smooth. In our 5 inch Pro's and CORE, I put in the Apex FSS kit, again leaving the stock trigger return spring in. The triggers are all around 2.5-3 lbs. and have next to zero pre-travel and no over travel.
Shooting steel plates is all about accuracy, so if you are jerking the trigger due to a cruddy heavy trigger (which a lot of people do) that would explain why your shots are off. In guns the more you "shoot" it (dry firing counts as shooting) the better the trigger gets, thus why you did better with the CZ.
Hope this helps.

 

[SCO19]

Thank you for all the replies. I managed to get some 124g ammo which has improved the situation. But really not getting on with the trigger.

Is this the kit I need to order?

https://apextactical.com/store/product-list.php?pg1-cid11.html

 

[Bkreutz]

Thank you for all the replies. I managed to get some 124g ammo which has improved the situation. But really not getting on with the trigger.

Is this the kit I need to order?

https://apextactical.com/store/product-list.php?pg1-cid11.html

Which kit are you referring to? That link goes to their main page. I prefer the Forward Set Sear and Polymer trigger kit. I put it in using the stock S&W trigger return spring for a 4.5# trigger.

 

[AGoyette]

I am with Bkreutz. If this is not to be a carry gun, then I too would go with the FSS kit with the polymer trigger and leave in the trigger return spring. I find this to be the perfect setup though I find my trigger pull weights to be less than Bkreutz. I find our trigger pulls to be more like 3 lbs. on our 5" Pro's.

 

[SCO19]

Bit of an issue, apex won't ship to Spain and I don't know of any companies here that stock it.

 

[Bkreutz]

Bit of an issue, apex won't ship to Spain and I don't know of any companies here that stock it.

If you can't get an Apex kit in Spain you might try improving your trigger using this as a guide. S&W M&P Trigger Job

 

[SCO19]

2,000 rounds and it appears the issue is ammo related. Hard to test as getting different brands here isn't easy.

This is the ammo the range sells: Magtech/CBC - 9MM Luger 124 Grain Full Metal Jacket MagTech :: View Product

Going for the 2 black dots at 9 yards

Friend at the range said the ammo was too small for the barrel. He offered to make me some ammo (he has been making his own bullets for 40 years) so I thought why not.

Here we are again at 9 yards using the homegrown ammo

Then his homegrown vs the magtech

And at 27 yards

I doubt he wants to make me ammo indefinitely, so what ammo do you use for the range?
Maybe I can find a way of ordering it in here.

 

[hardluk1]

S&B ammo gets used here but not one of the lines most people look to use. Hard to beat a good hand load. How heavy was these hand loads. 124gr or 147gr.
I stumbled into some of what I though was comparable to the s&b from RWS . Copper coats over soft steel over lead core. Shoots well enough but is sort of a last resort ammo. Its not in the same class as there . 22lr ammo.

Our m&p core is more of a defense pistol than match and I load a 124gr from bayou bullet with a hi-tec coating on it for practice . But have run some 150gr . 9mm 150 Gr. SWC - 1000 Ct. - Bayou Bullets
These shoot well .

Maybe a good time to start loading too. Have your shooting friend help get out set up and get the connections in your for needed supplies.

Can you order from Midway UK ?

Hows that trigger breaking in. Getting smoother ?

 

[Jpw0311]

I have a core and hated the trigger. Swapped it out for the apex fss aluminum kit. That made a world of difference. I'm still adjusting to the high iron sights while I save up for a red dot. The gun is very accurate.

 

[Bkreutz]

Your experience shows the value of handloading your own ammunition. Bullet weight is only a part of a successful load. one one problem with "store bought" ammo is that you never know what powder and how much is used. When I'm working up a load I make a whole range of different powder amounts and then decide at the range which one works the best for me. There is no formula to determine which load will work the best in an individual pistol. The proof is in the shooting (as you've already seen). If you want accuracy, there really is no other way except loading your own.

 

[kruffe]

My Pro prefers 147 grain by far...