andyo5
Member
Bullseye is all you need. Unique also works well.
But I use nothing but Bullseye and enjoy shooting with it.
But I use nothing but Bullseye and enjoy shooting with it.
New to reloading .45 ACP--advice?
- Thread starter Waywatcher
- Start date
fredj338
Member
Close enough out to 25yds to not need adjustable sights. The 45acp seems to not suffer the poi shift with diff bullet wts. I can run 185-230gr, poi out to 25yds shifts less than 1" for all 3.
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OP
Waywatcher
Member
Good to hear. I just did the feed-an-empty-case test on my Colt and it passed with flying colors; felt exactly like a round of ball.
I am almost positive now I will give the 200 grain SWC loads a try; only thing to decide is where to get the bullets.
WW,
Not trying to give you too many options for bullets, but try this thread:
http://smith-wessonforum.com/reloading/343279-online-bullet-sources.html
You should be able to find what you are looking for there.
Not trying to give you too many options for bullets, but try this thread:
http://smith-wessonforum.com/reloading/343279-online-bullet-sources.html
You should be able to find what you are looking for there.
Harkrader
Member
Lasercast, Oregon Trail.
Great consistency of weight and diameter, excellent accuracy. It's all I ever use, now.
Great consistency of weight and diameter, excellent accuracy. It's all I ever use, now.
OP
Waywatcher
Member
I got my bullets today; I went with Oregon Trail 200 grain SWC.
I loaded my first dummy round at 1.250" with a taper crimp to 0.470" and it didn't work so well. It chambered from the magazine (Checkmate Hybrid) but it was a bit sticky to extract. As you can see, the bullet and case got a bit mangled.
So, I made another dummy round, this time seated at 1.235" but still crimped to 0.470" and it went much better. (Manually) chambered and ejected fine. No mangling.
Is this par for the course? Should I load up a magazine worth of live rounds at 1.235" and go from there?
I loaded my first dummy round at 1.250" with a taper crimp to 0.470" and it didn't work so well. It chambered from the magazine (Checkmate Hybrid) but it was a bit sticky to extract. As you can see, the bullet and case got a bit mangled.
So, I made another dummy round, this time seated at 1.235" but still crimped to 0.470" and it went much better. (Manually) chambered and ejected fine. No mangling.
Is this par for the course? Should I load up a magazine worth of live rounds at 1.235" and go from there?
The second picture looks way better but still hard to tell from the angle of the picture.
Load a few dummies and load a mag and manually cycle them through the gun (not really the same as shooting but will give you an idea) I warned you about those pesky LSWC to start off with
Load a few dummies and load a mag and manually cycle them through the gun (not really the same as shooting but will give you an idea) I warned you about those pesky LSWC to start off with
venomballistics
Member
OP
Waywatcher
Member
The second picture looks way better but still hard to tell from the angle of the picture.
Load a few dummies and load a mag and manually cycle them through the gun (not really the same as shooting but will give you an idea) I warned you about those pesky LSWC to start off with
I'm willing to play around to get these SWC bullets working.
Here's a profile picture of the dummy round that went flawlessly into and out of the 1911:
It looks exactly the same all the way around; no signs of any dinged lead or brass.
gwpercle
Member
That looks just fine. Now it's time for some test ammo loading.
You have 231 and Red Dot powders so pick a moderate load for one or both and make a trip to the range for some testing. Feeding, firing and ejection first then accuracy, will get you "the load" for your 45 .
Good luck,
Gary
You have 231 and Red Dot powders so pick a moderate load for one or both and make a trip to the range for some testing. Feeding, firing and ejection first then accuracy, will get you "the load" for your 45 .
Good luck,
Gary
I'm willing to play around to get these SWC bullets working.
Here's a profile picture of the dummy round that went flawlessly into and out of the 1911:
It looks exactly the same all the way around; no signs of any dinged lead or brass.
That looks good. The technical measure I use is about a fingernail width of the driving band showing.
Once you find the magic COL then there should be no feeding issue. My dilemma was loading for several 45's. I wanted a bullet with on OAL that would work in all of them. Sometimes it only takes a fraction +/- to work correctlyLoad 10 or 20 only and see how the feed and shoot.
OP
Waywatcher
Member
Quick update:
Did some in-depth plunk testing. Found my barrel hood is a bit over cut--factory ball ammo that functions 100% sits 0.005" proud. Also found that taper crimping to 0.470 is not adequate to pass the plunk test in my gun--the round would sit about 0.012" proud or so (mushy measurements since it was a friction fit in the chamber.)
Anyway, long story short, taper crimping to 0.469 makes the LSWC rounds freely pass the plunk test. Still sitting at COL of 1.235."
