Model 41 and CCI stnd velocity ammo

[jerrypoller]

I have a Model 41 which cycles Federal Auto Match (1200 fps) and Armscor Precision (???? fps) flawlessly - both bullets are listed as standard velocity. I can't get reliable cycling of CCI Standard Velocity (1070 fps) rounds. I bought my 41 used and assume it has a factory spring. Is there a spring replacement or other modification to the original setup that anyone can recommend so CCI standard velocity ammo will cycle reliably? I've heard that the Model 41 was designed around CCI SV ammo, but can't make it work for me. Thanks.

 

[gmiller0737]

Did you buy the 41 new? Possibly a previous owner installed a heavier recoil spring? I would start with a new O.E. S&W Spring,When I purchased My 41 used before I even shot it I called S&W to order a new spring so I didn't have to worry about how many rounds were on it & S&W sent Me a new spring Free!

 

[vario]

I was having the same problems on my used 41. Got every spring from Brownells, replaced them all, and all problems went away. It was a cheap fix.

 

[jstanfield103]

I also ordered all new springs from Brownells. Not that I needed them but just the fact I wanted to tune up my 1960 model 41. You should not shoot high velocity ammo through you're 41. The previous owner probably did replace the spring so he could shoot the highier more cheaper bulk high velocity stuff.
Good Luck.

 

[jerrypoller]

I also ordered all new springs from Brownells. Not that I needed them but just the fact I wanted to tune up my 1960 model 41. You should not shoot high velocity ammo through you're 41. The previous owner probably did replace the spring so he could shoot the highier more cheaper bulk high velocity stuff.
Good Luck.

What weight springs did you order. I believe 7.5 lb is the factory spring, but they are also available down to 6 lb and up to 8 lb.

 

[Barrie]

I also have the same problem with my 1959 M41 which will not shoot the 36gr ammo without acting up. Even the good Federal in 36gr is a problem so my rifles get it all. When I use the CCI 40gr ammo it works just great in this gun. I did buy it used a month ago now. My M46 does the same thing as well but cycles extremely well on the 40gr ammo. I suspect I should respring both of them.

 

[johnd3]

I use CCI Target SV in both my Mod 41's (both 7")as well as my High Standard Trophy, Ruger Mk III (7"), and my Browning Buckmark Lite (7"). It has always functioned perfectly in these pistols. The only problem I have ever had was with a Sig Mosquito (long since traded off) which is widly known as being difficult.

The CCI SV is 40 gr and 1070 fps. At this speed it remains sub-sonic, thus not experiencing flutter due to passing back down through the sound barrier. Frankly I had gone to it before getting the Mod 41's as I was looking for a fair priced ammo that would deliver consistent results.

I would suggest that checking your springs might be a very good idea.

 

[civil1977]

I've heard that the Model 41 was designed around CCI SV ammo

This is a common belief but it's not true. S&W began design on what was to become the Model 41 in 1941 and it didn't go into production until 1957. CCI didn't start making rimfire ammunition until 1962 and that was with the Mini-Mag.

Don't get me wrong, the Model 41 and CCI SV go together like they were made for each other and that's all I shoot in mine.

 

[jerrypoller]

I would start with a new O.E. S&W Spring,When I purchased My 41 used before I even shot it I called S&W to order a new spring so I didn't have to worry about how many rounds were on it & S&W sent Me a new spring Free!

I just emailed S&W and they're sending me a new recoil spring - thanks for the suggestion.

 

[JoeHatley]

I've heard that the Model 41 was designed around CCI SV ammo

No. S&W has found that the model 41 shoots standard velocity ammo very well, but it's designed to fuction with any standard or high velocity ammo.

At least that's what the S&W customer service rep told me when I called and asked about ammo recomendations.

I've found if you stick with 40 grain bullets the model 41 will run fine no matter what velocity the ammo is.

I second the suggestion you make sure you have fresh factory recoil and mainsprings in place, and then work from there to tailor the recoil spring to your selected ammo, if needed.

Good luck...

