New to me Highway Patrolman...Next to the Last, Almost Final Update, Sept. 10th, 2016
- Thread starter les.b
- Start date
C Broad Arrow
Member
I forgot one step... I used a new soft bristle tooth brush to apply and buff the checkering. I did this same thing on several sets and have just two or three coats of tung oil on them. In person they look great. I do not like the shiny look of varnish or poly coatings. As you handle the grips more they take on a very appealing ... glow. I have a set on my EDC 19-4 snub that the more I handle the better they look.
Looks like my kit when I carry.
OP
Les, thank you very much. I have the origial stocks to my little 3" 65 and would very much like to see them turn out like yours. Now I just need to get some tung oil
SLT223:
Be sure and let us know how it turns out. We are always learning here on the forum, and we are always curious about how these sorts of projects go. Take some before and after photos, and post them. Either start your own thread, or feel free to post here on this one. Either way, it would be interesting to see how things turn out.
Best Regards, Les
OP
Well, today I took time to clean the leather, and recondition it with a light treatment with Lexol, followed by a waxing with Renaissance Wax, and for the time being, at least, im going to use this leather that came as part of the original deal. Here's what it looks like today:
To sum up: Outside cleaned with bronze wool and gun oil to remove the light rust, and stop its spread. Completely refurbished inside, every part scrubbed and relubricated, new trigger, new cylinder stop, new trigger rebound spring, trigger reprofiled and fitted to hammer, retimed, the stocks stripped, cleaned, and refinished with Tung oil. Sights adjusted to fire .357 magnum 158 grain JSP to point of aim at 25 yards. (I have a bunch of factory Federal ammo in this loading, and I handload a 158 gr LSWC 357 Mag that approximates it). The gun and leather still has the character of long use, but are completly free of rust and crud, yet glow from their overhaul, and I believe that they are now ready for a new life with yours truly!
I've really enjoyed the project over the last few weeks, and appreciate the advice and encouragement, and even parts that my fellow forum members (like Weatherby, who supplied the trigger, which I installed, and the grip adapter, which I have been experimenting with) have provided.
Eventually I will provide a final range report, but for now I'm sort of winding down this project. Time to enjoy playing around with the final product!
Best Regards, Les
To sum up: Outside cleaned with bronze wool and gun oil to remove the light rust, and stop its spread. Completely refurbished inside, every part scrubbed and relubricated, new trigger, new cylinder stop, new trigger rebound spring, trigger reprofiled and fitted to hammer, retimed, the stocks stripped, cleaned, and refinished with Tung oil. Sights adjusted to fire .357 magnum 158 grain JSP to point of aim at 25 yards. (I have a bunch of factory Federal ammo in this loading, and I handload a 158 gr LSWC 357 Mag that approximates it). The gun and leather still has the character of long use, but are completly free of rust and crud, yet glow from their overhaul, and I believe that they are now ready for a new life with yours truly!
I've really enjoyed the project over the last few weeks, and appreciate the advice and encouragement, and even parts that my fellow forum members (like Weatherby, who supplied the trigger, which I installed, and the grip adapter, which I have been experimenting with) have provided.
Eventually I will provide a final range report, but for now I'm sort of winding down this project. Time to enjoy playing around with the final product!
Best Regards, Les
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Just discovered this thread... really enjoyed seeing your M-28, and the leather come back to life.
Just a comment on refinishing the checkered area of grips.
The trick to getting that area sealed without it having a built up look to it, is you need to thin out the finish and apply it very sparingly with a tooth brush.
When I used to use Tru-oil, I thinned it down to 50/50 mix of oil and thinner.
What I use now is Laurel Mountain Forge Permalyn stock sealer, which is an oil-modified polyurethane. The sealer is water thin to penetrate wood fibers, so it is easy to control surface build up. There is a Permalyn stock finish which I don't use... it's too thick.
By just using the sealer alone and applying coats until you get the results (sheen) you want, you get a really nice finish without a heaviness look to it.. in my opinion, closer to a factory look. And when the Permalyn dries/cures.. it's durable.
In the before/after pics, notice how the checkered area still looks sharp with no filling in of the lines or build up of the checkering points, which is a common thing that happens when an un-thinned finished is used.
You can also see how this Permalyn brings out the grain pattern. The best way I can describe it it that it is unobtrusive while it does it's thing... yeah, if you haven't guessed by now, I'm really sold on it after having tried various finishes over the years.
Just a comment on refinishing the checkered area of grips.
The trick to getting that area sealed without it having a built up look to it, is you need to thin out the finish and apply it very sparingly with a tooth brush.
When I used to use Tru-oil, I thinned it down to 50/50 mix of oil and thinner.