Gratuitous picture of the 1911 these rounds are for:
Now, I need some time to load up a batch of 10 or 20 live rounds.
Did some in-depth plunk testing. Found my barrel hood is a bit over cut--factory ball ammo that functions 100% sits 0.005" proud. Also found that taper crimping to 0.470 is not adequate to pass the plunk test in my gun--the round would sit about 0.012" proud or so (mushy measurements since it was a friction fit in the chamber.)
Anyway, long story short, taper crimping to 0.469 makes the LSWC rounds freely pass the plunk test. Still sitting at COL of 1.235."
Gratuitous picture of the 1911 these rounds are for:
Now, I need some time to load up a batch of 10 or 20 live rounds.
ILTim
Member
I only load 45 acp for my wheelgun, the only difference is potential feed issues. I love semi wadcutters because the giant sharp edged round holes in paper make me smile. But even in the wheelgun they can be a little finicky to chamber sometimes.
If they work in your 1911 (they seem to be no issue in my friends XD), my favorite for indoors in Ranier plated 200gr SWC from Midway. All lead bullets create more smoke, ok outside, but inside its annoying.
There are a LOT of bullet choices for 45, but I think 200gr is the sweet spot and was Brownings original design intent for the cartridge.
I like 5.6gr of bullseye under the 200gr SWC for a good stout bang (compared to the pooofers some like), its a 45 not a pea shooter. It was my favorite when working up from 4.2 thru 6.0 grains and seemed a sweet spot for accuracy in my hands. Also, it means that my target loads are viable manstoppers making my ammo hoard a bit versatile. Not that its my first choice for that.
If you don't want to spring for the rather expensive plated Raniers, Missouri is pretty cheap - $77 vs $42.50 for 500.
If they work in your 1911 (they seem to be no issue in my friends XD), my favorite for indoors in Ranier plated 200gr SWC from Midway. All lead bullets create more smoke, ok outside, but inside its annoying.
There are a LOT of bullet choices for 45, but I think 200gr is the sweet spot and was Brownings original design intent for the cartridge.
I like 5.6gr of bullseye under the 200gr SWC for a good stout bang (compared to the pooofers some like), its a 45 not a pea shooter. It was my favorite when working up from 4.2 thru 6.0 grains and seemed a sweet spot for accuracy in my hands. Also, it means that my target loads are viable manstoppers making my ammo hoard a bit versatile. Not that its my first choice for that.
If you don't want to spring for the rather expensive plated Raniers, Missouri is pretty cheap - $77 vs $42.50 for 500.
Lou_NC
Member
Quick update:
Did some in-depth plunk testing. Found my barrel hood is a bit over cut--factory ball ammo that functions 100% sits 0.005" proud. Also found that taper crimping to 0.470 is not adequate to pass the plunk test in my gun--the round would sit about 0.012" proud or so (mushy measurements since it was a friction fit in the chamber.)
Anyway, long story short, taper crimping to 0.469 makes the LSWC rounds freely pass the plunk test. Still sitting at COL of 1.235."
Gratuitous picture of the 1911 these rounds are for:
Now, I need some time to load up a batch of 10 or 20 live rounds.
Nice work on methodically approaching this. I applaud your choice of bullet, and the gun "ain't too shabby, either"!!
Personally, of the powders you listed, I'd go with Clays or Red Dot. In my experience, the .45ACP/200gr LSWC combination does great with fast powders. I'd pick a load right in the middle between starting and max. If you start too low, you may experience failures to cycle with the factory mainspring in that 1911. That's solved by either bumping up the load, or reducing the mainspring power. 14# and 16# mainsprings are cheap enough to try, I take that route sometimes. Low charges also tend to be "sooty" and actually tend to leave unburnt powder in some cases.
Good luck and let us know how those first live rounds work out!
Lou
OP
Waywatcher
Member
Alright!
I found the time to load up 15 live cartridges. 1.235" COL, 0.469" taper crimp in a separate operation, Winchester Brass and Primer, and 5.0 grains of Red Dot. Two full mags plus 1 for the chamber.
Might get to the range tonight--we'll see.
I found the time to load up 15 live cartridges. 1.235" COL, 0.469" taper crimp in a separate operation, Winchester Brass and Primer, and 5.0 grains of Red Dot. Two full mags plus 1 for the chamber.
Might get to the range tonight--we'll see.
Go Forth and Shoot Grasshopper!
David R
Member
I am getting 929 fps from that load in my 5". 845 fps in the 3" officers model.
Works great for me.
Works great for me.
OP
Waywatcher
Member
Range time!
