Missouri Bullets Hi-Tek coating

[BLUEDOT37]

I just received the box of .45 Colt 255gr Keith SWC bullets with Hi-Tek coating that I ordered, to give them a try. These are the first coated bullets I've gotten to see/handle & have a question.

All the pictures I've seen here look like the coating is fairly thick. I know there are a couple types of coating so their's is likely different, but it's very thin. I'd almost call it a heavy frosting, verses a coat. You can easily scratch thru it down to the lead. I did seat & roll crimp one in a case & then pulled it with a kinetic puller & it looked fine without any damage to the coating though.

I plan to load & shoot them next week to see how they perform but wanted to see if any other users could comment on the Hi-Tek coating thickness of the bullets they've received.

PS: They shipped quickly & did a great job packing the bullets in the carton so the 45 Colt brass wouldn't get damaged by them.

.

 

[muddocktor]

I'll be looking forward to your thoughts on them, BD37. I've been loading plated bullets for a while now, but haven't tried any Hi Tek coated bullets yet. And I was looking at Missouri Bullets as I live in Louisiana and don't want to buy from Bayou Bullets because I would have to pay shipping + tax.

 

[dhom]

The info I just got from talking to Missouri Bullets on that Hi Tek coating is that they will shoot approx. 200 fps faster than regular cast of the same weight with the same loads, also smoke less, and no lead fouling. I ordered some and they have not arrived yet. I think this is a heck of a claim and can't wait to see the results.

 

[rwsmith]

I've decided that coatings...

I've decided that coatings are the greatest thing since sliced bread. The question now is, WHICH coating. Some look candy coated, some have a very thin coating with a little hint of color. (I've got some green Bayou bullets to try). Which one is the best? Do they smoke? Can you push to high velocities? Do they cause fouling??

 

[JBnTx]

I've been using the Missouri Bullet Co's Hi-Tek coated bullets in 9mm and 45acp with fantastic results.

They're a lot cleaner to handle than regular lubed cast bullets and there's no leading!

But I too have noticed the "thinness" of the Hi-Tek coating on some of the bullets. You can see the lead shining through.

As long as the Hi-Tek coating is on the driving part of the bullet that touches the bore, I guess it's OK?

Hi-Tek is the future of cast bullets. They're all I'll buy from now on.

I have to shoot up over 2000 lubed bullets so I can try them in 44 special, 44 magnum and 45 Colt.

..

 

[Moonman]

HI-TEK is thinner coating than projectiles that are "POWDER COATED".
Some experimenters are running rifle loads to 2500 FPS.

HI-TEK has different CATALYSTS available to the self-coaters.

HI-TEK is NEW to many COMMERCIAL CASTERS that are switching
to it over older conventional WAXY LUBES.

LOW/NO SMOKE, NO LEADING, CLEAN HAND AND DIES, IT COMPLETELY
ENCAPSULATES THE LEAD. The coating IS THE LUBE.

IF YOU SMELL "BURNT ELECTRICAL SMELL" when shooting,
The coating was IMPROPERLY CURED, either baked too short
of a time or too low of a temperature.

The Catalysts ARE TIME & TEMPERATURE sensitive in order
for the catalyst to "GO OFF".

Some new to the HI-TEK coating process may not have worked
all the KINKS OUT OF THEIR MANUFACTURING PROCESS.

YOU should not just be able to scratch off the coating either.

There is about a 228 page thread on HI-TEK over at THE CAST BOOLITS SITE.

Was developed in Australia 20 years ago, RELATIVELY NEW TO USA SHOOTERS.

 

[venomballistics]

IF YOU SMELL "BURNT ELECTRICAL SMELL" when shooting,
The coating was IMPROPERLY CURED, either baked too short
of a time or too low of a temperature.

The Catalysts ARE TIME & TEMPERATURE sensitive in order
for the catalyst to "GO OFF".

If I had to guess, here in lies the core issue to problems some have complained about.
When long on orders and short on time .. it's easy to short cycle the bake of an over loaded oven to make deadlines.

some commercial casters get it, others might be a little slow on the uptake.

 

[Moonman]

Hey Venom, YEP!

Too many orders, not enough time, some have done it,
I'm not going to mention names but I hope they've improved their
processes along the line.

The NEW dry powder mixes are hitting the USA now and they
have even better catalysts.

The USA Marketplace is driving the new developement with
catalysts and DIFFERENT COLORS so commercial casters can
produce different colors from each other.

 

[jwalts27]

I just ordered some for 357. not in yet.
I too have read in several forums that some of the HI TEK bullets absolutely wreak when being shot.

