Model 10 Dovetail Front Sight

[MonroeT]

Over the last year I have been playing hobby gunsmith re-barreling a few J&G gunsmith specials. I have enhanced my skills and developed a real appreciation for the professionals who do this for a living.

Using hand tools I have been able to chop the barrels to 3", recrown, re-set B/C gaps and recontour the top of the barrels to better match ther top strap of the J&G snubbies. Lots of draw filing and abrasives, and a lot of fun.

I have, however, met my match in cutting front sight dovetails by hand. It looks so easy on youtube, but my end results are functional, not pretty. I'll blame it on old eyes.

I have 3 to 5 barrels I need to get slotted for front sights, and I need the name of a gunsmith who can and will do the work. I can locate all the famous ones myself, but they are all too busy to take on such a small projects and the wait is too long. The last I sent off took over a year to get about an hours worth of milling done just to widen the rear sight channel on a Pietta SAA.

Do any of you know of a 'smith who has done this kind of work for you ( dovetail cut on a round revolver barrel) recently whose work you have been satisfied with? I'd like to be able to send barrels and sights off in the mail and get them back within a couple of months.

Thanks for any help you can give.

 

[roninsan]

I'm about to send off a model 10 to Throne Arms for that, but I've not used them in the past. I got his info from an article on The Revolver Guy .com. His turn around is supposed to be pretty quick. I'll post before and after pics here (if I can figure that out) when I get it back if you can wait.

 

[stanmerrell]

I'm in the same situation and recommend Throne Arms, but they tell me they need the whole gun to do it right.

 

[ironhead7544]

You could silver solder on a rifle type front ramp. I did this on a fixed sight N-frame years ago. Worked nicely. The ramp already had a dovetail. I used a Williams Shorty Ramp.

The revolver had been in a leather holster for many years and the front sight was just a nub of rust. I like the idea of being able to adjust windage. Then you can cut the front sight height for your preferred load.

 

[MonroeT]

roninsan, let me know how this works out. I sure would like to avoid the high shipping costs for the whole gun. I think my FFL could ship and use regular mail. Does anyone know the facts on shipping between FFL's?

 

[Zipdog]

Buy the correct dovetail cutter from Brownells. Take to a machine shop that will talk to you. Job done. You don't need a gunsmith.

 

[roninsan]

I'll keep you posted, I was going to ship it last week but life got in the way. Should be sending out Friday, but not sure what his turn around is so it may be a few weeks before I get it back.
As to shipping, my situation dictates I use whoever is closest. You can use an FFL to FFL shipping, but they're likely going to use the same method you would.
UPS will ship long guns via ground transport. Handguns must go overnight, which is why it's expensive.
Fedex will ship also but in my area, you have to go to a central office, which for me is like a 70 mile trip. UPS is only 40 miles, and diesel is 4.69 near me so....
Also, the USPS will ship firearms, but not from your local office, only from the central office which for me is like Fedex, 70 miles away. Add the cost of fuel and I might as well overnight from UPS.
As to the "tools from Brownells" suggestion. Couple years ago I went to a local machine shop looking to get some milling done. I don't know if they were contacted by ATF, or what but the guy said "No way" when he saw it was a firearm part. "I don't have an FFL so I can't work on no gun stuff." Pretty much told me someone from ATF had a chat with the guy.
If you don't have a mill, you could try using a drill press and an end mill bit. I've done it using a two-axis vice, but it's a pain. Drill presses were not designed to take lateral loads, so the bit tends to flex and mill at an angle. Not good for a precision application like a front sight install. I suppose it could be done though. I've considered purchasing a cheap endmill from Harbor Freight, at least it would mill correctly so your front sight would sit straight.

 

[roninsan]

The M10 shipped Thursday! Throne Arms should have it Monday, then the waiting begins....
I'm using a RB 10-9 frame, and I picked up a NOS 4" .38 barrel. I also scrounged all the other parts, to use the 4" barrel. I asked Lewis to shorten the barrel to 3", recrown, and dovetail a front sight. I also asked for a trigger tune, and a bead blast reblue. Since this is basically my "farm gun", like a truck gun but I carry when I'm working on the farm, cutting hay, etc., and did not want to put alot of money into it. I elected not to slab side the barrel, mostly because this thing is probably going to get dinged up so no point in getting it really pretty. I also figure who ever inherits this thing when I'm gone, if they sell it, I want the buyer to know it's not an original 3" gun, so I didn't ask for the factory markings to be removed. I really don't care if some of the engraving is whacked off or not, it's a working gun.
Maybe when I do my 3" 66 conversion, I'll get a little fancier. I'd love to have a 3" 65 but I always get way outbid early on, and I haven't seen one in a gun store since about 1980.
Anyway when I get it back I'll give my thoughts and maybe I can get pics up somewhere for ya'll to look at.