What I use now is Laurel Mountain Forge Permalyn stock sealer, which is an oil-modified polyurethane. The sealer is water thin to penetrate wood fibers, so it is easy to control surface build up. There is a Permalyn stock finish which I don't use... it's too thick.
By just using the sealer alone and applying coats until you get the results (sheen) you want, you get a really nice finish without a heaviness look to it.. in my opinion, closer to a factory look. And when the Permalyn dries/cures.. it's durable.
In the before/after pics, notice how the checkered area still looks sharp with no filling in of the lines or build up of the checkering points, which is a common thing that happens when an un-thinned finished is used.
You can also see how this Permalyn brings out the grain pattern. The best way I can describe it it that it is unobtrusive while it does it's thing... yeah, if you haven't guessed by now, I'm really sold on it after having tried various finishes over the years.
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Lee's Landing Billy
Member
Les. I am envious of that whole rig. That is a perfect packing outfit for me. No way to improve. Been shot, looks shot, leathern worn on the hip not in the safe. No way to improve! Billy
OP
This is some really great information, Gunhacker!! I am always willing to learn and am making note of this post. I have had a great time with this project, and of course, the first consideration was functionality. I have the revolver really performing well now, and have brought back some of my armorer skills that I hadn't used for some time.
As far as the woodworking side, I did use a very thin tung oil, and as you recommended, scrubbed it into the checkering with a toothbrush. Also, as I added coats to the surrounding stock, I did not build up the checkering coats as much, to avoid clogging the checkering. I added some coats to the surrounding area, and lightly buffed them down with 0000 steel wool to help fill in the grain a little, while not building up the thickness of the coverage. After everything had cured throughly, I buffed it a little with Flitz, and then Renaissance Wax.
But I like the sound of this Laurel Mountain Forge Permalyn stock sealer. I'm going to see if I can find it online, and get some to experiment with. Thanks for the information!! This may lead to even more projects.
Best Regards, Les
OP
Gunhacker:
I have been to Laurel Mountain Forge's web site, and they have a wealth of information there on stock refinishing, as well as the ability to buy their products. I was pleased to see that I was pretty much on track for finishing stocks, in their instructions they were suggesting many of the same things I was already doing.
I have ordered a small 4 oz size of the product that you suggested, as well as one of the stock finish, and will let you know how my next project works out!! I'll be happy to add these to my modest shop, and am looking forward to experimenting with them. I recommend that anyone who is interested in this sort of work go to their site and read the very detailed instructions on surface prep, application, finish technique and so forth.
Thanks again for the heads up!
Best Regards, Les
I have been to Laurel Mountain Forge's web site, and they have a wealth of information there on stock refinishing, as well as the ability to buy their products. I was pleased to see that I was pretty much on track for finishing stocks, in their instructions they were suggesting many of the same things I was already doing.
I have ordered a small 4 oz size of the product that you suggested, as well as one of the stock finish, and will let you know how my next project works out!! I'll be happy to add these to my modest shop, and am looking forward to experimenting with them. I recommend that anyone who is interested in this sort of work go to their site and read the very detailed instructions on surface prep, application, finish technique and so forth.
Thanks again for the heads up!
Best Regards, Les
Time to enjoy playing around with the final product!
Best Regards, Les
That picture make me want to carry it cross draw...................
Thats a sharp projct gun there Les, the big frame .38 I got into with heavy dutys, I may just have to find me a HP.
Very nice job. Great thread,
Very nice job. Great thread,
Les,
You're going to enjoy using that Permalyn... I've been a hobbyist woodworker for over 40 years and have dabbled in using all sorts of finishes, and Permalyn has really turned my head, because it is not like the typical "plastic" polyurethane found on the shelf of big box stores.
A great classic book for gunstock finishing is "Gunstock Finishing and Care" by A. Donald Newell. It's long out of print but easily found on used book websites such as Alibris.com or abebooks.com for around $10 - $18 depending on condition, I learned a lot from it.
OP
TexMex:
Thanks... I've had a lot of fun not just with the gun, and cleaning it up and making it a project, but in learning from and interacting with the forum members. I sometimes check out the other forums, but this is the only one that I belong to. great folks here, and an awful lot of knowledge and talent, and willingness to share that knowlege with others.
I've just recently rediscovered the N frames, I only have a few, but am having a lot of fun with this one.
Best Regards, Les
gman51
Member
No doubt you found a good deal. Like was said above, if you are satisfied with what you got for what you paid then you got a good deal.
Very nice gun.
Very nice gun.
Purty work, WS.
Melody Maker pickups?
( sorry 'bout the drift)
No, those are Evans pickups. They are made for a Stratocaster sized opening. Jeff Healey was a big fan of them. I like them too.