 

[eljaydubya]

You didn't mention failure to extract the spent cartridge but I find most of my problems with shooting CCI SV center around a dirty chamber. After a thourough chamber cleaning, it runs great. Jim

 

[jerrypoller]

You didn't mention failure to extract the spent cartridge but I find most of my problems with shooting CCI SV center around a dirty chamber. After a thourough chamber cleaning, it runs great. Jim

Extraction hasn't been a problem, but ejection has - the brass gets turned sideways as the slide tries to return to battery and gets stuck requiring manually clearing it before I can chamber another round. I have not been as conscientious about cleaning my 41 as I should be. I'll take more care and see if it alleviates the problem. Thanks.

 

[jerrypoller]

I second the suggestion you make sure you have fresh factory recoil and mainsprings in place, and then work from there to tailor the recoil spring to your selected ammo, if needed.

Good luck...

I will change the recoil spring which S&W is sending (free of charge - great customer service), but am not familiar with the mainspring. I've looked at a few parts sites, and they don't mention a mainspring (I assume you're referring to the mainspring I'm familiar with in my 1911s) in their inventory. Can you suggest a source? Thanks.

 

[TonyR]

An 18lb 1911 main spring will work fine in a mod 41.

 

[Davidus]

My 41 has been to S&W twice since I bought it two years ago. Ejection problem persisted. I have sent the pistol to Clark for their conversion and for them to straighten out the factory barrel. I'm so tired of embarrassing alibis during matches!

Meanwhile, I use the same CCI SV with my 1967 High Standrd Citation without any trouble. Clean them the same with the same kits.

 

[PaperPatched]

Model 41 Ejection Problem

Davidus,
One of my four M41 barrels did not show a perfectly parallel gap between the barrel and slide. I straightened the barrel extension a hair, but still had some ejection problems. Upon checking the barrel to slide clearance against the other three barrels I noticed that the problem barrel showed a very small gap (tight when checked with a piece of 20 lb. computer paper). I removed the top of the serrations (to about 1/32" wide flats) on the barrel ONLY.
That cured the problem with ejection, and I've gone literally 2 to 3 thousand rounds of CCI standard velocity between failures, and those were failures to feed or failures to fire.
Clark offers optics-only barrels that have the rearward barrel extension completely removed as an aid to more reliable functioning.
There is an article floating about the web about a method of tuning the extractor (Austin Belhert ? - spelling ?). But it looks to be much simpler to try out a new extractor first.
The above might not help in your case, but it worked for this non-gunsmith (Your Mileage My Vary).

 

[Krogen]

I have wrestled with a Model 41 and CCI standard velocity ammo. The first round in a magazine often "fumbled" and sort of dribbled out of the gun on ejection. Sometimes the fired case would go right back into the chamber, other times it would jam sideways. If it ejected, it wasn't an energetic ejection at all. I fooled with new springs and installed a new extractor without real success. What I did find, is that it's essential the recess in the breachface is clean of crud. When crud collects and fills in the corners of the recess, extraction fails. Also, I found that a good soaking of the action with Kroil removed a lot of crud and improved functioning. There seemed to be a lot of drag on the hammer. It's an old gun and it probably had 50 years of gunk in it. I'm not quite brave enough to tear it down all the way; hence the Kroil. Finally, make sure the mainspring has some grease on it where is contacts the grip frame. I use SuperLube there and on the rails. So far (knock on wood) the gun continues to be reliable.

 

[Peter M. Eick]

My pre-A series 41 is very tightly fit and if I use grease on the slide to frame fit point, then cci SV will just barely dribble the rounds out. If I switch to Fed Automatch it will eject more cleanly. With oil on the frame instead of grease CV works fine.

I will comment I was shooting my Beretta 87t and one of my 41s today. Both have the same design for slide and I weighed them. The 87t is 168 grams while the 41 was 192 grams. My 87t is rated for any standard 22 LR ammo yet the 41 I generally fire standard velocity. Either the Beretta has better steel or we are just babying our 41's because the heavier slide should have a lower velocity than the 87t slide.

 

[Bart454]

No problems with my 41 and CCI standard velocity, cycles and shoots great.

 

[kaikane0812]

My 1979 manufacture year 41 handles everything I've ever put thru it. I never discriminate, always buy whatevers on sale. From bulk rems to CCI mini-mags, SV to HV,never have had a FTF, FTE, or FTL. It's been a total joy to own since I bought it new in 1980.