 

[Moonman]

HI-TEK projectiles are great when PROPERLY PREPARED AND PROCESSED.

Misapplied OR UNDER-PROCESSED and a BURNT ELECTRICAL SMELLS MAY BE PRODUCED,

CHIPPING OF THE COATING MAY OCCUR, OR OUTRIGHT FAILURE OF IT.


HI-TEK requires a bit of an effort to get the process producing WITH YOUR EQUIPMENT.

Oven don't output at a Dial Temp, or have HOT and COLD areas.


Many VARIABLES have to be accounted for including IMPROPER DRYING TIMES before baking,

along with UNSEEN moisture under the coating that can cause failures.

 

[venomballistics]

I just ordered some for 357. not in yet.
I too have read in several forums that some of the HI TEK bullets absolutely wreak when being shot.

that, I believe, to be one of the short bake cycle results.
HT and powder coating are both brilliant when done properly....
I've yet to do either improperly, but I do see the potential.

 

[dannyabear]

I'll be looking forward to your thoughts on them, BD37. I've been loading plated bullets for a while now, but haven't tried any Hi Tek coated bullets yet. And I was looking at Missouri Bullets as I live in Louisiana and don't want to buy from Bayou Bullets because I would have to pay shipping + tax.

Take a ride to Bayou Bullets in Lutcher, La, and pick them up in person, Donnie is a great guy to do business with.

 

[Moonman]

Gateway Bullets, SNS Casting, LNL Casting, Missouri Bullets, Black Bullets International recently converted to HI-TEK, along with Bayou Bullets are some of the Commercial Casters using the HI-TEK process.

More commercial casters are switching to this LUBE solution over the old WAXY and Messy Lubes.

HI-TEK just has too many benefits not to switch over, one being
to completely encapsulate the lead,

a requirement of some indoor ranges.

 

[BLUEDOT37]

But I too have noticed the "thinness" of the Hi-Tek coating on some of the bullets. You can see the lead shining through.

As long as the Hi-Tek coating is on the driving part of the bullet that touches the bore, I guess it's OK?

.

The thinness is noticeable but it really doesn't show up in the picture. The thinest surface seems to be the bearing surface. The crimp groove, grease groove & nose are coated the heaviest.


.

YOU should not just be able to scratch off the coating either.

CHIPPING OF THE COATING MAY OCCUR, OR OUTRIGHT FAILURE OF IT.

.
It doesn't take much effort to scratch it down to the lead, especially on the thin bearing surface. Definitely not bonded, if it's supposed to be. While loading some up today, I noticed a few of the bullets have chips in the coating, down to the lead. Otherwise, the majority looked okay.

.
.

I loaded up 65 bullets using 5 different powders (I4227, 2400, Bluedot, Longshot & Unique) all around 1050-1125fps. Four of them are with powder weights that previously leaded with RNFP greased BHN-15 bullets that I'm retrying as a test & the one that did not lead before.

I'm optimistic they'll do fine. I'll let you know in a few days when I get to try them.

.

 

[venomballistics]

I've decided that coatings are the greatest thing since sliced bread. The question now is, WHICH coating. Some look candy coated, some have a very thin coating with a little hint of color. (I've got some green Bayou bullets to try). Which one is the best? Do they smoke? Can you push to high velocities? Do they cause fouling??

Good set of questions
there's a sea of coatings and they're not entirely equal.
I am very confident that you will never achieve a velocity from a pistol, that will break the back of any of the coatings. The margins don't show till you're gunning for glory in a rifle.
Do they smoke .... no, they are too young to buy cigarettes.
Seriously though, yes, there is some smoke, particularly in the upper range of velocity. In no case is it as pronounced as traditional lube.

High velocity? ... yes, my personal best so far is a tickle north of 2700 fps.

Fouling ....
logic dictates that it must transfer to the bore. In nearly every case, I find no trace. Either it blends in with the powder fouling, where you can't tell what your looking at, or it gets incinerated by the firing cycle.
The few times i have had visible fouling, it's been a black streak, easily removed by the usual solvents.

 

[Moonman]

BLUEDOT37,

YES, it is supposed to be bonded to the lead, so your
process or procedure or that of your commercial supplier
was is incorrect.

!) TEMP Baked at was too low. (Catalyst did not fully go off)
2) Not baked long enough. (Same reason as #1).
3) Needs baked at 400F (200C) for 10/12 minutes, longer if heavier projectiles.
4) DO NOT SIZE BEFORE COATING, IT BURNISHES THE LEADS SURFACE AND CAUSES LESS ADHESION.