I only had two of them, so that is how I made the pick guard. It turns out, that is all I needed!
PS I made the strap too!
OP
Conrad:
Well, the finish came in today, and this weekend I might just try to find a project to work on. Not sure that I want to "redo" all the effort that I put into this gun, but we'll see. Anyway, thanks again for the heads up. I'm going to look for that book soon, also, I deal with Abebooks all the time, and they are fantastic.
Best Regards, Les
DevilDog72
US Veteran
Les,
I want to thank you for spending my money ole son...
.
bought this 28-2 S prefix online today... it was your thread that settled me on a 28, that said, I was looking for a N frame to start with anyway...
I want to thank you for spending my money ole son...
.
bought this 28-2 S prefix online today... it was your thread that settled me on a 28, that said, I was looking for a N frame to start with anyway...
OP
Wow, DevilDog, what a beauty!!! And with the diamond grips as well. I'm sure that you will be very happy with it. One thing that I've noticed is how mild the recoil is, even with full power .357s, as compared with the Model 19 and 66 size frames, not to mention the little scandium J frames that I also have.
Very pleasant too shoot. Still makes a lot of noise, though!! I love mine. I'm sure that you'll love yours as well!!
Best Regards, Les
Very pleasant too shoot. Still makes a lot of noise, though!! I love mine. I'm sure that you'll love yours as well!!
Best Regards, Les
OP
Les: GREAT Thread + FANTASTIC WORK !
...and I am a fan of nice wood with oil-finish, too. As can be seen above,
a bit oil even "shines up" a beautiful walnut guitar...
P.44
Always good shooting (+ playing)
P.44:
Thanks for the kudos. At the suggestion of "Gunhacker's" post above, I now have a new oil finish to try out. I haven't decided whether to redo the stocks on this project, or wait for my next project gun. I have another gun on the way which I am thinking about doing a little restoration on. I've been struggling with the ethos of the "restoration" of older guns. In general, "rebluing" an older gun is not a good thing, as it actually diminishes the value and any historical value that an arm might possess. But a little judicial use of some bronze wool and oil to remove light rust is generally considered almost a necessity, as it prevents the rust from growing, as Hondo44 points out, like a cancer.
I think that the same care and a distinction between "refinishing", and "restoring" might yield an acceptable formula for what is permissible and what is not when cleaning up an older gun. I usually remove the sideplate and internals on a newly aquired Smith and scrub out the frame and each part, and inspect them for damage or any need of repairs, then lightly lubricate and reassemble the gun. Is this bad? I don't think so, we can't be expected to leave congealed lubricant in an older firearm, as it might even damage the gun when the action is worked.
So why not restore the stocks a little. Judiciously, and gently, and with some regard for preserving the gun for a future generation, or even for ones own future enjoyment??? In the above project, I think that if I were a better photographer, or you were to see them in person, that they actually look like they have a patina, and the more I handle them, the more they look like a well worn original finish, but yet the wood has been newly sealed and protected by the oil finish.
Just some random thoughts and ramblings about the whole "project gun" philosophy.
Best Regards, Les
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^^^ I would only add that any rubbing of the blued finish, even with bronze wool, will remove blueing. I like to just soak any rust spots with penetrating oil. Scrub it with a tooth brush if you must, but just let it soak. It will eventually break loose.
C Broad Arrow
Member
How do you soak the effected areas with penetrating oil? Do you totally immerse the gun in a tub or just place a oil soaked cloth on the area in question? I have been trying to find a better way to remove the small specks of rust that seem to come with every new purchase.
OP
Warren:
Thanks for the tip. I am always learning new stuff, and appreciate all of the advice that I have garnered along the way here on the forum. I've seen some of your abilities in regards to building AKs, and even guitars!! You must have a great shop to perform some of these feats in as well.
To follow up C Brad Areow's query, though, how do you soak the area? With a rag? Or as he said, in a container filled with the oil? Or perhaps just squirt it on... I've noticed that with very penetrating oil, that it pre ads out quickly, and dissipates rapidly if you just squirt some on the rusted area.
Best Regards, Les
C Broad Arrow
Member
That is very helpful info. Thank you very much. What type/brand etc of penetrating oil do you find gives the best results?
OP
I've been experimenting with "Kroil" brand penetrating oil. I had seen someone here on the forum recommend it, perhaps it was Hondo44. It seems to be really great for a lot of little projects. If you pull the sideplate off of an old hand ejector, you will likely find that old oil has congealed, and may even be loaded up with carbon and other products of the firing of the gun. A toothbrush and some Kroil will clean up this stuff in a jiffy. But to be fair, so will Hoppes Number 9, or CLP or lots of other stuff. My GF's dad once gave me a beautiful little Chiefs Special in nickle that he had inherited. It looked like it had never been fired, and was beautifully preserved on the outside, but you could barely pull the hammer back!!