 

[oldbrownhat]

Years ago I got the specially-modified dovetail file from Brownells (a Grobet parallel-side triangular file with one side ground safe) and did a couple of old rifles to "get my hand in." Turned out fairly well but I don't think I'd risk dovetailing my old Model 10. Much better to get it done right the first time than to get it fixed later! (ie "Discretion is the better part of valor")

What I did manage to do with mine was to widen the existing narrow front sight, which I detailed here: Shade tree gunsmithing a Model 1o front sight.

We'll look forward to pics of your front sight job when you get it back

 

[roninsan]

That turned out nice! While I've done some minor stuff, dovetailing a front sight was not something I would try. Yours turned out nice though.

 

[roninsan]

Just an update on my 3" M10 project, since I know some of you got the J&G surplus frames like I did. After shipping the frame and parts to Throne Arms, I got an email from Lewis Throne and called him to discuss the project. He's a character!! But had a great call with him, and he's going to have the thing ready by the end of April. Now, he said I could have it back by the end of March, but if I wanted him to reblue it, it would be an additional cost. If I didn't mind waiting, he would send it to the gunsmithing school there in Colorado, and they would refinish it for free! (Uh, hell yeah, trying to do this on the cheap) He said they'll parkerize it first, then hot blue it, and he says it gives the gun a really nice looking finish. We'll see. Oh and I forgot to send him a front sight, so that had to be sourced and sent out. Looks like it'll be longer turn around for the refinish, but that compares pretty well with the 12-18 months other smiths were quoting me! I have before and will take after pics, but since I'm not a paying member I'll have to send them to someone if they want to see them. Just shoot me a PM and I'll send them to you.

 

[oldbrownhat]

Here's roninsan's Model 10 before its "ascent to the Throne"

 

[roninsan]

Thanks for posting the pics! Really looking forward to getting it back and see how it turned out. Throne Arms has very reasonable prices and turn around time, and his work looks really good. I hope I can give him first hand praises, I have other projects in mind!

 

[roninsan]

"Ascent to the Throne" LMAO. I have to send that to Lewis...

 

[roninsan]

Update!!! SO the M10 project is done! Lewis at Throne Arms contacted me and told me it was back in his hands, but he found an issue with the timing. He said he was going to make sure it was right, test fire it, and if all was well he would ship it Monday the 2nd. I've already sent some pics to oldbrownhat who was nice enough to offer to post them for me, he's going to put them up when I can send him some more next week. You may notice a slight change in my avatar tho.....
Next up: project M66

 

[stanmerrell]

Thanks, really look forward to seeing this.

 

[oldbrownhat]

Model 10 back from Throne

Chris has the Model 10 back and is hoping to get out to the range this weekend so we can have a range report. In the meantime, here's a couple of pics:

In the white, with new barrel:

And the finished product:

That's some very nice work indeed!

 

[roninsan]

Thanks for posting the pics Stuart, it really is a nice piece of work. Lewis was really easy to work with, and a nice guy to chat with. His work speaks for itself, and I can highly recommend him to anyone wanting similar work. I am planning a 3" 66 conversion very soon, and will let him really do a nice carry gun. I hope to post pics of that and a range report as well.
I've been ill all week, but will do my best to put a few rounds through the M10 and see how she does. I'll take some pics of the target since I really want to know how it shoots as far as the sights are concerned. This will be my EDC on the farm so it needs to be a shooter. And yes, I'm going to do something with those grips! I have another pair in better shape that may be paired up with a grip adapter for now. The 66 is going to get bone grips from someone, so maybe I'll put the grips from that on the 10.
I got the inspiration for this from guys on here showing off their revolvers, and from Revolverguy.com. What a fun project this was!
Stay tuned!

 

[mscampbell2734]

Did Throne mention what front sight cut he used? Standard Novak 1911 or something else?

 

[roninsan]

I ordered the front sight from Novak, and I got the standard dovetail they make. I just got the front sight height from Lewis, found the sight closest to that height and order the tritium standard dot.
I'm going to do something similar with Project 660, I got the C&S fixed rear, and ordered the tritium front sight from Novak, using the S&W sight height as my measurement. Hopefully it will be POA/POI.
The M10 is shooting a little high left, but I've not tried to adjust it yet. Once I get the grips dialed in, then I'll adjust for zero.
Lweis does some damn fine machine work, and honestly want the customer to be totally happy with the product he turns out. I am very happy with the job he did on my M10. He offered to remove import marks and unit marks, but cosmetics were not something I was concerned about with this project so he left them. Actually I kinda like the markings, adds to the history of the piece. I like the way it shot too, trigger was super smooth and light. Once I get the sight dialed in it will be on my hip if I walk out the door.