5) MUST BE DRY BEFORE BAKING, AND NOT JUST TO THE TOUCH
AS MOISTURE UNDER THE COATING WILL CAUSE IT TO FAIL
6) Make sure of oven temps as ovens vary greatly in their temps.

7) First coat should be applied VERY THINLY for best adhesion of following coats.
8) Total coats of 2, sometimes 3.
9) COMMERCIAL CASTERS coat for "EYE APPEAL" to the consumer,
if the projectile has lube grooves, they try to coat them too,
this is NOT NECESSARY, so home coaters can forget that.

10) Some commercial Casters may be trying to HEAVILY COAT,
and this can lead to failures as well.
11) Some Commercial Casters NEW AT THIS, may be trying to
speed things up to LOWER THEIR PRODUCTION COSTS,
and this is causing adverse product reactions or failures.

12) There is a LEARNING CURVE to this process AND YOUR CHOSEN EQUIPMENT'S OPERATING TEMPS.

13) Good Luck with your choices, applied and cured CORRECTLY, this coating is FABULOUS, and has a 20 Year
track record in Australia where it was and continues to be developed. This coating material and process is just somewhat NEW TO THE USA. Practice makes perfect.

NOTE!!!! Bad or WATER CONTAMINATED ACETONE or improper
Ratio mixing with catalyst can lead to the coatings failure.

 

[shocker]

Counterpoint from Dardas Bullets FWIW

There is currently a fad that has developed concerning the use of powder coatings to coat cast bullets for whatever reasons. Powder coatings are extremely hard and contain fine abrasive material. The main ingredient of powder coatings is Barium Sulfate. It is a fine white powder that has the same hardness as chalk and synthetic aluminum oxide. These compounds are excellent fine abrasives especially when high pressures are applied. The melting point of Barium Sulfate is 1580 degrees Centigrade. My point is that Barium Sulfate remains in its original powder form even after the binding polymer has reacted. I would never run this material through any of my barrels unless the intention was to firelap them. If you want to firelap your barrels, then by all means, please do use powder coatings. Or, contact Dave Tubb. He has been offering firelapping kits for quite a long time. The kit will save you a lot of money. We will not be participating in this current fad as we will not be responsible for ruined barrels and trigger groups.

 

[BigChief52]

I have only experimented with Missouri bullets. They have a thin copper colored coating that doesn't seem any harder than the cast alloy bullet. You can scrape it off with a steel edge, it doesn't chip off. It is positively not hard. It seems slippery and smooth and I would be surprised if there were particles suspended in the polymer that would be hard enough to lap the steel bore. I can say this much for sure. As a lub, the coating works. After 200 rounds, I have had zero lead fouling a good performance from these bullets. I did have some of the black streaks mentioned earlier, but they cleaned up easily with just a patch and , in my case, Browning bore polish. So far, I'm impressed.

 

[JBnTx]

There is currently a fad that has developed concerning the use of powder coatings to coat cast bullets for whatever reasons... We will not be participating in this current fad as we will not be responsible for ruined barrels and trigger groups.

Please tell us more about this?

Australia has been using this type coating for 20 years. If there was a problem, don't you think they'd have discovered it by now?

 

[Moonman]

Competitive shooters in AUSTRALIA have been shooting millions of rounds for 20 years now.

We're talking about HI-TEK coatings NOT WHAT IS COMMONLY REFERRED TO AS "POWDER COATING" such as you hear about using Harbor Freight
Electrostatic gun to apply and Harbor Freight powders.

MR Dardas runs a CONVENTIONAL lead bullet casting company, so his comments can be understood,his business is at risk.

Many of Mr Dardas' competitors are switching to HI-TEK (not powder coating per say) even though the newest HI-TEK formulas arriving in the USA have the color and catalyst combined into a powdered form. This eliminates one of the RATIO ERRORS commonly made by home caster/coaters. Just mix 20 GRAMS and 100ml of ACETONE and shake/shake/shake and proceed to tumble lube your projectiles then bake.

I personally use 7 1/2 ml of solution per coating per 6 pounds of projectiles, dry overnight than bake and repeat again.

You do an ACETONE "WIPE TEST" and a "SMASH TEST" on each batch
to check for ADHESION and that YOUR PROCESS is not out of control.

Easiest way is to just ORDER SOME from a commercial caster using using the HI-TEK process, More are converting over to it all the time now.

Action Pistol/Cowboy shooters love the stuff due to the LOW/NO SMOKE, they see the targets better.

HI-TEK AND WHAT IS REFERRED TO IN GENERAL AS "POWDER COATING" ARE APPLES AND ORANGES, THEY ARE NOT THE SAME THING.