N frame vs the L

[Penmon]

I assume if your reading this forum you also feel as I do about the post war (that's WWI) S&W wheel guns up until about 1982.

For a long time I have mainly concentrated on the pinned barrel S&W's guns totaling ignoring the newer 3 digit Smiths. I really love the 19's, 27's, 28's and the venerable model 10 and 36.With my favorite being the Mdl.19.

I only own two S&W that do not fit this mold one being the Mdl.915 semi auto 9mm that I truly love and the second a 625-9 Mountain Gun in 45LC, converted to fire both 45acp and 45lc with moon clips.I have no real objection the the MIM parts or the "lock", just wish it did not have them. Still all and all I like it because I like 45lc.

As of late I have begun to reconsider my prejudges against the more modern wheel guns.I have read a lot of good things about the 581,586 and 681, 686 Distinguished Combat Magnum.

My understanding is that the L frame was developed in response to demands for a stronger K frame (Mdl.19) to allow it to better handle the 357 loads but to strengthen it in a way that still allowed it to retain some of the weight and balance of the Mdl.19. Hence the L frame was the compromise between the K and L frames. It is also my understanding that Roy Jinks had design input into the development of the 586 and the pistol quickly established itself into law enforcement and hunting circles.

Would you buy a 586 as a replacement or supplement for a home defense or hunting used Mdl.19? Of course I would keep the 19's.

If so what dash, finish (stainless or blued), barrel length would you look for, using accuracies first and collectability second as your search criteria?

Penmon

 

[Augen]

I'm sure there will be lots of opinions on this topic. Strictly for home defense I do t think there would be a need to replace a mod 19 with an L frame. Hunting wise it would seem a bit more beneficial in handling the stronger loads. For me im keeping my N frame for hunting.

As for barrel lengths I believe the 4" may be better while 6" is better for hunting due to longer sight radius. But either could be done with either length.

Finish wise I think a beautiful blue is just as nice as a stainless but I'm lazy and prefer to stick with stainless.

In the end it's just preferences and training.

 

[oldafsp]

My love for K frames started over 40 years ago when I carried a Model 15 in the Air Force.

The K's perfected my revolver skills and became my first love because of the
workmanship,balance,accuracy and reliability.

However, Magnum loads in a K frame are without a doubt, stout to say the
least. Good grips help alot but with the factory Magnas can be downright painful.

The N frames are much nicer in .357. Especially with factory targets on them. Fired many 27's and 28's and enjoyed them all. A difficult gun to carry all day just due to the weight. The 3.5 inch N is the best of all in my opinion.

So I was looking for a very shootable Magnum, easy to carry with the ability to digest all the nice .357 loads I could put through it.

I had shot numerous 586/686's belonging to friends and found them to be a good compromise just as they were designed to be.

A shooting buddy picked up a gorgeous 586 earlier this year and we shot the living snot out of it. Great revolver. So they search was on. A couple of months ago I found a low round count 681-1 4 inch that had lived in a safe for the last 20 some odd years.....

I shoot fixed sight revolvers very well. From J frames up. I am not a bullseye shooter,but a combat shooter. Adjustable sights are nice but for me not a make or break issue. I can shoot very well out past 50 yards even with fixed sight guns. But seeing if I can
do one hole groups is not the way I shoot. I've never seen a bullseye that shot back at you....

My 681 is by far the most enjoyable Magnum that I have ever owned. It shoots laser straight with a smooth double action pull that rivals any of my K frames.

It sold me for sure on the L frame.

I love blued guns,but for ease of cleaning the stainless is the ticket. As a carry gun in 4 inch...a little heavy. I'll stick with my Bodyguard or my 6906 if I need more firepower. I don't hunt so that I won't comment on. I tend to gravitate towards earlier revision models in my collection.

Which ever one you get, I don't think you would be dissapointed.

 

[arjay]

My 586-1 is my only smith in 357 so I can't compare it to an n or k frame in that caliber,but I can say that recoil in an l frame feels very mild to me.Most of my shooting has been 45 acp in various government models and 44 mag in n frames,colts and rugers and the recoil from the 357 is much less than these and a bit more than a 38 in a k frame.
I think that Smith & Wesson really came up with the ideal frame size for the 357 in the l frame in that it can be shot all day long without developing a flinch.

 

[JCS&W]

I must admit that I turned my nose up at the L frames for a while. I wanted only P&R Smiths. Thankfully, I have come to my senses. The 581/586/681/686 are great Smiths. Often over looked by many. I have read on this forum, that the -4 models are the most desireable because those models have all the good changes, and none of the bad. The -5 started with the MIM parts and the lock I believe, but not sure at the moment. I have a 581 and a 586, both in 4" and both nickel. To me, the 4" models look more balanced. Just my opinion.

 

[Fly'nBuff]

From an aesthetic and balance standpoint, I like my frames to grow as my barrel does. I think a 2" J-frame, 3" K-frame, 4" L-frame, and 5" N-frames are the cat's pajamas. I don't get too worked up over P&R, MIM parts, or the lock. I prefer balance and pointability combined with price and availability

 

[riverrat38]

"My understanding is that the L frame was developed in response to demands for a stronger K frame (Mdl.19) to allow it to better handle the 357 loads but to strengthen it in a way that still allowed it to retain some of the weight and balance of the Mdl.19."

Yes, they increased the diameter of the cylinder, and thus the size of the frame, so that the gas ring just clears the forcing cone, without having to cut the flat spot on the the bottom of the barrel. This was a weak area on the K frame magnum. They also added the full underlug. The larger cylinder made it possible to chamber the gun for 7 rounds, thus the Plus model. The grip is the same as the K frame, but the holster size is not.