I made it. Function was perfect. Recoil was noticeable and ejection... Brisk. 977fps average. Whoa. High was 998. Powder was indeed Red Dot, weighed on my RCBS scale, and I have and have used check weights on it. 5.0 is right smack in the middle according to Lyman 49th. Grouping was ok, 4.25" at 20 yards. I'm sure the gun and I can both do better. I will dial back the powder and also try Win 231. The good news of the day is that 1.235" COL and taper crimp at 0.469" run in my gun.
Target:
I made it. Function was perfect. Recoil was noticeable and ejection... Brisk. 977fps average. Whoa. High was 998. Powder was indeed Red Dot, weighed on my RCBS scale, and I have and have used check weights on it. 5.0 is right smack in the middle according to Lyman 49th. Grouping was ok, 4.25" at 20 yards. I'm sure the gun and I can both do better. I will dial back the powder and also try Win 231. The good news of the day is that 1.235" COL and taper crimp at 0.469" run in my gun.
Target:
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Lou_NC
Member
My advice would be that before you switch powders, you "walk" the load down from where you started by 0.2gr increments, until you reach a point of "unreliable function". Then I'd go back up one (or two) 0.2gr steps and if accuracy, recoil, and "cleanliness" of the load are to your satisfaction, that's where I'd stop. Then go load a bunch and have fun!
Personally, I use two loadings per caliber. One is "maximum" load for the caliber, typically what I consider a maximum-effectiveness defensive load. In .45ACP, that load is typically paired with a FMJ or JHP bullet. My other load is my "comfort" plinking and target load. Easy on me, and easy on the gun. In .45ACP, my load is based on the 200gr LSWC.
Good luck and have fun,
Lou
David R
Member
45 auto standard load is 230 @ 855 fps which = 373 ft lbs of energy
200 grain LSW @ 917 = 373 foot pounds of energy.
200 grain @ 950 fps = 400 Ft Lbs Energy
200 grain @ 977 = 424 Foot pounds energy.
The best I have seen with a "safe" 200 LSW load was 7.2 grains Unique for 1029 fps which = 470 Ft Lbs Energy.
200 LSW @ about 775 is the target load for the 45. (266 fpe)
Keep shooting and reloading until you find the load you like best. Then keep shooting and reloading!
David
200 grain LSW @ 917 = 373 foot pounds of energy.
200 grain @ 950 fps = 400 Ft Lbs Energy
200 grain @ 977 = 424 Foot pounds energy.
The best I have seen with a "safe" 200 LSW load was 7.2 grains Unique for 1029 fps which = 470 Ft Lbs Energy.
200 LSW @ about 775 is the target load for the 45. (266 fpe)
Keep shooting and reloading until you find the load you like best. Then keep shooting and reloading!
David
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Waywatcher
Member
I would really like to get a load with this bullet around 900fps, or maybe even 875fps. I will continue to try different powders and charges until I find one that is accurate, reliable, clean, and hopefully around 900fps.
David R
Member
Just drop back on the RED Dot. 4.6 grains?
David
David
OP
Waywatcher
Member
Yeah, I think I will drop to 4.6 grains of Red Dot.
I'm also thinking of trying 5.5 grains of Win 231.
Any input on 231 charge weights?
Lou_NC
Member
Hodgdon shows a starting load of 4.4 and a max of 5.6 of 231 for 200gr. LSWC. I'd start closer to 5.0 and check for reliable functioning.
Lou
David R
Member
I have gone as high as 6.1 of 231 with ok velocity using a 200 swc.
OP
Waywatcher
Member
Lyman shows a start load of 5.4 grains of Win 231.
Hodgdon shows a max load of 5.6 grains of Win 231.
I was splitting the (big) difference between these two sources.
Hodgdon shows a max load of 5.6 grains of Win 231.
I was splitting the (big) difference between these two sources.
chaparrito
Member
I load cast SWC or RN, over a soft Bullseye or H. Clays measure. No issues in my SW billboard 1911. I plunk test when the pistol is apart, but use a case gauge when loading. I load single stage and every round goes into a a case gauge before it goes in the box. Any that stick even a little get the Lee factory crimp die treatment, which always salvages them. Dillon makes the best case gauges AFAIC. I bought a 9mm Lyman recently at it's a ***.
fredj338
Member
Fwiw, Lyman's data on that is ****, must be a typo. Old Speer shows 4.5gr @ 831fps with soft swaged LSWC, pretty close to what I get in several 5" guns. As noted earlier, back it off to 4.5-4.6gr for 800fps+, comfortable target load.
Ball equiv is about 835fps with a 230gr. You'll be close with 4.6gr of RD under a 230gr LRN.
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Waywatcher
Member
After doing a lot of googling and searching, I'm leaning away from trying Win 231 for now and leaning towards giving Hodgdon Clays a whirl, starting around 4.0 grains. Monday will be the next time I can get to the range; I will be sure to update.