When I removed the sideplate, someone had evidently used some type of oil that congealed very badly, and you could hardly get the parts to move. The gun may in fact have never been fired. I squirted some Hoppes in, and just let it soak over night, then scrubbed with a toothbrush, and gradually worked all of the parts out of the frame, and scrubbed them up individually. They looked brand new, no rust or corrosion. Lightly lubed, reassembled, and it was just like new.
But in its previous state, it could have been loaded, and given a false sense of security to someone, because there is no way it would have even fired!!
Best Regards, Les
When I removed the sideplate, someone had evidently used some type of oil that congealed very badly, and you could hardly get the parts to move. The gun may in fact have never been fired. I squirted some Hoppes in, and just let it soak over night, then scrubbed with a toothbrush, and gradually worked all of the parts out of the frame, and scrubbed them up individually. They looked brand new, no rust or corrosion. Lightly lubed, reassembled, and it was just like new.
But in its previous state, it could have been loaded, and given a false sense of security to someone, because there is no way it would have even fired!!
Best Regards, Les
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OP
Mark:
Just a few cautions on disassembling the hand ejectors, if you have not done so. Properly fitting screwdrivers are a must, or you risk buggering up the sideplate and other screws. There are some threads and stickys here on the forum that can help you, I'll see if I can locate them and come back here and post links. There are acceptable ways to remove the sideplate to minimize the possibility of damaging it. Also, one must exercise care in removing and reassembling the internal parts to avoid damage. It's handy to have some spare sideplate screws to use if you are going to be assembling and reassembling the sideplate, to minimize wear on the original screws. Nothing, in my opinion is more unappealing than buggered up screws on a nice revolver! Also, properly fitting screwdrivers minimize the risk of slipping and scratching the finish of one of your cherished Smiths!
I seem to remember having a conversation with Hondo44 regarding the best screwdrivers to use in working on Smiths, and how to customize them to fit specific screws. I'll look for that thread as well.
Best Regards, Les
OP
Mark:
I have been looking through some of the old threads as I promised, and I am going to quote here from "Big Cholla", who posts frequently on the forum regarding gunsmithing subjects. This is from a thread titled simply "screwdrivers", if you are interested. I personally am fond of the "Grace" brand screwdrivers, and they have a good reputation, and are nice to use, and of course can be custom ground to fit any given screw... But here is what Big Cholla has to say on the subject:
I'll keep looking for some specific guidance for removing sideplates and poking around inside of a handejector. They are all pretty much the same inside, so once you learn the basics, there is not much difference between the N, L, K, J, and I frames.
Again, please find out all you can before taking your gun apart...
Best Regards, Les
I have been looking through some of the old threads as I promised, and I am going to quote here from "Big Cholla", who posts frequently on the forum regarding gunsmithing subjects. This is from a thread titled simply "screwdrivers", if you are interested. I personally am fond of the "Grace" brand screwdrivers, and they have a good reputation, and are nice to use, and of course can be custom ground to fit any given screw... But here is what Big Cholla has to say on the subject:
I'll keep looking for some specific guidance for removing sideplates and poking around inside of a handejector. They are all pretty much the same inside, so once you learn the basics, there is not much difference between the N, L, K, J, and I frames.
Again, please find out all you can before taking your gun apart...
Best Regards, Les
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OP
Mark:
Here's a recent thread on removing the sideplate, with several different perspectives on the operation: http://smith-wessonforum.com/s-w-ha...ate-rermoval.html?highlight=Sideplate+removal .
I'll see if I can't find some more information for you....
Best Regards, Les
Here's a recent thread on removing the sideplate, with several different perspectives on the operation: http://smith-wessonforum.com/s-w-ha...ate-rermoval.html?highlight=Sideplate+removal .
I'll see if I can't find some more information for you....
Best Regards, Les
OP
Mark:
Here's a thread from the gunsmithing sub forum here on grinding your screwdriver blades to fit specific screws. It is mainly oriented towards shotgun screwdrivers, but the information can be applied to making dedicated screwdrivers for your revolver work. http://smith-wessonforum.com/s-w-smithing/174948-custom-grinding-gunsmithing-screwdrivers.html .
Best Regards, Les
Here's a thread from the gunsmithing sub forum here on grinding your screwdriver blades to fit specific screws. It is mainly oriented towards shotgun screwdrivers, but the information can be applied to making dedicated screwdrivers for your revolver work. http://smith-wessonforum.com/s-w-smithing/174948-custom-grinding-gunsmithing-screwdrivers.html .
Best Regards, Les
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