Modern 357 magnum rounds in a 1992 mod 19-6

[Mike SC Hunter]

The vast majority do not crack. My 1983 66 has shot many many magnums since I purchased it new in 83 or 84. I continue to try to get it to crack but no luck so far.

My 66 form the same era (early 1980's) has never cracked either.....BUT my 19 did.

 

[Pisgah]

My question -- since when is a 1992-made revolver not "modern"? Shoot it, let us know if it cracks. (Hint: It won't.)

 

[Darkenfast]

We should also keep in mind that S&W changed the size of the flat on the barrel shank, making it even thinner with the move of the gas ring from the yoke to the cylinder. That was the Model 19-4. When S&W went back to putting the gas ring on the yoke, they continued to use the thinner style barrel. I suspect that there is a greater chance of cracking the forcing cone with the Model 19-4 through 19-8. The 19-9 uses a completely different barrel that has no thin, flat spot.

This. Here's the story from RevolverGuy, with information from the S&W engineer who led the L-frame project.

The Smith & Wesson L-Frame Story – RevolverGuy.Com

 

[rwsmith]

To me....

My question -- since when is a 1992-made revolver not "modern"? Shoot it, let us know if it cracks. (Hint: It won't.)

Anything past 1960 is a modern gun as far as GOOD gun makers go.

 

[shil]

This. Here's the story from RevolverGuy, with information from the S&W engineer who led the L-frame project.

The Smith & Wesson L-Frame Story – RevolverGuy.Com

It's a great article! Of particular personal interest was testimony that the Winchester 125 grain loading was especially abusive. I tend to agree as my own 6" 19-4's barrel extension cracked after firing only between 200 and 250 rounds of that stuff. Smith and Wesson replaced the barrel (with, at my request, a 4") and the gun has been babied since. Come to think of it, I haven't shot it in years. Replacement barrels for it are but a memory at Smith and Wesson and have you tried to find a replacement pinned barrel elsewhere? I have a 4" 686-4 to play with. No worries.

 

[pantannojack]

The reduced power 357 loads do not use heavy charges of colloidal ball powder and neither does any 38 Special/+P load.[/QUOTE]

Merriam- Webster: "The meaning of COLLOID is a gelatinous, musinous substance found normally in the thyroid and also in diseased tissue." ...

How does this fit into gun powder?

 

[Bald1]

Buy a 357 then don't shoot 357 ammo?????? Then buy a new Corvette but don't take it out of 3rd gear. Crazy talk.

 

[Jack Flash]

Buy a 357 then don't shoot 357 ammo?????? Then buy a new Corvette but don't take it out of 3rd gear. Crazy talk.

I would like to see in writing where S&W says "Some of our revolvers are not meant to be shot at a rate of more than 50 rounds a year."

 

[bgrafsr]

It was the hot 125-grain JHP loads that were found to be the cause of cracked forcing cones. I don't know how common the problem really was but I would think it would take a lot of shooting to do that. It seemed to be a problem for mid-size S&W and Rugers...didn't hear it happening to other makes...or at least not as often...but S&W and Ruger sold more mid-size .357 revolvers than anyone else so it seems logical if there was an issue that those guns would show it.

A great defense round was the old Winchester and Federal "Treasury Load"...a .38 Special 110 grain +P+. Winchester still loads it as their 110 grain .357 rather than a .38 Special...if you can find it. The FBI swore by their 158-grain lead SWCHP...the Treasury had their preferences...but each had their own specific criteria to meet their needs.

When I was a firearms instructor/armorer for our PD, I had the Dept. purchase .38 Spl. +P+ lead hollow point swc ammo for duty use. We carried Model 66's at the time.

 

[Darkenfast]

Buy a 357 then don't shoot 357 ammo?????? Then buy a new Corvette but don't take it out of 3rd gear. Crazy talk.

It's actually more a case of: "All cars have a gas pedal that can be floored, but some cars, more than others, should not be driven constantly with that pedal floored."

 

[Dave686]

Hi guys! Just bought a mod 19-6 from 1992. Read somewhere that using modern powerful rounds could crack the forcing cone. What brand /type of 357 rounds are safe in this gun. Hope this distinguished forum can help.
Terje A Gogstad
Norway

I've shot 19's and 66's for 50 years. Carried them on duty and shot in competition. Like many others, I've never seen a cracked forcing cone, and they are probably rare. But no doubt its happened. We always used either .38's in competition or 158 grain 357 Mag, never the lighter 357's.

I've seen this posted over the years as though its common.

As I've gotten older I've figured out that if you have an iconic firearm like a K-Frame Smith or a Remington 700 and someone thinks they have found a flaw, they will go nuts talking about it just for the attention. I bet you have people like that in Norway also.

 

[dogdoc]

The forcing cone on my model 60 j frame 357 mag is way thinner than any 19 or 66. How many of those do you see cracked? Not many. While this has happened, I think this issue is way way way overstated on the internet. I also do not think modern 357 ammo is loaded as hot as some of the old 1970s stuff.

 

[kbm6893]

I would like to see in writing where S&W says "Some of our revolvers are not meant to be shot at a rate of more than 50 rounds a year."

I don't have the email from S&W anymore but they told me on more than one occasion to limit the use of .357 magnum of any type in the K frame ..357 because they weren't designed for exclusive use of .357 and they had no more barrels.

 

[Jim Watson]

The reduced power 357 loads do not use heavy charges of colloidal ball powder and neither does any 38 Special/+P load.

Merriam- Webster: "The meaning of COLLOID is a gelatinous, musinous substance found normally in the thyroid and also in diseased tissue." ...

How does this fit into gun powder?[/QUOTE]

You can't count on dictionary definitions of words in technical jargon.

The Olsen-Olin Ball Powder process handles the nitrocellulose-nitroglycerine mix as a colloid through a substantial part of the process. Safer and faster than extruded powders.

 

[Bill Lear]

Hi guys! Just bought a mod 19-6 from 1992. Read somewhere that using modern powerful rounds could crack the forcing cone. What brand /type of 357 rounds are safe in this gun. Hope this distinguished forum can help.
Terje A Gogstad
Norway

Another example of when you should have spent the money on a NEW M19 with two-piece barrel designed to NOT crack or fail under heavy .357 magnum use.

But everyone "believes" the so-called, self-appointed experts and buys the no-longer produced model and then worries about how well it will hold up.

Shoot the thing with .38 special loads.

 

[CCantu357]

As a long time user of K-frame Magnums, I'd say that the term "modern rounds" refer to the 125 grain loads with a 1400+ fps muzzle velocity, as opposed to the original 158 grain load at closer to 1200 fps (4" velocities). When shooting magnums from a K-frame, I believe the prudent choice is 158 grain loads. As others have noted, the 140-145 grain loads are good comprise.

I also like some of the more mild .357 loads for use in K-Magnums. Remington offers Golden Saber defense load, a 125 grain at about 1200 fps. Winchester offers the 110 grain at 1300 fps. I believe this was the old Border Patrol load. These rounds also offer much less recoil.

That being said, while all .357 Magnum rounds are safe to fire in K-frame .357, it is best to remember that the gun is better suited to shooting .38 Specials most of the time, with the occasional use of Magnums. And when shooting Magnums, using loads that are easier on the gun.