Rick

 

[Snapping Twig]

There's a couple differences on the L frame vs the N frame.

The L frame has a longer cylinder. This means that as a reloader you have more flexibility with longer, heavier bullets.

The bore axis is higher on the N frame in relationship to the grip.

That said, I'm an N frame guy but I have an L frame - a 586-1.

In California you need a 6" barrel to hunt with a .357, but no such requirement with larger calibers. My N frames are all sized from 3" to 6.5" and every one of them is legal to hunt with, except for a 627-0 which is 5.5". I suppose it satisfies the velocity requirements, but technically it isn't 'jake' according to the rules.

I've had 4 L frames over the years starting with a 6" 586 ND, a 2.5" 686 ND, a 4" 686-2 and finally the 4" 586-1 which I find perfect.

Everyone that's an S&W fan should have an L frame.

 

[H Richard]

I've had a 686 no dash since 1984. It came with a .500" (case hardened) target trigger, but the flash chromed semi-target hammer. It's a 6", and it has digested anything I have put in it with no problems. With the full length barrel lug, it is enough front heavy it seems to offset the recoil, and I used it in many PPC matches. It is undoubtedly one of my favorite Smith's. It is no longer standard, as I removed the serrations from the trigger and contoured it for double action shooting, and replaced the grips with Hogue's.

 

[mag318]

I consider the L frames the height of S&W revolver development. Not to small and not to large, and will handle a steady diet of heavy 357 Magnum loads with ease. The long out of production 581/681s are more sought after now then when they were readily available. The 686 which is still in production along with the newly rereleased 581s sell well and are great revolvers. If you could ony own 1 revolver any of these L frames would be a good choice.

 

[Sealevel]

I would certainly recommend adding an "L" frame to your model 19 as a home self defense weapon.

I believe the model 19 / 66 to be the most handsome and desireable of the S&W revolvers. Both of mine (a 6" & a 4") are to me wonderfully balanced and are great fun at the range. I received the 6" 19 in trade for a 6" 586 even up. The difference in heft and balance is much appreciated, however my other .357s (65 & 13) were also "K" frames. Soon, after reading so many favorable comments on this forum, I wanted to try another L frame; one with a shorter barrel. I really wanted a 581 / 681 but settled on a 4" 686ND. After two range sessions I really came to appreciate the accuracy and ease with which this gun handled the magnum rounds. Still feeling bulkier than the 4" 66, it is every bit as accurate as the 66. And last week I obtained a 2.5" 686-5 Plus which has replaced the 3" 65 as the nightstand gun. With seven round capacity and spot on accuracy it seems the perfect choice.

I'm still looking for the 4" nickel plated 581 that I want. I'm not a collector just a shooter, so I can't comment on that aspect of your search. Nickel, blue or stainless; I like them all and would not make that an overriding consideration. Just shooter's condition (95%+) is important to me with price certainly a consideration.

 

[TAROMAN]

L-Frames are some of my favorites, too.
For DA shooting the smaller rotating mass (as compared to a .357 N-Frame) really helps.

Still seeking that elusive 581.

 

[Penmon]

Thanks guys, a lot of great information.I saw a 586-1 today, blued,6in barrel.It was real tight and had about 98% blue.(looked real nice)
They wanted $685.00 and will probably come down to the low $600.00 range plus MD state tax of 6%..so lets say $650.00 out the door.No box or papers.Is this about the going rate?
Penmon

 

[arjay]

I kind of like this one.

 

[Penmon]

Kind of, but without the leaves,other than the "leaves"dead on, same grips too.
Penmon

 

[arjay]

Mid 80s 586-1.I was going for a fall theme ;-)
Picked it up about a year and a half ago for $500 off of gunbroker.
Add in shipping and the ffls fee and your price sounds about right.

 

[nipster]

If you are gonna use it for hunting, get a 686. You dont have to worry about the finish.

 

[sodacan]

I am and always have been a huge "K" and "N" frame fan of .357 revolvers. I was offered a 686 no dash several years ago. Well, eight "L" frames later, I have to tell you that they are very nice guns. My favorite is my blue 581. It is the tightest S&W revolver I own. None of these guns were bought new. They are all no dash, save one being a dash two. None of them suffer from the maladies of the new guns. With that being said, as good as these "L" frames are, they are very different from the much older 27's, 28's, 19's and the like. These older guns represent a level of workmanship and precision that I feel is lost at S&W. One might expect that the digital age with computer aided design and manufacturing, better metallurgy, better ergonomics, etc. would bring us better guns, but all it has done has brought us different guns that represent giant leaps in technology along with gunsmiths who are accountants and lawyers. Sorry for the digression. My answer to question: For home defense a 581 or 681. They are point and shoot guns. Adjustable sights are not necessary. For hunting the 586 or 686 with adjustable sights is the obvious answer. For both, the latter. But by all means,keep the 19. Good luck to all.

 

[bronco45]

Over the years I have owned the 2.5", 4" and 6" L Frames. As of today I continue to carry and use very effectively a 4" 586 ND. Great accuracy, ease of carry while seated, and shoot full house 357s all day long, with a K frame grip frame. Smith got the L Frame right the first time.

 

[STCM(SW)]

I must be in the minority. Had a 686 6" when they first came out, just was not my cup of tea. Sold it many years ago. Just prefer "N" frames even in the .357 Magnum.